EvilenFroggen Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 15 minutes ago, DannyB said: Too bad the king’s stinking son fired Miracle Max. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyB Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 26 minutes ago, DaveDX said: Too bad the king’s stinking son fired Miracle Max. Kroenke secretly visits Lincoln Riley in Norman... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 (edited) Goff is just an extension of McVay more so than any Coach-QB in the league, this isn’t on Goff. McVay has no idea how to adjust and Bill exposed him to the world. McVay is the new Mike Tomlin... It’s not that McVay is an offensive genius, I mean hes a very very good coach with a great understanding of offensive football, but he runs the same scheme that originated from Jay Gruden in Washington. Both have their own spins on it, but McVays unique wrinkles and touches has mostly stayed stagnant and well figured out. I’ve always thought Kyle is much more creative at scheming guys open and his vast understanding of all defenses. Kyle also adjusts. Basically the tree is: Bill Walsh > Mike Holgren> Jon Gruden > Jay Gruden > Kyle Shanahan/Sean McVay It’s all the same offensive scheme. Think of like literal evolution. It changes each generation. Reid and Gruden are the main disciples of Holgren but both had very different philosophies and concepts, although it’s still the same scheme down to it’s core. McVays and Kyles version are the most evolved. However, Kyles version is probably the most effective, but McVays take on the scheme has been mostly figured out to a T. Good coaches are embarrassing him this year. Gruden and Reid are also still constantly working on their versions of the offense to this day. Both men really love this game. It’s really hard and tiring to have an effective offense that long, the creativity and absolute passion those two have is relentless. I probably didn’t do the greatest job explaining this, but the point is McVay needs to go to the drawing board this off season and completely revamp his offense. Keep the core, and some foundations, but most of it needs to be completely redone. This post was not a spite on McVay. I love that guy, super nice, very good energy, and a great coach. Edited November 26, 2019 by BayRaider 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyMossIsBoss Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 I'm sure a decent OL to go along with a long look in the mirror from wunderkind Sean McVay can "fix" him. Should find out sooner or later if Henderson can be a dynamic back, otherwise might want to start looking. Yeah you're stuck w/ Gurley and will probably keep giving him carries since why not, but an explosive playmaker in the backfield like pre-arhtitis Gurley may very well have been the spark for the McVay offense... but first things first, get a respectable OL or it won't matter who is running or passing behind that line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
showtime Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 13 minutes ago, BayRaider said: Goff is just an extension of McVay more so than any Coach-QB in the league, this isn’t on Goff. McVay has no idea how to adjust and Bill exposed him to the world. McVay is the new Mike Tomlin... These guys are all overrated and crowned too early. There's a reason why true greatness is sustained over a period of time, not one or two seasons. But why isn't this on Goff? I agree that McVay got exposed in the Superbowl and he should carry a lot weight, but so should Goff. McVay isn't the one out there who has 0 TD passes in his last couple games with INTs. Goff is the one out there throwing the football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 Just now, showtime said: These guys are all overrated and crowned too early. There's a reason why true greatness is sustained over a period of time, not one or two seasons. But why isn't this on Goff? I agree that McVay got exposed in the Superbowl and he should carry a lot weight, but so should Goff. McVay isn't the one out there who has 0 TD passes in his last couple games with INTs. Goff is the one out there throwing the football. Agree not all is on McVay by any means and Goff needs his fair share. But most of this is on McVays version of the scheme being figured out and being easily predictable. He’s been destroyed by great coaches this season after Bill showed how to cover and scheme against all his wrinkles and takes on the offense, great coaches like Kyle Shanahan, John Harbaugh, and Pete Carroll (close game because of way less talent). They didn’t do exactly what Bill did but he opened the very general blueprint on McVay’s version. Back to Goff, it’s very hard to be good when the defense knows what you’re doing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
