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VanS

If you didn't think Joe Burrow was a 1st rounder last year, why would you think he's one this year?

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I know who EXACTLY Burrow is reminding of this year: Andrew Luck. Nigh-flawless play, top accuracy, with a good arm, and more mobile than you think.,

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Lamar Jackson sucks. I say that because he was awful his first season in the NFL. My mind is made up and nothing is going to change it.

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8 hours ago, VanS said:

All I know is Brees wasn't a Hall of Fame caliber before being paired with Sean Payton.  When he's not in a dome he tends to see his numbers fall.  And his physical tools aren't too impressive.  All that leads me to think he's helped more by the system than being the one that makes it.

Wins matter when you're the one carrying a team on your back like Lamar Jackson.  When your team doesn't miss a beat when you are out with injury then maybe you're not as important to those wins as we previously thought.  The Saints succeeding without Brees leads me to question just how good he really is.

Or maybe Bridgewater is a lot better than most people give him credit for.

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6 hours ago, Tetsujin said:

I know who EXACTLY Burrow is reminding of this year: Andrew Luck. Nigh-flawless play, top accuracy, with a good arm, and more mobile than you think.,

Luck was legit from his freshman year on so to me that makes them pretty different.  Maybe it was just lack of opportunity but clearly Burrow did not win the job as a freshman or do much of note.  Also Luck is a better athlete and has a thicker stronger lower body.  Both are tough yes but Luck is a little better in the pocket and is physically larger and heavier.  And sure people might underrate Joe Burrow as an athlete but anyone that did not know Luck was a fine athlete was not paying attention, guy had over 400 yards rushing in one year and did it a ton in college and was a very good running in space early in his career.  

Also Burrow has far superior talent to Luck in terms of receivers, sure Luck had a fine OL and TEs but the receivers were just ok, Chase and Jefferson on LSU are star receivers and some of the best in the nation.  

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2 hours ago, Ozzy said:

Luck was legit from his freshman year on so to me that makes them pretty different.  Maybe it was just lack of opportunity but clearly Burrow did not win the job as a freshman or do much of note.  Also Luck is a better athlete and has a thicker stronger lower body.  Both are tough yes but Luck is a little better in the pocket and is physically larger and heavier.  And sure people might underrate Joe Burrow as an athlete but anyone that did not know Luck was a fine athlete was not paying attention, guy had over 400 yards rushing in one year and did it a ton in college and was a very good running in space early in his career. 

Because Urban Meyer was foolish enough to have J.T. Barrett start ahead of him?

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14 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Because Urban Meyer was foolish enough to have J.T. Barrett start ahead of him?

Foolish?  Not sure I would call Urban Meyer foolish, JT Barrett sure is a joke of a QB now, but as a freshman kid was a stud, had over 2800 yards passing, almost 1000 yards rushing and 45 TDs total.  Got hit a lot later in his career and lost some of that athletic ability and his arm seemed to get worse the longer he played which is odd.  But kid was a stud as a young player and Joe Burrow simply could not beat him out, if Burrow was better at the time he would have played simple as that.  Same with Haskins, if Burrow was better than him he would have won the job, did not, so moved on and it has worked out great for him clearly.  

 

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2 hours ago, Ozzy said:

Foolish?  Not sure I would call Urban Meyer foolish, JT Barrett sure is a joke of a QB now, but as a freshman kid was a stud, had over 2800 yards passing, almost 1000 yards rushing and 45 TDs total.  Got hit a lot later in his career and lost some of that athletic ability and his arm seemed to get worse the longer he played which is odd.  But kid was a stud as a young player and Joe Burrow simply could not beat him out, if Burrow was better at the time he would have played simple as that.  Same with Haskins, if Burrow was better than him he would have won the job, did not, so moved on and it has worked out great for him clearly.  

