Karnage84 Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 I was listening to a Lions-focused podcast and they were getting into the discussion about which players would be back next year and who wouldn't (as a cut or not re-signed) Here's the top 10 Lions with contracts in 2020 (Cap Hit; Dead Cap; Cap Savings) accroding to Over The Cap (OTC) Matthew Stafford - $31.5M; $26M; $5.5M - Status - Safe Trey Flowers - $16.739M; $43.581M; - $26.842M - Status - Safe Darius Slay - $13.4M; $2.9M; $10.5M - Status - On the bubble Rick Wagner - $11.9M; $5.8M; $6.1M - Status - On the bubble Damon Harrison - $11.75M; $5M; $6.75M - Status - On the bubble Taylor Decker - $10.35M; $0; $10,35M - Status - On the bubble Marvin Jones - $9.19M; $2.69M; $6.5M - Status - On the bubble Justin Coleman - $9.62M; $13.16M; - $4.1M - Status - Safe Devon Kennard - $7.175M; $1.75M; $5.4M - Status - On the bubble Jesse James - $5.27M; $8.26M; - $2.98m - Status - Safe Stafford is a guy that could still be traded next season. There's a $10M Dead Cap Hit which will open up $21.5M in cap space if he's a post-June 1st trade according to OTC. He's the best play on a poor team. New contracts and dead money make guys like Flowers, Coleman and James safe for now. Rick Wanger is likely going to be a post-June 1st cut candidate. The Lions need an upgrade at RT in a big way and he's just not cutting it. Changing the designation to after June 1st changes the equation to $2.9M in dead cap and $9M in new cap space. Snacks could also get the Rick Wagner treatment in a post June 1st cut. He's an aging veteran with a big contract and he isn't playing like the guy he was last year. It's unlikely that Decker will be off of the roster in 2020 but the writing is on the wall for him as well. Marvin is going to be 30 next season with a decent sized contract which expires at the end of the 2020 season. It's possible that the Lions make a similar trade like they did with Golden Tate. He's been a productive guy and one of the better players on the roster. Kennard is essentially the defensive equivalent to Marvin Jones. He's been one of the best players on his side of the ball. Both guys have low dead cap hits and would open up a good amount of cap room. You also have to make good decisions when replacing these guys and I'm not convinced that they have the pieces in place to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted November 4, 2019 Author Share Posted November 4, 2019 OFF-SEASON Wagner - Post- June 1st Cut - $2.9M Dead; Cap Space $9M Harrison - Post- June 1st Cut - $2.5M Dead Cap' Cap Space $9.25M 2019 Rollover - $18M 2020 New Cap Space - $18.25M 2020 Cap Space - $30.8M TOTAL CAP SPACE = $67.05M I have a hard time seeing either of these guys on the roster next season. Snacks is really going to have to turn things around in order to be back here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted November 4, 2019 Author Share Posted November 4, 2019 The next 10 TJ Hockenson - $4.5M; $16.2M; - $11.7M - Status - Safe Romeo Okwara - $4.1M; $1.8M; $2.2M - Status - On the bubble Matt Prater - $3.9M; $900k; $3M - Status - Safe Jarrad Davis - $3.4M; $3.4M; $0 - Status - On the bubble Frank Ragnow - $3.1M; $6.9M; - $3.74M - Status - Safe Kerryon Johnson - $1.77M; $1.4M; $368k - Status - Safe Jahlani Tavai - $1.5M; $3M; - $1.5M - Status - Safe Joe Dahl - $1.5M; $500k; $1M - Status - Safe Tracy Walker - $940k; $440k; $499k - Status - Safe Kenny Golladay - $930k; $179k; $940k - Status - Safe Guys like Hockenson, Ragnow and Tavai are super safe due to their draft position, cap hit and their future potential. Guys like Walker and Golladay are the ultimate in bargains and are super safe. Prater has been a staple of consistency since he arrived here from Denver. The Lions would be fools to let him go while he's still kicking at a top level. This leaves guys like Okwara, Davis and Dahl on the bubble. I doubt that Dahl goes anywhere as he's a depth player with starting experience. Okwara is also likely to be sticking around as there isn't a huge benefit to getting rid of him financially. Davis is the biggest question. He's not the answer at MLB. If he's open to being moved outside and utilized as a pass-rusher, we might be able to hold onto him and get some use out of our former 1st round pick. Otherwise, he's still young and we could see him get traded for a 4th or 5th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehardlionfan Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 They need a fix at MLB so I think Davis has a tough time sticking. the only one safe on the oline is Ragnow. Beyond him I expect two o linemen to be changed. Likely Wagner is gone. I think Harrison, Jones and Kennard are safe. I like what your doing here. Lots of players that can be upgraded or moved. The limiting factor is number of draft picks and who they can get in free