Travis Kelce vs George Kittle

[N4L]

I still don't get why people say Kelce is a better receiver. What specifically does he do better? Hes not a better route runner. He isn't faster. he doesn't have better hands. what exactly is he better at? 

Lets not forget Kelce plays in an offense designed to put up bulk passing/receiving stats

[Kirill]

1 hour ago, N4L said:

I still don't get why people say Kelce is a better receiver. What specifically does he do better? Hes not a better route runner. He isn't faster. he doesn't have better hands. what exactly is he better at? 

Lets not forget Kelce plays in an offense designed to put up bulk passing/receiving stats

Kelce is a better route runner and better at YAC.

[N4L]

14 minutes ago, Kirill said:

Kelce is a better route runner and better at YAC.

LOLOLOL to the bolded 

Kittle lead the NFL in yac in 2018 and finished third this year for all positions. All the other top guys were running backs 

He has 1476 yards the last two years after the catch 

Kelce has 979 in that same span despite playing in 2 more games 

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/stats?season=2019&week=100&category=RECEIVING&opp=0&sort=5&qualified=1&sortOrder=0 

It's like you've never actually watched kittle play

 

Route running is debatable, but YAC is not 

[Dub_City30]

1 hour ago, Kirill said:

Kelce is a better route runner and better at YAC.

😂😂😂 Better YAC. 4th and 2 Saints vs Niners last 53 secs go check that out

[Dub_City30]

On 12/25/2019 at 9:28 PM, Kirill said:

Kelce's breaking history and still losing this poll in a landslide. The disrespect is unreal.

Numbers aren't everything

[Kirill]

51 minutes ago, N4L said:

LOLOLOL to the bolded 

Kittle lead the NFL in yac in 2018 and finished third this year for all positions. All the other top guys were running backs 

He has 1476 yards the last two years after the catch 

Kelce has 979 in that same span despite playing in 2 more games 

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/stats?season=2019&week=100&category=RECEIVING&opp=0&sort=5&qualified=1&sortOrder=0 

It's like you've never actually watched kittle play

 

Route running is debatable, but YAC is not 

There's three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, then statistics.

[jonnguy2015]

3 hours ago, N4L said:

I still don't get why people say Kelce is a better receiver. What specifically does he do better? Hes not a better route runner. He isn't faster. he doesn't have better hands. what exactly is he better at? 

Lets not forget Kelce plays in an offense designed to put up bulk passing/receiving stats

Kelce plays in a pass first offense and has the best QB in the NFL, and possibly one of the most physically talented of all time, throwing to him. Before that he had Alex Smith, who wasn't too shabby himself. Kittle plays in a run first offense and has a good QB throwing to him, but one that is nowhere near Mahomes' level, and last year, when he broke the TE receiving yards record, he had CJ Beathard and Nick Mullens throwing to him. 

Plus, the "Kelce has 4 straight 1k yard seasons and Kittle doesn't" argument is weird when Kittle has only been in the league for three years. Would be like saying "Matt Ryan is better than Mahomes because he's passed for 4k nine straight years."

Overall, it's very close, and the difference between the two is far smaller than that to the #3 TE, but I think I would take Kittle. I will admit that I am biased though.

Edited January 24, 2020 by jonnguy2015

[N4L]

47 minutes ago, Kirill said:

There's three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, then statistics.

YAC yardage lies for running backs who get 11 yard dump offs on 3rd and 16. 

YAC yardage for TEs doesn't lie. Kittle is one of the hardest players in the league to tackle when he has the ball in his hands. 

Go watch some highlights you chump. Maybe you'll learn something 

[N4L]

1 hour ago, Kirill said:

There's three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, then statistics.

Also, hilarious that you say this, when THE ONLY argument anyone can use is that kelce has more bulk yardage. Which is a damned lie because its not adjusted for the type of offense he plays in. So, way to contradict yourself lol 

 

Fred warner and jaquiski tartt and going to give kelce a tough test. Fred has the length and agility that can match kelce. He's a super smart player with excellent ball skills. Dude had NINE pass deflections this year. He's my dark horse MVP tbh. Have this feeling he forces some clutch turnover to cement his legendary status in his second year in the league. 

I'm sure they will put the honey badger on kittle. That one should be a fun matchup too. Always liked Mathieu since his lsu days. I expect him to make a play on the ball as well, but I think kittle will also stiff arm him into the grass once or twice. 

Kelce is cool. Kittle is better. Jimmy Garoppolo is cool. Mahomes is better. That's just the way it is. 

 

If our teams weren't playing in the Superbowl against each other, you wouldn't even be worth my time, simonwayne 

You are just going to make the GOLD GLITTER THAT MUCH BRIGHTER ON SUPER SUNDAY 

[Hiccups]

37 minutes ago, jonnguy2015 said:

Kelce plays in a pass first offense and has the best QB in the NFL, and possibly one of the most physically talented of all time, throwing to him. Before that he had Alex Smith, who wasn't too shabby himself. Kittle plays in a run first offense and has a good QB throwing to him, but one that is nowhere near Mahomes' level, and last year, when he broke the TE receiving yards record, he had CJ Beathard and Nick Mullens throwing to him. 

Plus, the "Kelce has 4 straight 1k yard seasons and Kittle doesn't" argument is weird when Kittle has only been in the league for three years. Would be like saying "Matt Ryan is better than Mahomes because he's passed for 4k nine straight years."

Overall, it's very close, and the difference between the two is far smaller than that to the #3 TE, but I think I would take Kittle. I will admit that I am biased though.

Kelce may play in a pass first offense, but Kelce isn't the number one read and isn't the number one receiver (his number this year may look like he is the number one receiver but Hill is the number one.) I haven't watched much of the 49ers games but Kittle seems to be your number one read and number one receiver. 

