Week 16: Packers (11-3) at VIKINGS (10-4)

[y*so*blu]

1 hour ago, SemperFeist said:

But this has been going on for Zimmer’s entire tenure. Not just since signing Cousins. 

Despite winning 60% of the time, I can’t say that Zimmer has created, or instilled, a winning culture. This team doesn’t carry itself with the mindset of a winner, and that falls on the head coach.

Zimmer is another Marvin Lewis.

Or, more appropriately for a Vikings coach, maybe another Dennis Green. Except his aptitude is defensive, not offensive, and he doesn't wear his heart on his sleeve.

If we don't come away with at least one playoff win this year, I will probably stop supporting Zimmer for good.

[VikeManDan]

On 12/16/2019 at 12:29 PM, VikeManDan said:

We need Cook and Mattison for this one.

 

[PrplChilPill]

15 minutes ago, SkolMasterMN said:

I understand the frustration, as this was a big game. But we all need to chill out. We are in the playoffs, and have a good chance of finishing the season 11-5, which is very solid. 

I am not counting us out in the playoffs. With Dalvin Cook in, it's a completely different game. He is a game changer. Time to regroup, rest some of our starters if need be next week and focus on the Wild Card game. Anyone who isn't on board can gladly find another team. Yes, this game sucked, and it was frustrating, but no sense in dwelling on it. That takes away the fun. Have a little faith.

Telling other people the right way to be a fan rarely works out......

[Uncle Buck]

1 hour ago, Arthur Penske said:

 60+ years of not capable of building the super bowl not long enough and it’s Zimmers fault Kirk can’t put the ball the the end zone after 3 Turnovers?

What?  Sounds like you had a few during the game.

[Frank Costello]

The issue is our offensive game plan, our offensive adjustments, and our offensive line. 

It's so ironic that when the defense is FINALLY playing back to their old level, the offense now reverts back too. What gives? 

I've been calling for Stefanski's tail all season. I still don't think this guy gets it. His play calling reminds me of Chilly. Yikes. 

Very tough loss. Typical Vikings. 

[pacman5252]

I think Green Bay’s front is really just a tough match up for Minny and is the problem with going all in on ZBS ol. The Smiths, and Gary are only 20 lighter than the average Minny OL, are much quicker, and are strong enough to hold up at the point., Then throw in Clark who is bigger and faster. Especially without Cook MN couldn’t run east west effectively and the pockets just collapsed. 

[Vikes_Bolts1228]

3 hours ago, Frank Costello said:

I've been calling for Stefanski's tail all season. I still don't think this guy gets it. His play calling reminds me of Chilly. Yikes. 

 

It's like one week EVERYTHING is clicking all on cylinders and the offense looks unstoppable.

Then we get into a big game situation and everything that worked in the past, doesn't get called almost as if we're trying to outsmart the defense by not doing what we put on tape. And this isn't just simply "No Dalvin tonight" as it's happened plenty of times WITH Dalvin in the lineup.

It's just so odd. I mean Boone isn't close to Cook but we couldn't at least TRY a screen to him, Amir, a WR or a TE? Or a swing pass or ANYTHING to try and throw the defense off? Green Bay killed us with quick hits to the WRs with Rodgers' catching the snap and rifling the ball to a WR on the LOS instantly and Stefanski never said "Kirk has no time. Lets try THAT." I get it, GB has fast and good linemen but to not even try that stuff because "they might stop us" is unacceptable.

Even the plays that have worked in the past get a weird treatment. Remember that run with Thielen? Every other week it's a standard jet sweep. This week, it's a hand-off that takes FOREVER to develop and Thielen not only has to slow down to receive the hand-off, he  has ZERO space to run the ball as he's right up against the LOS instead of a few yards back so he can hit the outside at full speed. But nope....a diving lineman gets at his legs (never would have happened if he was 3-4 yards behind the LOS) which slows him down even more and he has no momentum to try and get pased the CB setting the corner to force him inside.

Time after time it feels like there's no identity to this team in big games. They go into a random "Ask Madden" offense (It's a feature in the Madden video games where they select a random play for you to run) and nothing makes sense as to what they're trying to accomplish.

Edited December 24, 2019 by Vikes_Bolts1228

[Illadelegend215]

8 hours ago, gopherwrestler said:

Idk what it is but even with zero time. Cousins isn’t great on Monday nights 

Did you watch the last Monday night game? He looked pretty good to me 

[SteelKing728]

Caught the game late last night.

We just looked complacent out there. Sucks, but we may have just gave GB the #1 seed.

[Illadelegend215]

5 hours ago, Robb_K said:

I had a terrible feeling in my gut after The Viking recovered the first fumble, got the ball first and goal to start the game on a great note, and then failed to get the ball into the end zone.  Then after seeing Cousins look nervous on routine plays, and overthrew Ham by double his height, when he was all alone with a guaranteed 1st Down, and then after the 2nd fumble recovery, when they got the ball at midfield and failed to get even a 1st Down, I KNEW it would take a miracle for them to win. 

But, the WORST part of what I saw tonight was learning that Cousin IS WHAT(WHO) WE THOUGHT HE IS,  and he has NOT shaken off the lack of confidence, and has only seemed to have been playing better because he can hit receivers on deep patterns IF the play-callers design plays to get him away from the rush, BUT that works mainly by using play action.  He's NOT the significantly better QB of the previous 7 games that his stats made him seem.   With no running game, defences won't respect play action, and he'll be continuously sacked, or never complete a pass over 6 yards, because he'll have to throw within 1 or 1.5 seconds.  We saw how he completed the deep touchdown pass that was called back because of holding.  That holding got him 2-3 extra seconds.  The problem is that Cousins is only moblie enough to do his planned curl left or right to avoid the rush (which is now well known by opponents).  But, when they don't respect the run, they beat The Vikings' OL and can often get into The Vikings' backfield on both sides, so Cousins can't move enough to avoid them, and has to throw much too early, and can't even look downfield, so, at best, he can only hit his back for a few yards. 

