The Jason Garrett GTFO Thread: He’s Gone

[Rtnldave]

On 11/29/2019 at 5:13 PM, Calvert28 said:

You know we've had this conversation before and it's the same now as it was before. So because Jerry wanted credit for building the 90s dynasty, jimmy has to sit quietly while the boss who doesnt know football take the credit? 

I'm surprised you dont work for Jerry Matt's, you obviously would make a great Yes Man giving all of your ideas and hard work to you're boss. Except we would still be in 2019, with an embarrassment for a coach and the rest of us here would still be calling for JG and people like you to be kicked out on your keester.

Jerry could have been Robert Kraft without the "illegal" happy endings, being able to say I hired Jimmy Johnson to do what he does best and I helped rebuild the image of Americas team. And no one, even Jimmy would be able to say otherwise. Except what Jerry wanted was greater say in all positions on the team and jimmy wasnt going to relinquish that freedom and that's where the problems started. And why? Because Jerry wanted more credit and the bigger spotlight, it's all been about Jerry. 

Our 90s dynasty was ruined because of Jerry, not Jimmy despite your brainwashed outlook. Jerry could have left it alone like Robert Kraft with BB and we may have dominated the 90s. We will never know, but what we do know is that 25 years later we still have achieved nothing worth a damn because Jerry wants to be right for once. 

But hey that's ok with you, cause according to you, jerry deserves all the praise but half the blame at most when things go down hill. 

Bill Parcells was a bit of the same way except when he accepted all the credit, he had no problem accepting all the blame too. Not like the guy says things like "we have to make a change in order to do what's best for this team" while not removing the key factor of all those things holding back the team which was himself. 

For all your talk about being frustrated with this teams lack of progress, let's be honest. This is fine with you, because JG is still the HC and we are heading to another 8-8 season. And that's ok with you cause that's what Jerry wants right? We may see Zeke, Dak, Cooper, Jaylon, Martin, all of our all-pro talent waste their careers here like our previous all-pros but hey that's ok because its Jerry's team and he should get what he wants right?

Talk all the BS you want but the one man show routine got old years and years ago. You talk about Jimmy's ego, well fans gave it a pass because Jimmy bavked it up with results. Jerry has never accomplished what Jimmy has done. Saying Jerry was responsible for building that dynasty is like saying JP Morgan is responsible for inventing the light bulb. Its f%&king stupid but at least in Morgans defense, he at least knew how to not waste the invention when he got it. 

Jerry is still shocking himself like a moron trying to make it work again.

Wow, this sounds so.......familiar. I believe I wrote something very similar early on.

But I applaud your opinion and agree 1000 %.

 

[eagles suck]

1 hour ago, Rtnldave said:

Wow, this sounds so.......familiar. I believe I wrote something very similar early on.

But I applaud your opinion and agree 1000 %.

 

I get the whole Jimmy Johnson narrative with the 90s team. I give him credit, but you also have to give Jerry credit for allowing these trades and having a open wallet as far as the salary cap. When Johnson left the league already implemented the salary cap which put the Cowboys under deep water . Jimmy could not work his magic with Miami as we all know. Jimmy was a great talent evaluator just like Garrett. Jimmy was just a much better coach. If you give Jimmy credit you have to give Jerry credit for being the GM

[Matts4313]

7 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

No you just heavily implied it before and this was like a year ago or so that we had this conversation. You made it clear that Jimmy was at least at half fault for even fighting to retain his authority over the roster which he was justified in doing so. So yes thats what you are saying. 1-0

"at half fault for even fighting to retain his authority over the roster"

Do you even read what I am writing? I said he was 50/50 at fault for him leaving Dallas. Not for roster control. YOU CANT MAKE UP YOUR OWN ARGUMENT AND ASSIGN IT TO ME.

7 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

Really? I have heard you defend Jerry and JG on multiple occasions this year included that its the fault of the other coaches and players for not getting the job done, essentially absolving JG of any blame.

You mean I believe in a team game its normally bigger than just 1 person? Than sure. Yes I do believe that. 

7 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

Jerry just now you put  "at least 50% of the blame" on Jimmy when Jerry was trying to steal his credit for building the team which everyone saw from day one of the split as being Jerry's fault for being too power hungry. Yes you are the perfect Yes man for Jerry. 2-0

This statement is so dumb imo. Their break up was much, much bigger than "who gets credit". This isnt a 5th grade science project. And once again, you are assigning your interpretation of the events to me. Stop doing that.

7 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

LMAO and you call me a strawman? This alone proves you think Jerry has done nothing wrong, Jimmy has dined and entertained plenty of people he disliked and Jerry was a personal friend of his. Jerry is not Robert Kraft, Kraft has stayed almost entirely out of Bill's process of doing things and they are easily the most successful franchise in football history. Jerry did not stay out of it, not only did he want Jimmy to acknowledge him in the media as being the architect of the resurgence of the franchise, he also wanted the last word with personell decisions on the roster. 