showtime Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 1 minute ago, BayRaider said: Agree not all is on McVay by any means and Goff needs his fair share. But most of this is on McVays version of the scheme being figured out and being easily predictable. He’s been destroyed by great coaches this season after Bill showed how to cover and scheme against all his wrinkles and takes on the offense, great coaches like Kyle Shanahan, John Harbaugh, and Pete Carroll (close game because of way less talent). They didn’t do exactly what Bill did but he opened the very general blueprint on McVay’s version. Back to Goff, it’s very hard to be good when the defense knows what you’re doing. Look at how much money they paid Goff. They didn't really have much of a choice because you can't let a QB who is that young and just had that type of season walk, but it doesn't look so good. And Gurley's contract is absolutely dreadful. They've made some really bad/questionable decisions with some signings AND they have limited draft picks. I don't really see how things get much better over the next few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerbyRam Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 He needs support from the OL. He's getting less than half the time to throw the ball than what he had last season, half the time for our WRs to get down the field and create separation. It's like being run by a kid on Madden - it's okay having these high profile skill players, but you need to build it on something that doesn't get knocked down with anything more than the force of the wind. A 100 snaps against our OL, I think I'd get at least 5 sacks and I've never even played the game in my entire life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBLIII Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 He simply came back down to earth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMG5 Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 2 hours ago, showtime said: Look at how much money they paid Goff. They didn't really have much of a choice because you can't let a QB who is that young and just had that type of season walk, but it doesn't look so good. And Gurley's contract is absolutely dreadful. They've made some really bad/questionable decisions with some signings AND they have limited draft picks. I don't really see how things get much better over the next few years. This. I'm not sure how they can build up their trenches with limited draft capital and dwindling cap space. They've already paid so many skill position players. Not to mention the Ramsey contract this offseason. He's going to get $20M per year, so that's even less money they will have to spend on OL/DL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danand Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 Great oline and ability to run to set up the pass Bad oline and no ability to run to set up the pass That little difference is what happens almost very single time an offense struggles. There are very few QB's who can work well without an above average oline, and who operates well outside of structure. Goff isn't one of them. He is a system QB who can be very good in that system. If GM's where as keen on constantly making boring draft picks and FA aquisitions as they are bringing in "playmakers", we would see less bad olines. (although there is only so much oline talent to go around) The bills did it right this year. Just bringing in everyone to get something working. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patriotsheatyan Posted November 26, 2019 Author Share Posted November 26, 2019 What can they get for Ramsey in the off season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanS Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 1 hour ago, SBLIII said: He simply came back down to earth Or he's back to being who he really was all along instead of that temporary mirage. I thought Goff was a bust before the 2016 draft. In his rookie year he was exactly what I expected. I didn't buy into the mirage Sean McVay created the last 2 years. And now Goff is back to being who he really always was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOTN-93 Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Danand said: Great oline and ability to run to set up the pass Bad oline and no ability to run to set up the pass That little difference is what happens almost very single time an offense struggles. There are very few QB's who can work well without an above average oline, and who operates well outside of structure. Goff isn't one of them. He is a system QB who can be very good in that system. If GM's where as keen on constantly making boring draft picks and FA aquisitions as they are bringing in "playmakers", we would see less bad olines. (although there is only so much oline talent to go around) The bills did it right this year. Just bringing in everyone to get something working. This. 2019 Kirk Cousins is an example of this going the other way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patriotsheatyan Posted November 26, 2019 Author Share Posted November 26, 2019 (edited) 36 minutes ago, KOTN-93 said: This. 2019 Kirk Cousins is an example of this going the other way Cousins in his controversial season last year had 30 touchdowns and 10 interceptions with 4300 yards. Goff is on pace for 4300 yards with 16 touchdowns and 17 interceptions. Cousins completion percentage was 70% and Goff is at 61% right now. What happened with Cousins isn’t that unbelievable as it just amounts to a QB going from good to elite numbers. Goff on the other hand has gone from elite numbers to near the bottom in efficiency. What’s happened with Goff is way more dramatic. Edited November 26, 2019 by patriotsheatyan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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