Week 16: Packers (11-3) at VIKINGS (10-4)

[Torchezim]

5 hours ago, SkolMasterMN said:

I understand the frustration, as this was a big game. But we all need to chill out. We are in the playoffs, and have a good chance of finishing the season 11-5, which is very solid. 

I am not counting us out in the playoffs. With Dalvin Cook in, it's a completely different game. He is a game changer. Time to regroup, rest some of our starters if need be next week and focus on the Wild Card game. Anyone who isn't on board can gladly find another team. Yes, this game sucked, and it was frustrating, but no sense in dwelling on it. That takes away the fun. Have a little faith.

Everyone’s point is that it shouldn’t take 1 player for our offense to be productive.  Apparently, it does require that.  And the fact that Zimmer cannot get out team ready for good teams, a point that I’ve been harping on all season, is fairly telling of what kind of coach he is after 6 years. 
 

Who cares if we are in the playoffs? As I’ve said before, it doesn’t matter if we can’t beat anyone.  This is terrible. We won’t win one game this post season.  
 

I am tired of certain fans blaring their support for Zimmer while completely ignoring his playoff record.  He is not the coach for us and it is very clear.  Has been for a while.  

[Uncle Buck]

18 minutes ago, Torchezim said:

Everyone’s point is that it shouldn’t take 1 player for our offense to be productive.  Apparently, it does require that.  And the fact that Zimmer cannot get out team ready for good teams, a point that I’ve been harping on all season, is fairly telling of what kind of coach he is after 6 years. 
 

Who cares if we are in the playoffs? As I’ve said before, it doesn’t matter if we can’t beat anyone.  This is terrible. We won’t win one game this post season.  
 

I am tired of certain fans blaring their support for Zimmer while completely ignoring his playoff record.  He is not the coach for us and it is very clear.  Has been for a while.  

It's starting to look like we will end up going down to New Orleans for the wildcard round.  That doesn't bode well for our chances.  At the same time, this is where Zim will have to step up his game if he truly is going to be an elite coach. 

I've been on the Zimmer bandwagon since day one, but if we go out with a whimper in this year's postseason, I'd be ready to blow it up and tank next year for a QB in the 2021 draft.  Fire Spielman.  Fire Zimmer.  Trade a lot of the veteran players that are worth draft picks, and let the new regime start over with an elite QB prospect.

[swede700]

57 minutes ago, Torchezim said:

Everyone’s point is that it shouldn’t take 1 player for our offense to be productive.   

It doesn't.  It wasn't the missing of Dalvin Cook that made the offensive unproductive.  It was a swinging door at left tackle.

On another note, I find it amazing that there seem to be a few old posters here that seem to have come out of the woodworks to blast everyone from Zimmer to Stefanski...almost as if you've been waiting for a loss to do so.  I find that very disappointing.  If you've had a problem all season long, despite the team winning game after game, I would much more have appreciated your concern if you hadn't seemed like you were just waiting in the weeds for this moment to happen.

The offense didn't play well last night.  We can all admit that, but now coming out now and saying "I knew Stefanski was a stiff" or "I knew Zimmer was just another Marvin Lewis."  That's ridiculous.

Edited December 24, 2019 by swede700

[since72]

We beat one team all year that has a winning record today, the mighty Eagles.

Whether we finish 11-5 or 10-6, it feels like the Gophers finishing 6-6 because they beat Fresno State, Western Illinois, and St. Bens.  And then getting invited to the Tidy Bowl where you know they’re going to get pounded by Wake Forest. 
 

I really don’t see Spielman firing Glen Mason.  He and Zygi are loyal to a fault.

[swede700]

9 minutes ago, since72 said:

We beat one team all year that has a winning record today, the mighty Eagles.

Whether we finish 11-5 or 10-6, it feels like the Gophers finishing 6-6 because they beat Fresno State, Western Illinois, and St. Bens.  And then getting invited to the Tidy Bowl where you know they’re going to get pounded by Wake Forest. 
 