agency. Also I doubt they change more than two on the oline and Wagner has to be one. Slay could be a good trade candidate however I only see that happening if they can find a replacement or they totally revamp the scheme applying more pressure on the QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted November 4, 2019 Author Share Posted November 4, 2019 21-38 Will Harris - Status - Safe Jalen Reeves-Maybin - Status - On the bubble Da'Shawn Hand - Status - Safe Jamal Agnew - Status - On the bubble Austin Bryant - Status - Safe Marvin Hall - Status - Safe Paul Perkins - Status - On the bubble Tyrell Crosby - Status - Safe Nick Bawden - Status - On the bubble Amani Oruwariye - Status - Safe Tra Carson - Status - On the bubble Ty Johnson - Status - Safe Beau Benzschawel - Status - Safe CJ Moore - Status - On the bubble Kevin Strong - Status - Safe John Atkins - Status - On the bubble David Blough - Status - On the bubble Sam Martin - Status - Safe None of these guys are overly costly and don't have large dead cap hits that would prevent the team from moving on. They also don't have huge contracts that would make sense to move on. All of the rookies should be considered safe. Harris is currently in a starting role, Bryant is just coming back from an injury, Ty Johnson has flashed at times in a committee. Oruwariye is still overcoming an injury. Marvin Hall is a guy that should be on this roster next season. He has been under utilized and has made some really nice plays for us. Perkins, Carson, Atkins, Blough are all guys that will probably not be here next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted November 4, 2019 Author Share Posted November 4, 2019 THE FREE AGENTS LIKELY TO BE BACK Kenny Wiggins Don Muhlbach Graham Glasgow JD McKissic Wiggins is likely going to go back to his role as a back-up but he does provide veteran experience and can play a couple different spots. Muhlbach is a given. Glasgow is a guy that the team has to re-sign. He's one of their better rated OL and has positional versatility. Letting go of Glasgow would be a step in the wrong direction for this OL. McKissic is the best RB in the current crop. All he has done here is make plays. He's Riddick 2.0 and is arguably a better runner. It'd be a bad move to let him walk. STRONG CONSIDERATION Rashaan Melvin Danny Amendola Mike Ford Tavon Wilson Michael Jackson Sr The secondary has not been as much of the issue with the defense as the issues on the DL and in the LB corp. Melvin has been a good player for us. As long as his contract isn't out of whack, he should be coming back for round 2. Ford and MJ are good depth guys. It might be time to let Tavon Wilson go but he's still contributing on the back end. Amendola has been a good contributor on this offense. He hasn't had as much work as a guy like Tate did but he has made plays for us when called upon. I could see him taking another 1 year contract with us. NOT COMING BACK Mike Daniels Jermaine Kearse A'Shawn Robinson Oday Aboushi Miles Killebrew Logan Thomas Darius Kilgo Jeff Driskel Steve Longa Dee Virgin Mike Daniels hasn't done anything up until this point. If we stay on the current track, he's not going to be on this roster for that money next year. A'Shawn seems to be looking for a payday. He could wind up in the "Strong Consideration" category but I don't know if the Lions value him enough to sign him to a big contract. There's always churning with depth guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimbaWho Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 (edited) Honestly man... Who frickin even cares... Like really... It wont' matter if they let Ricky Wagner go or save some cap space. These guys( Patricia/Quinn ) are idiots... Straight up. Arrogant A-holes really. No sugar coating it. Fords/Martha... doesn't care, Stadium sells out, people still watch, money still flows... Idk. You'll get it one day. The guys at the top just sucks on top of that so, any conversation like this is truly a moot point, waste of time. They need legit coaches/coaching, and a guy that knows what the hell he is doing. I sat here 6 months ago and told you they'd fail miserably if they drafted a TE at 8... An well... He's not even the best TE drafted.... He's not even a good blocker at all. They could of had Ed Oliver at 8. Made a real difference... instead we got a TE who right now is pretty average and not helping the team much. GREAT! A dude posting on the internet is smarter than the scouts and guys running the organization... Whippdy frickin do! Edited November 4, 2019 by SimbaWho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted November 4, 2019 Author Share Posted November 4, 2019 3 minutes ago, SimbaWho said: Honestly man... Who frickin even cares... Like really... It wont' matter if they let Ricky Wagner go or save some cap space. These guys( Patricia/Quinn ) are idiots... Straight up. Arrogant A-holes really. No sugar coating it. Fords/Martha... doesn't care, Stadium sells out, people still watch, money still flows... Idk. You'll get it one day. The guys at the top just sucks on top of that so, any conversation like this is truly a moot point, waste of time. They need legit coaches/coaching, and a guy that knows what the hell he is doing. I sat here 6 months ago and told you they'd fail miserably if they drafted a TE at 8... An well... He's not even the best TE drafted.... He's not even a good blocker at all. They could of had Ed Oliver at 8. Made a real difference... instead we got a TE who right now is pretty average and not helping the team much. GREAT! A dude posting on the internet is smarter than the scouts and guys running the organization... Whippdy frickin do! This is my resume for the Ford's so that I can take over as GM. Thanks for bursting that bubble.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimbaWho Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: This is my resume for the Ford's so that I can take over as GM. Thanks for bursting that bubble.... I fully support you taking over as long as you hire me as just an adviser or something. Win, lose, doesn't matter we'll have a great 4-5 years together! Edited November 4, 2019 by SimbaWho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted November 4, 2019 Author Share Posted November 4, 2019 10 minutes ago, SimbaWho said: Honestly man... Who frickin even cares... Like really... It wont' matter if they let Ricky Wagner go or save some cap space. These guys( Patricia/Quinn ) are idiots... Straight up. Arrogant A-holes really. No sugar coating it. Fords/Martha... doesn't care, Stadium sells out, people still watch, money still flows... Idk. You'll get it one day. The guys at the top just sucks on top of that so, any conversation like this is truly a moot point, waste of time. They need legit coaches/coaching, and a guy that knows what the hell he is doing. I sat here 6 months ago and told you they'd fail miserably if they drafted a TE at 8... An well... He's not even the best TE drafted.... He's not even a good blocker at all. They could of had Ed Oliver at 8. Made a real difference... instead we got a TE who right now is pretty average and not helping the team much. GREAT! A dude posting on the internet is smarter than the scouts and guys running the organization... Whippdy frickin do! According to PFF, here's how the rookie TE class is showing up so far. We all know what the deal is with rookie TE's. It's a position that takes time to develop into. Hock is already a top 3 guy in this grouping and he could wind up being the best of the bunch by a long shot when all is said and done. However, this is where we're at right now: OVERALL 1. Irv Smith 2. Foster Moreau (Called it) 3. TJ Hockenson 4. Dawson Knox 5. Drew Sample 6. Noah Fant RECEIVING 1. Moreau (Was not expecting this but no complaints) 2. Irv 3. Hockenson 4. Fant 5. Sample 6. Knox RUN BLOCKING 1. Knox 2. Irv 3. Hockenson 4. Moreau 5. Sample 6. Fant I will take credit for banging the drum on Foster Moreau. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted November 4, 2019 Author Share Posted November 4, 2019 And since you mentioned a guy like Oliver, here's a number of the guys we all spoke about as 1st round targets in order of PFF grade 1. Ed Oliver 2. Montez Sweat 3. TJ Hockenson 4. Chris Lindstrom 5. Devin Bush 6. Rashaan Gary The first three guys are by the thinnest of margins. Unlike with the TE group, there isn't really a clearcut winner there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nnivolcm Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Karnage84 said: And since you mentioned a guy like Oliver, here's a number of the guys we all spoke about as 1st round targets in order of PFF grade 1. Ed Oliver 2. Montez Sweat 3. TJ Hockenson 4. Chris Lindstrom 5. Devin Bush 6. Rashaan Gary The first three guys are by the thinnest of margins. Unlike with the TE group, there isn't really a clearcut winner there. If the margins are so razor thin, you go with positional value. TE is the position of least value between the 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BZski Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 I think JD, Snacks, Wagner, Slay will all be traded this offseason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superduperman Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 You didn't mention Quinn and Patricia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwiftPride Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 I think Patriots win Super Bowl this year, Brady retires, and they trade for Stafford to continue the dynasty. Lions clean house. Fords sell the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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