Are we witnessing "Zombie Brady"?

[SBLIII]

4 minutes ago, Starless said:

He's going to keep declining. It might not be quick but teams are going to be wary of that. And that list is bigger for me. 

yup he has been declining every year since 2017. 3 years in a row now. I wouldn't give him more than a 1 year deal as a GM.

[jofos]

How does anyone know how much Brady has or has not done to try to get Harry up to speed? 

Two of the last three games the weather has been horrible that kind of effects thing a bit.

How many throws did Brady miss last night? 

[mission27]

tbh I’m a bit reminded of the 2010-2013 period the last time everyone said Brady was declining and done:

2010: 111.0 passer rating 

2011: 105.6

2012: 98.7

2013: 87.3

And

2016: 112.2 passer rating

2017: 102.8

2018: 97.7

2019: 88.2

people freaked out in 2013 and the beginning of 2014

really though what was the issue? 

Brady lost a bunch of his top receivers who he had a lot of trust in over the course of a couple of years (starting with Moss, Welker, Aaron Hernandez, Deion Branch) and Gronk was hurt, which left him throwing to guys like Edelman, LaFell, and Amendola who he’d never played with and had no chemistry.  He also saw his top running back regress (Ridley rushed for 1200 yards in 2012 and wasn’t the same guy in 2013).

What happened in 2014?  He developed chemistry with those new guys, Gronk came back, and he was still Tom Brady. 

Obviously he’s 6 years older, there’s no guarantee he will develop the same chemistry with this group, no reason to think Gronk is coming back.  BUT the point stands... we’ve seen this before... in the absence of clear signs of physical decline (which just aren’t there... he is moving and throwing the ball better than he has ever has physically) I’m never going to believe Tom is the problem and you always have to hope they will eventually gel.  

Edited December 2, 2019 by mission27

[IheartMyV8]

Not zombie Brady by any means, but there's clear continuity issues with his skill players and no Gronk/Moss figure in the offense to open everyone else up.  AB would have been that element.

[mission27]

Tbh it also shows the eb and flow with how the roster is built.  In the salary cap era you cant keep all your good players.  If you want to be a competitive team for 20 years and be well rounded there are going to be ups and downs on both sides of the ball. 

2006 Brady has no one to throw to, bounce out of the playoffs a couple years in a row, we stack up on offensive talent and push all our chips in

defense kind of falls apart over the next few years 

we bring in some cornerstone defensive players with high draft picks (guys like Mayo, McCourty, etc.) and coach them up and sign them to extensions... let our top offensive weapons go 

offense falls apart by 2013

Give big extensions to Gronk, bring in Amendola, Hogan, Cooks, Lewis, White... offense is on fire in 2014-17 but by the Eagles super bowl our defense is old and slow 

invest a bunch of money and draft picks in top tier defense talent and let the offense kind of fall apart by trading Cooks, cutting Gordon, etc. 

Now the offenses turn to struggle and the defense is elite 

Gotta appreciate how they’ve managed to put out roster fires for the past 20 years and keep this thing going.  I just hope Brady has enough left in the tank to carry this group of jokers and is willing to stick around a couple years to build chemistry with the new guys. 

[DR43]

I was reading articles claiming that the sky is falling.  I haven't been following the patriots that closely but how bad could it be if you're 10-2?  Is there really need to worry?

[AlNFL19]

56 minutes ago, DR43 said:

I was reading articles claiming that the sky is falling.  I haven't been following the patriots that closely but how bad could it be if you're 10-2?  Is there really need to worry?

The offense is getting carried by the defense but I'm confident that if they turn more to the run game and don't have the flu and all, it'll come together. At least for now.

[AlNFL19]

3 hours ago, mission27 said:

tbh I’m a bit reminded of the 2010-2013 period the last time everyone said Brady was declining and done:

Not quoting this whole thing because I think it's kind of annoying when people quote long passages without commenting a ton on them, but this was great analysis. Really tight comparison across the board, from the stats to your explanation. Love it.

