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Skippy

Is it time to switch to a 4-3 defense?

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Alright, but nobody is acknowledging the fact that the advantage is now for 4-3 defenses.

When it comes to 3-4 and 4-3, you’re right, it’s not about the base, but the fact remains that it is now easier to find pieces that work in a 4-3 than a 3-4 because the majority of NFL teams run a 3-4 now.

It’s pretty damn hard these days to find an elite 3-4 DE, and it’s pretty tough to be an elite 3-4 without an elite 3-4 DE.  
 

Cameron Heywards don’t grow on trees.  
 

When you think about it, are we missing anything the Steelers have EXCEPT for that 3-4 DE?  We have Lowry there.  The Vikings have Linval Joseph and Shamar Stephen.  If we’re expecting Lowry to be Shamar Stephen and not Cameron Heyward, we’re gonna have a better time.  
 

Am I making bad points here?  

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I remember pleasing my case for this in like 2015 or something and it held up even less then than it does now.  When we switched from a 4-3 to a 3-4, there were less than 10 teams who played a 3-4.  
 

And I really don’t like when people say it’s the same thing.  It’s not.  I know nobody will buy it, but there’s a difference.  3-4 you’ve got your EDGE defenders standing up away from the ball and 4-3 they’ve got their hands in the dirt nose to nose with the OL.  THAT is what I want.  When the majority of teams play a 3-4 and you see that the majority of games, majority of practice, you get better at defending against it.  
 

I know it’s tinfoil hat level stuff, but I still believe it.  Adding to my conspiracy theory is how much Brady struggles against 4-3 defenses opposed to 3-4 when everybody knows it takes interior pressure to beat him.  

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1 minute ago, Outpost31 said:

Alright, but nobody is acknowledging the fact that the advantage is now for 4-3 defenses.

When it comes to 3-4 and 4-3, you’re right, it’s not about the base, but the fact remains that it is now easier to find pieces that work in a 4-3 than a 3-4 because the majority of NFL teams run a 3-4 now.

It’s pretty damn hard these days to find an elite 3-4 DE, and it’s pretty tough to be an elite 3-4 without an elite 3-4 DE.  
 

Cameron Heywards don’t grow on trees.  
 

When you think about it, are we missing anything the Steelers have EXCEPT for that 3-4 DE?  We have Lowry there.  The Vikings have Linval Joseph and Shamar Stephen.  If we’re expecting Lowry to be Shamar Stephen and not Cameron Heyward, we’re gonna have a better time.  
 

Am I making bad points here?  

4-3 DEs and 3-4 OLBs are basically the same thing at this point. There's no real advantage one way or another with edge rushers.

If you want to play a defense where your DL are going to need to play over a gap, you're going to need longer bodies. That's independent of an odd or even front. 

It's harder to find a competent DL than a competent ILB, but that's an argument against the 3-1, not the 2-4 or 4-2.

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2 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

4-3 DEs and 3-4 OLBs are basically the same thing at this point. There's no real advantage one way or another with edge rushers

I do not agree with that as I said in the post immediately after.  I hate the way it looks with EDGE rushers standing up away from the line opposed to on the line.  I feel like it gives the OL a fraction of a second advantage.  I also have a tinfoil theory that’s why Gary is struggling.  Did he do this in college?  

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I also suspect Perry would have had a better career as a 4-3 end.  He even said leading up to the draft he wanted to be a 4-3 end.  You don’t say that entering the draft when hundreds of thousands of dollars are on the line if it’s not important to you.

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3-4 seems to be about disguise and trickery rather than lining up and saying exactly what you’re gonna do and do it.  I prefer the latter.  I don’t like this other BS.

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6 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

I also suspect Perry would have had a better career as a 4-3 end.  He even said leading up to the draft he wanted to be a 4-3 end.  You don’t say that entering the draft when hundreds of thousands of dollars are on the line if it’s not important to you.

Is Perry still working out up there in Green Bay? Off topic, but this is about the time of year he would be petting his club. 

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There isn't a difference anymore. Defenses are shifting to offensive philosophy of personnel groupings, not base alignments. We need more talent on the DL and ILB group not a scheme change.

 

Our base package puts Clark, Lowry, Lancaster, Smith, Smith on the LOS. Not sure how our run defense improves by removing a fatty and adding a SAM/WILL 5 yards off the ball.

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19 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

I do not agree with that as I said in the post immediately after.  I hate the way it looks with EDGE rushers standing up away from the line opposed to on the line.  I feel like it gives the OL a fraction of a second advantage.  I also have a tinfoil theory that’s why Gary is struggling.  Did he do this in college?  

What do you mean "away from the line"? They're lined up with their toes on the line.

Gary is taking half of his snaps out of a 3 point stance anyway. He had all the issues he's having now, in college.

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Just now, AlexGreen#20 said:

What do you mean "away from the line"? They're lined up with their toes on the line.

Gary is taking half of his snaps out of a 3 point stance anyway. He had all the issues he's having now, in college.

They look further away.  And they’re standing up.  

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I’m not crazy, I’m just a little bit crazy.  I don’t like the way a 3-4 looks.  I don’t.  Don’t tell me it’s the same if it looks different.  

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1 minute ago, Outpost31 said:

They look further away.  And they’re standing up.  

They're not further away. Both even and odd fronts are running out of 7 techniques most snaps.

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1 minute ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

They're not further away. Both even and odd fronts are running out of 7 techniques most snaps.

They look further away.  

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2 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

I’m not crazy, I’m just a little bit crazy.  I don’t like the way a 3-4 looks.  I don’t.  Don’t tell me it’s the same if it looks different.  

The 3-4 and the 4-3 aren't the same.

The 3-4 is a 7, 5, 1, 3, 7 with LBs playing 10 and 50. 

The 4-3 is a 7, 1, 3, 7 with LBs playing 50, 10, and 50. 

The 4-2 and the 2-4 which are the nickel variations most frequently played are the same.

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