 

Being a chiefs fan and cursed with poor/game manager QB play but amazing TE play. I can tell you a poor/ game manager QB feeds the ball to the amazing TE.

[N4L]

9 minutes ago, Hiccups said:

Kelce may play in a pass first offense, but Kelce isn't the number one read and isn't the number one receiver (his number this year may look like he is the number one receiver but Hill is the number one.) I haven't watched much of the 49ers games but Kittle seems to be your number one read and number one receiver. 

 

Being a chiefs fan and cursed with poor/game manager QB play but amazing TE play. I can tell you a poor/ game manager QB feeds the ball to the amazing TE.

Well reasoned and completely fair. It does work both ways. 

What your post fails to acknowledge is that kittle is essentially a 6th tackle who can reach block DEs, pull and blow up a DT, or get out in space on the edge. 

Kittle is 3x the run blocker than kelce is. AT BEST kelce is slightly better as a receiver (a point I have refuted repeatedly and have still yet.to receive a proper explanation)

So even IF kelce is a better receiver (he's not), the difference between their two in that regard is minimal, while the difference in run blocking is extreme. That's why kittle is the irrefutable best TE in football

[jonnguy2015]

26 minutes ago, Hiccups said:

Kelce may play in a pass first offense, but Kelce isn't the number one read and isn't the number one receiver (his number this year may look like he is the number one receiver but Hill is the number one.) I haven't watched much of the 49ers games but Kittle seems to be your number one read and number one receiver. 

 

Being a chiefs fan and cursed with poor/game manager QB play but amazing TE play. I can tell you a poor/ game manager QB feeds the ball to the amazing TE.

So I looked it up, and here are their target/reception stats:
2018: Kelce 103/150(68.7%), Kittle 88/136(64.7%)
2019(slightly skewed due to Kittle missing two games): Kelce 97/136(71.3%), Kittle 85/107(79.4%)

So Kelce actually did have more targets and receptions than Kittle both years. Plus, Kittle being the dominant receiver on the team last year may have allowed him to accumulate volume stats, but it also allowed teams to double team or even triple team him, something you can't do when there's also Tyreek Hill to worry about, so it works both ways.

Edited January 24, 2020 by jonnguy2015

[Hiccups]

3 minutes ago, N4L said:

Well reasoned and completely fair. It does work both ways. 

What your post fails to acknowledge is that kittle is essentially a 6th tackle who can reach block DEs, pull and blow up a DT, or get out in space on the edge. 

Kittle is 3x the run blocker than kelce is. AT BEST kelce is slightly better as a receiver (a point I have refuted repeatedly and have still yet.to receive a proper explanation)

So even IF kelce is a better receiver (he's not), the difference between their two in that regard is minimal, while the difference in run blocking is extreme. That's why kittle is the irrefutable best TE in football

So... My post doesn't fail b/c I wasn't talking about blocking and neither did the quote.....
Kelce is a better receiver (just b/c Kittle was force feed the ball when he broke receiving record.... doesn't mean he is a better receiver). Kittle isn't the 3 times the blocker. I will agree Kittle is the better blocker but Kelce is just a notch below him. We are just comparing 1a to 1b. You are a fan of Kittle as I am a fan of Kelce. We both think our guy is better when they are basically the same... 

[Forge]

12 minutes ago, Hiccups said:

So... My post doesn't fail b/c I wasn't talking about blocking and neither did the quote.....
Kelce is a better receiver (just b/c Kittle was force feed the ball when he broke receiving record.... doesn't mean he is a better receiver). Kittle isn't the 3 times the blocker. I will agree Kittle is the better blocker but Kelce is just a notch below him. We are just comparing 1a to 1b. You are a fan of Kittle as I am a fan of Kelce. We both think our guy is better when they are basically the same... 

Kittle 2018 target percentage was 25.6%. (136 targets in 532 attempts) 

Kelce's 2018 target percentage was 25.7%. (150 targets in 583 attempts)

So yeah, that "Kittle was force fed the ball" thing during 2018 probably isn't going to work. 

[N4L]

Just now, Hiccups said:

So... My post doesn't fail b/c I wasn't talking about blocking and neither did the quote

I gave you props for your well reasoned post and acknowledged it was valid and sound reasoning. I even gave you your first like! 

1 minute ago, Hiccups said:

Kelce is a better receiver

No, he's not. 

2 minutes ago, Hiccups said:

just b/c Kittle was force feed the ball when he broke receiving record.... doesn't mean he is a better receiver

That's never been my reasoning as to why kittle is a better receiver. He's a better receiver because he's more dynamic. He's faster. He's better after the catch. He's a better route runner because he's a quick twitch athlete. He has better hands. 

I said it a you pages ago but your new here so I'll say it again. Kelce is a damn good football player. Stating kittle is better is not a knock on Kelce by any stretch of the imagination. Kelce is a smooth athlete and looks like he glides when he moves. He is very good at finding holes and zone and space over the middle. He's more in the mold of a traditional tight end in that sense. He is a very fluid athlete, no doubt about it, especially for his size and length. 

9 minutes ago, Hiccups said:

We are just comparing 1a to 1b. You are a fan of Kittle as I am a fan of Kelce. We both think our guy is better when they are basically the same... 

I agree with the notion that these two guys are head and shoulders above everyone else at the position. No arguments there! 

13 minutes ago, Hiccups said:

Kittle isn't the 3 times the blocker. I will agree Kittle is the better blocker but Kelce is just a notch below him.

The difference between they're blocking abilities is greater than the difference between their receiving abilities. That tips to scale in favor of the guy who is better blocker.