Ward4HOF Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 20 hours ago, TXsteeler said: I love these cherry picked stats that make it sound like someone is having a historic season. No doubt...where is the 'other' Pass rush stat which means just as much...like Watt's 18 Hurries vs Smith's 14, or how about the 7 FF vs 1 FF...or the 2 INTs vs Nada...or QB Pressures, 58 vs 49... Yet Watt has a .5 more sacks, but only 3 less TFL, and ONE less QB Hit, with 34...Massive Cherry picking.... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VigilantZombie Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 TJ Watt is the clear cut candidate here and it's not close tbh. Say what you want about Gilmore or Aaron Donald but neither of them are having the season that Watt is. Not to take anything away from Gilmore but it is common knowledge that a good front 7 makes the job of a DB easier. So pass rush, etc makes things easier for Gilmore in a sense and to an extent. He is still an elite corner. But Watt IS THE PASS RUSH. He is the guy making everyone else's job easier by doing all the work AND getting the stats to back it up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 24 minutes ago, wwhickok said: TJ Watt is the clear cut candidate here and it's not close tbh. Say what you want about Gilmore or Aaron Donald but neither of them are having the season that Watt is. Not to take anything away from Gilmore but it is common knowledge that a good front 7 makes the job of a DB easier. So pass rush, etc makes things easier for Gilmore in a sense and to an extent. He is still an elite corner. But Watt IS THE PASS RUSH. He is the guy making everyone else's job easier by doing all the work AND getting the stats to back it up Can you even name 3 people in the front 7 of the Patriots off the top of your head? Watt is the pass rush, which is why he's one of the least double teamed players in the NFL?  2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VigilantZombie Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 15 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: Can you even name 3 people in the front 7 of the Patriots off the top of your head? Watt is the pass rush, which is why he's one of the least double teamed players in the NFL?  Teams apparently are stupid enough not to double team him. As for the Pat's front 7... John simon, Jamie Collins, Donta Hightower, Kyle Van Noy, Danny Shelton, Shilque Calhoun, Roberts, Chase Winovich...want me to keep going?  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 12 minutes ago, wwhickok said: Teams apparently are stupid enough not to double team him. Speaks for the respect they have for him. 12 minutes ago, wwhickok said: As for the Pat's front 7... John simon, Jamie Collins, Donta Hightower, Kyle Van Noy, Danny Shelton, Shilque Calhoun, Roberts, Chase Winovich...want me to keep going? And how many of those players would you consider to be "above average" at their position? Maybe Hightower and Collins, who have literally nothing to do with Gilmore's job? Their leading sacker is Kyle Van Noy for Pete sakes lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VigilantZombie Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 1 minute ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: Speaks for the respect they have for him. And how many of those players would you consider to be "above average" at their position? Maybe Hightower and Collins, who have literally nothing to do with Gilmore's job? Their leading sacker is Kyle Van Noy for Pete sakes lol If ppl dont respect Watts ability it makes them foolish. I get it, your a Ravens fan and you dont wanna see the Steelers have the DPOY. But the fact is he is the best LB in the league this year and the most impactful defender. Van Noy in that defense, Collins, Hightower and Calhoun imo are all above average. The rest are arguable either way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, wwhickok said: TJ Watt is the clear cut candidate here and it's not close tbh. Say what you want about Gilmore or Aaron Donald but neither of them are having the season that Watt is. Not to take anything away from Gilmore but it is common knowledge that a good front 7 makes the job of a DB easier. So pass rush, etc makes things easier for Gilmore in a sense and to an extent. He is still an elite corner. But Watt IS THE PASS RUSH. He is the guy making everyone else's job easier by doing all the work AND getting the stats to back it up Donald is playing better than T.J. Watt. But DPOY is often more about narrative than level of play, so I won't be surprised or upset if it doesn't go Donald's way. 48 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: Can you even name 3 people in the front 7 of the Patriots off the top of your head? Watt is the pass rush, which is why he's one of the least double teamed players in the NFL?  And my fellow Rams fans scoffed at me when I said we should bring Robert Quinn back this past off-season. Edited December 29, 2019 by jrry32 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 47 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: Can you even name 3 people in the front 7 of the Patriots off the top of your head? Watt is the pass rush, which is why he's one of the least double teamed players in the NFL?  BTW, here are the DT numbers. If you look really hard, you can see Aaron Donald all by himself.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VigilantZombie Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 7 minutes ago, jrry32 said: Donald is playing better than T.J. Watt. But DPOY is often more about narrative than level of play, so I won't be surprised or upset if it doesn't go Donald's way. Statistically speaking that's simply not true. Beyond stats, that's arguably not true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 Just now, wwhickok said: Statistically speaking that's simply not true. Beyond stats, that's arguably not true. It's both true and obvious. He's producing a comparable amount of pressure while being doubled at five or six times the rate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheChancellor Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 How is it even arguable that it is not Gilmore? Unless we're not counting him cause he's so good so we are picking among the best of the rest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VigilantZombie Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 Just now, jrry32 said: It's both true and obvious. He's producing a comparable amount of pressure while being doubled at five or six times the rate. I get what you're saying but just because people are too stupid to double team TJ Watt doesnt mean who would be less successful if they did. We dont know either way. TJ Watt has been an absolute animal. Has been creating turnovers and absolutely destroying QBs all season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 2 minutes ago, wwhickok said: I get what you're saying but just because people are too stupid to double team TJ Watt doesnt mean who would be less successful if they did. We dont know either way. TJ Watt has been an absolute animal. Has been creating turnovers and absolutely destroying QBs all season Odds are that the Steelers are scheming Watt single teams. And it's a pretty safe bet that Watt would be less successful if he saw more double teams. How much less successful? Couldn't say. But if he were facing double teams at the rate Donald does, I feel quite confident that he wouldn't be producing like Donald is now. But as I said, DPOY is about a narrative, not who the best defensive player is. It's like MVP in that regard. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 9 minutes ago, jrry32 said: BTW, here are the DT numbers. If you look really hard, you can see Aaron Donald all by himself.  It's crazy that not only is Donald statistically doing similar things to Watt (if not better things), but he's doing so while being the complete focal point of every offensive gameplan week in and week out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VigilantZombie Posted December 29, 2019 Share Posted December 29, 2019 For the record, the top 3 candidates imo, are TJW, AD, SG in no particular order. At the end of the day, whichever one wins it, will deserve it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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