I really don’t see Spielman firing Glen Mason.  He and Zygi are loyal to a fault.

Glen Mason deserved to get fired.  It's just who they hired to replace him that was the mistake.  

You know who the Packers have beat that currently has a winning record?  The Chiefs (with Matt Moore at QB) and us.  That's it.  We should have beaten KC too, but they aren't all that better than us either.  I refuse to just roll over and quit, as some seem to have already. 

Edited December 24, 2019 by swede700

[SemperFeist]

12 minutes ago, swede700 said:

find it amazing that there seem to be a few old posters here that seem to have come out of the woodworks to blast everyone from Zimmer to Stefanski...almost as if you've been waiting for a loss to do so.

This happens every time the team loses. In every game day thread

[SemperFeist]

13 minutes ago, swede700 said:

That's ridiculous.

It really isn’t. And it’s not a thought based on this one game. It’s based on watching this team fail to show up in big games for 6 years under Zimmer.

Whether it’s prime time games, games against playoff caliber teams, coming off of the bye week, or even the playoffs themselves, Zimmer just does not have this team up for the moment. 

Zimmer has said himself that this team plays better as the underdog, when they get overlooked. Well, I find that troubling because a team with this much talent isn’t going to be seen as an underdog much. And it points to a culture and mentality that aren’t befitting of a winner. And that culture and mentality are the responsibility of the head coach. 

[vikingsrule]

13 minutes ago, swede700 said:

Glen Mason deserved to get fired.  It's just who they hired to replace him that was the mistake.  

You know who the Packers have beat that currently has a winning record?  The Chiefs (with Matt Moore at QB) and us.  That's it.  We should have beaten KC too, but they aren't all that better than us either.  I refuse to just roll over and quit, as some seem to have already. 

Who cares about the Packers. They will be one and done in the playoffs once they play a team like the Saints, Seahawks or 49ers. They aren’t a tier 1 team. The Packers also have a first year head coach with a QB who is on a major decline. We have a QB who’s supposedly having the best year of his career, but it seems apparent that doesn’t matter given the state of the rest of the roster. Fans should be upset after this embarrassing loss, how do coaches continue to get a pass. If we get trounced in the playoffs, ownership really needs to evaluate the management and coaching of this team. 

Edited December 24, 2019 by vikingsrule

[vegas492]

Packer fan here.  Wanted to thank you all for a civil discussion before the game.  I appreciate it!

For me, it was a nerve wracking game to watch.

Minnesota was amazing at forcing those turnovers early.

But, the longer the game went on, it became apparent to me that the Vikes o-line either is terrible, or playing terribly.

Add to it a few boneheaded offensive plays/decisions like the jet sweep pass on a third and short (I think) and I realized that GB could win the game by just kicking field goals.  Then the Vikes defense got winded and allowed a couple nice Jones runs to seal the game.

Objectively, I don't feel like Cousins had a good game.  But, he was under so much pressure.  When Lowry and Lancaster are making plays in the backfield, the offensive line is bad.  Z'Darius was going to get his pressures no matter what.  It was telling to me that our "other" guys, who are more or less just JAGS at this point, were making plays all over the place.  It wasn't elite play that won the line of scrimmage battle it was just bad offensive line play.

I couldn't help but notice how truly awful Bradbury was.  Kenny Clark is a good player.  Not great yet, but he looked like an All Pro against Bradbury.  So did Lancaster.  And Z took his lunch money.  

Anyway, entertaining game and thank you again for the civil conversation.  Onto the playoffs!

Maybe Dalvin would have helped out.

Either way, thanks for the civil posts.

[Arthur Penske]

9 hours ago, Uncle Buck said:

What?  Sounds like you had a few during the game.

Yes.

[since72]

1 hour ago, swede700 said:

You know who the Packers have beat that currently has a winning record?  The Chiefs (with Matt Moore at QB) and us.  That's it.  We should have beaten KC too, but they aren't all that better than us either.  I refuse to just roll over and quit, as some seem to have already. 