Legit curious in which ways did Jerry *actually* undermine Jimmy with his "last word"? Did it ever happen? Or did you think they broke up over a hypothetical?

7 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

I mean you actually think Jimmy would exclude one of his best friends just to be a d!ck?

Well, he did. Are you disputing that?

7 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

 Sorry Jimmy is notorious for not only being egotistical but being a very likeable and relatable person.

As opposed to Jerry?

7 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

He just did not want to be a puppet and that's basically what Jerry was wanting.

Link? Do you have any source in the entire world who can back this claim? Or did you make this up?

7 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

If Jimmy was every bit the ego maniac who didn't want to share any type of glory with anyone else he would have had a more Parcells like approach to things where he took all the credit. But that's not what happened, anyone who was old enough back then and not senile like some are now knows that Jimmy was sharing the spotlight. With Jerry, with Emmitt, with Aikman, Haley, especially Irvin. He didn't mind it one bit, Jerry had other ideas though. 

What "other ideas"? And I dont want your opinion, I want you to link sources that covered the Cowboys. Articles from back then would be even better.

7 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

Again you are a Jerry Yes Man. And a JG man at least up until like the last couple of games. I mean dont lose faith now brother, believe like Jerry im sure Redball is gonna come through for us any year now by advancing beyond the 2nd round of the playoffs. I mean whats another 10 years right? You obviously havent minded Jerry's 25+ way of doing things.

Calvert => I challenge you. For once in your 15 years here, provide evidence to anything you have said. Stop talking out of your arse. I will do the same. Until then, you can continue on with this clown show. 

[Matts4313]

2 hours ago, Rtnldave said:

Wow, this sounds so.......familiar. I believe I wrote something very similar early on.

But I applaud your opinion and agree 1000 %.

 

Can you back up any of his/yours *opinions* with sources/links/facts?

[Rtnldave]

1 hour ago, Matts4313 said:

Can you back up any of his/yours *opinions* with sources/links/facts?

How about two 13-3 seasons and nothing to show for it? Source/Link/Fact

[Matts4313]

29 minutes ago, Rtnldave said:

How about two 13-3 seasons and nothing to show for it? Source/Link/Fact

I think that it states nothing to confirm nor refute anything that I or Calvert said - was a completely off topic and a nonsensical response to the topic at hand.

 

Want to try again?

[Calvert28]

2 hours ago, Matts4313 said:

"at half fault for even fighting to retain his authority over the roster"

Do you even read what I am writing? I said he was 50/50 at fault for him leaving Dallas. Not for roster control. YOU CANT MAKE UP YOUR OWN ARGUMENT AND ASSIGN IT TO ME.

 

Then you have you no clue what your arguing about and should just stop.

Then entire reason that lead to Jerry kicking Jimmy out on his a$$ was because Jimmy did not want to give up control of the roster. That is fact, every power struggle decision made from Jerry's encroachment was due to that fact, I was arguing facts.

And yet you still want to beat around the bush and project while going full strawman yourself while picking and choosing arguments. 

Argue the one point in bold without sidestepping to some dinner party, or w/e cockamamie idea that you come up with to not have to address the real issue. 

[Matts4313]

3 minutes ago, Calvert28 said:

Then you have you no clue what your arguing about and should just stop.

Then entire reason that lead to Jerry kicking Jimmy out on his a$$ was because Jimmy did not want to give up control of the roster. That is fact, every power struggle decision made from Jerry's encroachment was due to that fact, I was arguing facts.

And yet you still want to beat around the bush and project while going full strawman yourself while picking and choosing arguments. 

Argue the one point in bold without sidestepping to some dinner party, or w/e cockamamie idea that you come up with to not have to address the real issue. 

Im tired of you spouting your opinions without backing up any of your claims. Can you provide any sources?  Because I gave you an entire timeline that is verifiable. You responded with a bunch of "old man yelling at the clouds" 

[Matts4313]

I just when through 4 articles and 3 different google variations of "Jimmy/Jerry/Roster/Control"

I found 0 @Calvert28. So it appears you are lying. 

Edited December 1, 2019 by Matts4313

[Calvert28]

26 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

I just when through 4 articles and 3 different google variations of "Jimmy/Jerry/Roster/Control"

I found 0 @Calvert28. So it appears you are lying. 

?????? I'm not sure if you're being deliberately obtuse but "control" and the term "power struggle" came up all over google when I typed in "Jerry jones jimmy johnson control"

Unless you were living under a rock Matts all you have to do is look at the evidence. 

As you said and everyone knows, Jimmy is an ego maniac. That ego maniac required full control over all roster decisions. Then rumors started swirling that Jerry wanted a "greater say" or "final say" in those roster decisions which lead to Jimmy firing back.

At which point in this now famous quote by Jerry Jones said at the owners meeting in 94 which got published "500 coaches could have won a SB with this team".