Yes.  The best thing you could say about JT Barrett was that he didn't turn the ball over, and he kept the chains moving.  Either way, we're getting further from the point.  Burrow came to Ohio State the year after JT Barrett was named the starter.  Burrow redshirted, which would have been Barrett's second year in the program.  A RS freshman isn't going to unseat a two-year starter, and he was redshirted and they opted to go with Cardale Jones.  And then JT Barrett returned from injury, and they went back to him.  That's not an indictment on Joe Burrow.

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13 hours ago, Ozzy said:

Luck was legit from his freshman year on so to me that makes them pretty different.  Maybe it was just lack of opportunity but clearly Burrow did not win the job as a freshman or do much of note.  Also Luck is a better athlete and has a thicker stronger lower body.  Both are tough yes but Luck is a little better in the pocket and is physically larger and heavier.  And sure people might underrate Joe Burrow as an athlete but anyone that did not know Luck was a fine athlete was not paying attention, guy had over 400 yards rushing in one year and did it a ton in college and was a very good running in space early in his career.  

Also Burrow has far superior talent to Luck in terms of receivers, sure Luck had a fine OL and TEs but the receivers were just ok, Chase and Jefferson on LSU are star receivers and some of the best in the nation.  

Luck was my favorite QB prospect ever. Of course there are differences. Luck was the better athlete, and his body was more developed than Burrow's. Burrow doesn't look like he's spent a lot of time in the weightroom. Luck also played in a power run offense (~60% run/pass) with a lot of pro-style heavy formations and made a living throwing to some talented TE's from said heavy formations. The WR's were good but not special. But I don't recall a single game from Luck as impressive as going into Tuscaloosa in beating a team like Bama. I don't think Stanford beat a Top 10 opponent when Luck was there.

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Well for starters I used my eyes to watch him play and can see the plays he makes this season. Perhaps box score scouting isn't the way to go.

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I knew right away this had to be VanS with his terrible QB scouting that only traits matter.

QB is an intelligence position. Some QBs will never understand highly complex things within the football world. Joe Burrow has shown extreme intelligence this year and is an absolute master at reading coverage pre snap and post snap. He makes his progressions probably better than anyone in this class. And he has fantastic pocket awareness and handles pressure well.

College production matters for QBs because it shows they are processing information extremely well and professing it fast.

Edited by BayRaider

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I have watched almost every Burrow game this year, because I knew early on the Bengals would be picking a QB at some point. As I watched I was saying "where did this guy come from". His most impressive trait is his ability to move in a pocket thats collapsing around him while keeping his eyes downfield. He is a gamer. You don't have to have the best arm, best legs, etc. But all great QBs have the ability to move within/outside the pocket and extend plays. He will be the #1 pick and he will be a Bengal.

#blow4burrow

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He reminds me of Tom Brady. This posture and release are almost identical. Of course I’m not expecting him to become the GOAT, but that is my best comp in regards to his fundamentals. He’s much more mobile though and his release isn’t legendarily quick (but that’s a tough criticism of any college QB). There’s always some risk with college QB prospects but I do think that Burrow has as good of a chance as any from this class to be a franchise QB.

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Burrow seems like an all or nothing NFL prospect.  Either he'll be an effective starter as a rookie, or never take a snap and be out of the league in 2 years.

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Easy answer: he progressed 

Not every prospect is going to be a 1st rounder as a Freshman or Sophomore or even Junior 

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1 hour ago, smokeybandit said:

Burrow seems like an all or nothing NFL prospect.  Either he'll be an effective starter as a rookie, or never take a snap and be out of the league in 2 years.

Interesting. I guess I vibe the other way with him. I think that his intangibles, leadership, intelligence, and accuracy make him arguably the safest guy and that he has the lowest ceiling since he isn't elite physically in any area. He's got a solid but not great arm, average size, is at best a plus athlete, and turns 23 in December.

He could be 2019 Kirk Cousins, Pro Bowler

or

He could be Drew Stanton...NFL Journeyman on a roster for a decade/capable backup.

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