Do we really want to pay many millions of dollars for an extension of such a flawed QB, taking SO many Dollars away from being able to address big and growing needs on The OL, and the defence, and to replace aging players that are no longer playing their position adequately?

 

What game were you watching? Yes he had some overthrows, but are you really gonna sit here and pretend he just failed all over? He was pressured 42% of the time of his drop backs, literally had someone touch him every time he completed his drops. This game was on the oline, Kirk cousins had ZERO time to do anything at all. 

[vikingsrule]

5 hours ago, y*so*blu said:

Or, more appropriately for a Vikings coach, maybe another Dennis Green. Except his aptitude is defensive, not offensive, and he doesn't wear his heart on his sleeve.

If we don't come away with at least one playoff win this year, I will probably stop supporting Zimmer for good.

I’m pretty much there already. He’s not a big game coach. He’s Marvin Lewis. But I’d assume that is good enough for most NFL owners. Of course I’ll support him if he’s still here, but I don’t think he should be based on how things have gone the last couple of years. He’d need a strong post season performance to show me that he’s more than just a one and done every other year type of coach. 

I’d still lean towards a Stefanski (HC) and Kubiak (OC and play caller) type setup going forward.

Edited December 24, 2019 by vikingsrule

[Uncle Buck]

8 hours ago, TENINCH said:

If the Vikings crap the bed in the playoffs like this I'd expect Zimmer to be gone. 6 years is long enough to build a winner capable of winning the Super Bowl.

I've been a big Mike Zimmer supporter, but this is actually a very good point.  It took Mike Ditka only three years to take a horrible Bears team and build them into one of the best teams of the Super Bowl era. 

[Vikes_Bolts1228]

4 minutes ago, Uncle Buck said:

I've been a big Mike Zimmer supporter, but this is actually a very good point.  It took Mike Ditka only three years to take a horrible Bears team and build them into one of the best teams of the Super Bowl era. 

In the NFL, it doesn't take long to go from poopy to playoffs if you have competent staff.

Edited December 24, 2019 by Vikes_Bolts1228

[Ozzy]

6 hours ago, SkolMasterMN said:

I understand the frustration, as this was a big game. But we all need to chill out. We are in the playoffs, and have a good chance of finishing the season 11-5, which is very solid. 

I am not counting us out in the playoffs. With Dalvin Cook in, it's a completely different game. He is a game changer. Time to regroup, rest some of our starters if need be next week and focus on the Wild Card game. Anyone who isn't on board can gladly find another team. Yes, this game sucked, and it was frustrating, but no sense in dwelling on it. That takes away the fun. Have a little faith.

Agreed but there is a sad reality to this game, Green Bay is not going anywhere and have an awesome football team this year and could easily make the Super Bowl not even considering next season which they will be great again.

 

Granted ZaDarius Smith is not this defensive player of the year first ballot Hall of Famer he looked like in this game but it is pretty shocking how great he is this year.  Then again it is like that Viking game against the Bears early in the year where the OL made the Bears front look like the best in the NFL.  8 sacks and 7 QB hits, totally dominated the game.  They did not run well in that game either but it was on the road.  

This beat down at home to help win the division is awful, but what is worst is the fact the OL is awful.  The interior OL is flat crap and how can anyone win with that?  How can a team win in the Playoffs without an elite OL?  Fact is they cannot.  The D has been playing great, hitting hard and getting turnovers, even Kirk who I really do not like, he was not the problem last night, no QB could have success behind that awful blocking.  

 

Be positive sure, enjoy the game I agree, but hard to find any positive in last nights *** kicking to the arch rival.  Vikings draft clearly goes OL 1st round with who awful they have been up front, and with the cap situation not like the future looks crazy bright either.  If they win they have to win now based on that.  Playing at the Saints if that happens would be a beat down, at the Eagles maybe they have a little chance with all the WR injuries and injuries in general they have, or at the Cowboys they could have a chance but will see.  Maybe it will light a fire under them on the OL but regardless those guards have to go, Bradbury is at least a rookie and maybe can improve but Kline and Elfein suck.  

[Ozzy]

32 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

I’m pretty much there already. He’s not a big game coach. He’s Marvin Lewis. But I’d assume that is good enough for most NFL owners. Of course I’ll support him if he’s still here, but I don’t think he should be based on how things have gone the last couple of years. He’d need a strong post season performance to show me that he’s more than just a one and done every other year type of coach. 

I’d still lean towards a Stefanski (HC) and Kubiak (OC and play caller) type setup going forward.

Stefanski HC?  That would be absolute nuts town, you see some of those play calls in that game?  The dude is a stiff and is not a leader and clearly his offense is suspect and really it is mostly Kubiak and Dennison calling the shots, plays and really the entire system in general, no way he is a HC in the NFL.  

 

Honestly GB, LaFleur is not their reason for success, it is the GM and how they have build that team and what free agents they have signed.  Coaching has not a ton to do with it offensively other than a change in them running the ball more which many teams are doing.  Mike Pettine should get more credit for the Packers success than Matt LaFleur who is just copying McVay.  If the Vikings make a chance it should maybe be at GM.