Shortly after that "amicable parting of the ways happened" that was "at worst 50% Jimmy's fault" cause we all know how easy going Jerry is and how he has no problem letting coaches, coach.

Now here comes the biggest piece of evidence like @Rtnldave said has been since 1994 onwards till what may be the last few years. 2 playoff wins since 1995 when Switzer and Jerry demolished Jimmy's team which lead to Jerry admitting he would have fired any other GM with the results he has had in a interview done back in 2012. And the reason he couldnt? Well be "he" was that GM.........how do you not see that it was because of a power struggle with 25+ years of evidence?

Again stop sidetracking, side stepping and BSing to just not have to say you were wrong Matts. 

[Matts4313]

7 minutes ago, Calvert28 said:

?????? I'm not sure if you're being deliberately obtuse but "control" and the term "power struggle" came up all over google when I typed in "Jerry jones jimmy johnson control"

Unless you were living under a rock Matts all you have to do is look at the evidence. 

As you said and everyone knows, Jimmy is an ego maniac. That ego maniac required full control over all roster decisions. Then rumors started swirling that Jerry wanted a "greater say" or "final say" in those roster decisions which lead to Jimmy firing back.

At which point in this now famous quote by Jerry Jones said at the owners meeting in 94 which got published "500 coaches could have won a SB with this team".

Shortly after that "amicable parting of the ways happened" that was "at worst 50% Jimmy's fault" cause we all know how easy going Jerry is and how he has no problem letting coaches, coach.

Now here comes the biggest piece of evidence like @Rtnldave said has been since 1994 onwards till what may be the last few years. 2 playoff wins since 1995 when Switzer and Jerry demolished Jimmy's team which lead to Jerry admitting he would have fired any other GM with the results he has had in a interview done back in 2012. And the reason he couldnt? Well be "he" was that GM.........how do you not see that it was because of a power struggle with 25+ years of evidence?

Again stop sidetracking, side stepping and BSing to just not have to say you were wrong Matts. 

Please post sources. Please post quotes. 

Your opinion is warped, so I am looking for not your rants, but actual sources. Like the one @TVScout provided showing that Jimmy wanted retire from football because he wanted to fish. Not because of a "power struggle". Which you ignored.

 

Common theme going on: You ignoring *FACTS* and responding with your *OPINION*

Edited December 1, 2019 by Matts4313

[Calvert28]

2 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

Please post sources. Please post quotes. 

Your opinion is warped, so I am looking for not your rants, but actual sources. Like the one @TVScout provided showing that Jimmy wanted retire from football because he wanted to fish. Not because of a "power struggle". Which you ignored.

 

Common theme going on: You ignoring *FACTS* and responding with your *OPINION*

25+ years with total control as GM. 

You: "That's not enough evidence that he wanted total control over the roster"

It's ok Matt's, you dont have to admit you're wrong. Everyone including Jerry and Jimmy knows you're wrong so you just stay nice and snug under that rock.

[Matts4313]

Just now, Calvert28 said:

25+ years with total control as GM. 

You: "That's not enough evidence that he wanted total control over the roster"

It's ok Matt's, you dont have to admit you're wrong. Everyone including Jerry and Jimmy knows you're wrong so you just stay nice and snug under that rock.

IE => You have no source or facts to back up your opinion. Got it. And you are changing the subject from "Why did Jerry/Jimmy divorce" to "What has Jerry done without Jimmy". Got it.

 

Just admit you hate Jerry, you are supremely biased, and we can move on. I dont debate with Plan about Jerry. You know why? Because I understand his stance. His vitriol is so deep he wont buy merchandise until Jerry dies. Should I lump you in that group?

[Calvert28]

1 minute ago, Matts4313 said:

IE => You have no source or facts to back up your opinion. Got it. And you are changing the subject from "Why did Jerry/Jimmy divorce" to "What has Jerry done without Jimmy". Got it.

 

Just admit you hate Jerry, you are supremely biased, and we can move on. I dont debate with Plan about Jerry. You know why? Because I understand his stance. His vitriol is so deep he wont buy merchandise until Jerry dies. Should I lump you in that group?

25+ years with total control as GM. 

You: "That's not enough evidence that he wanted total control over the roster"

I need to find myself a rock! Must be great to be so bliss ignoring everything that you dont want to face. 

[Matts4313]

4 minutes ago, Calvert28 said:

25+ years with total control as GM. 

You: "That's not enough evidence that he wanted total control over the roster"

I need to find myself a rock! Must be great to be so bliss ignoring everything that you dont want to face. 

THE DEBATE IS WHY DID JERRY AND JIMMY DIVORCE. FOLLOW ALONG. 

Jerry didnt even become GM until about the time Jimmy Quit. QUIT.

Provide sources for your opinion, or you are lying/confused. If you had sources, you would have shut me up by now.