[Deadpulse]

1 hour ago, DR43 said:

I was reading articles claiming that the sky is falling.  I haven't been following the patriots that closely but how bad could it be if you're 10-2?  Is there really need to worry?

The same articles came out the last few times they won the SB

[mission27]

1 hour ago, DR43 said:

I was reading articles claiming that the sky is falling.  I haven't been following the patriots that closely but how bad could it be if you're 10-2?  Is there really need to worry?

Worry as in we might lose the AFCCG, sure 

Feels like a first world problem though 

[Dan_Bali]

He is still playing fine... just has zero tight ends and receivers who can get open.

But, he has been married for 10 years, which means he is having sex at most twice a week.  I'm concerned his testosterone levels arent at the levels they once were.

Edited December 3, 2019 by Dan_Bali

[SBLIII]

1 hour ago, Dan_Bali said:

He is still playing fine... just has zero tight ends and receivers who can get open.

But, he has been married for 10 years, which means he is having sex at most twice a week.  I'm concerned his testosterone levels arent at the levels they once were.

Lol 

[ChazStandard]

So Brady, who has worked with literally 100s of WRs over his career, for the first time simply refused to help a rookie learn the offense? That sounds like total tabloid nonsense.

As for Brady's decline - can somebody point it out to me, without reference to statistics - I mean how is he physically worse than last year?

I'm watching the game and I'm seeing a 42 year climb the pocket and avoid sacks just like he used to. He's throwing the ball away, a lot, because guys aren't open. His throws aren't floating, they still have a spiral. When guys are open he's hitting them. There aren't plays left out on the field because Brady is missing open guys, but there are drives stalling because Dorsett/Sanu/Meyers aren't getting open 1v1 when teams are doubling Edelman. And they have no TEs worthy of an NFL roster.

There's a lot of people who assume the problem must be Brady because he's old, or maybe even would like it to be Brady because they dislike him, but I'm watching the play on the field, and if Marshall Newhouse were Trent Brown, and Watson was Gronkowski, this offense would be fine.

At some point, the idea that they can just let good players go and replace them was going to have an impact. It killed a good offense in 2005/6. It killed a good offense in 2013. And it's killing a good offense now.

Edited December 3, 2019 by ChazStandard

[Elky]

4 hours ago, ChazStandard said:

So Brady, who has worked with literally 100s of WRs over his career, for the first time simply refused to help a rookie learn the offense? That sounds like total tabloid nonsense.

As for Brady's decline - can somebody point it out to me, without reference to statistics - I mean how is he physically worse than last year?

I'm watching the game and I'm seeing a 42 year climb the pocket and avoid sacks just like he used to. He's throwing the ball away, a lot, because guys aren't open. His throws aren't floating, they still have a spiral. When guys are open he's hitting them. There aren't plays left out on the field because Brady is missing open guys, but there are drives stalling because Dorsett/Sanu/Meyers aren't getting open 1v1 when teams are doubling Edelman. And they have no TEs worthy of an NFL roster.

There's a lot of people who assume the problem must be Brady because he's old, or maybe even would like it to be Brady because they dislike him, but I'm watching the play on the field, and if Marshall Newhouse were Trent Brown, and Watson was Gronkowski, this offense would be fine.

At some point, the idea that they can just let good players go and replace them was going to have an impact. It killed a good offense in 2005/6. It killed a good offense in 2013. And it's killing a good offense now.

Losing Trent Brown wasn't a big loss because we replaced him with Wynn. However, the failure to plan for life without Gronk and letting AB go over BS killed our offense.

Edited December 3, 2019 by Elky

[Deadpulse]

23 minutes ago, Elky said:

Losing Trent Brown wasn't a big loss because we replaced him with Wynn. However, the failure to plan for life without Gronk and letting AB go over BS killed our offense.

Right, because Wynn has played the majority of the season...