The Packers are 3-2 against teams with a winning record now.  We are 1-4.  One team is competitive against good teams.  The other is not.

[Vikes_Bolts1228]

1 hour ago, SemperFeist said:

It really isn’t. And it’s not a thought based on this one game. It’s based on watching this team fail to show up in big games for 6 years under Zimmer.

Whether it’s prime time games, games against playoff caliber teams, coming off of the bye week, or even the playoffs themselves, Zimmer just does not have this team up for the moment.

I get sick of the "underdog" schtick. 

I want a team that goes into each week expecting to win 41-0 and a "We know we're going to be the best team out there so let's go kill 'em" mentality rather than the "Nobody is giving us a chance! We're the underdogs! Let's go get an upset, boys" gimmick.

Do you think Pete Carrol or Belichick or Payton or Reid are telling their team "OK boys, we're the underdogs here! It's us against the world! Nobody expects us to do anything. Let's shock the world!"

Edited December 24, 2019 by Vikes_Bolts1228

[Cearbhall]

1 hour ago, vegas492 said:

Packer fan here.  Wanted to thank you all for a civil discussion before the game.  I appreciate it!

For me, it was a nerve wracking game to watch.

Minnesota was amazing at forcing those turnovers early.

But, the longer the game went on, it became apparent to me that the Vikes o-line either is terrible, or playing terribly.

Add to it a few boneheaded offensive plays/decisions like the jet sweep pass on a third and short (I think) and I realized that GB could win the game by just kicking field goals.  Then the Vikes defense got winded and allowed a couple nice Jones runs to seal the game.

Objectively, I don't feel like Cousins had a good game.  But, he was under so much pressure.  When Lowry and Lancaster are making plays in the backfield, the offensive line is bad.  Z'Darius was going to get his pressures no matter what.  It was telling to me that our "other" guys, who are more or less just JAGS at this point, were making plays all over the place.  It wasn't elite play that won the line of scrimmage battle it was just bad offensive line play.

I couldn't help but notice how truly awful Bradbury was.  Kenny Clark is a good player.  Not great yet, but he looked like an All Pro against Bradbury.  So did Lancaster.  And Z took his lunch money.  

Anyway, entertaining game and thank you again for the civil conversation.  Onto the playoffs!

Maybe Dalvin would have helped out.

Either way, thanks for the civil posts.

I agree with your comments on our offensive line in this game. The offensive line has been a weakness of the team under the current leadership continually. It was a mistake counting on a rookie to start and giving Elflein a starting job. It is hard to expect much out of any QB with line play like that.  Both of our division rivals know the Vikings and exploit it greatly. The Vikings have looked like trash all three games against the two division rivals and offensive line is the main reason for that IMO just as you noticed was the case yesterday.  Fortunately, the other team in the division is Detroit and they are unable to figure out how to work the Vikings offensive line to give them the huge advantage that Green Bay and Chicago enjoy.

Edited December 24, 2019 by Cearbhall

[vikingsrule]

7 minutes ago, Vikes_Bolts1228 said:

I get sick of the "underdog" schtick. 

I want a team that goes into each week expecting to win 41-0 and a "We know we're going to be the best team out there so let's go kill 'em" mentality rather than the "Nobody is giving us a chance! We're the underdogs! Let's go get an upset, boys" gimmick.

Do you think Pete Carrol or Belichick or Payton or Reid are telling their team "OK boys, we're the underdogs here! It's us against the world! Nobody expects us to do anything. Let's shock the world!"

The best 1 or 2 teams win it anyway. Even when the Eagles played up their stupid underdog schtick, they had the #1 seed. When was the last time a true underdog did anything?

It would truly be shocking to the football world to see Cousins wins a playoff game, and that’s a truly disappointing  position to be in. 

Edited December 24, 2019 by vikingsrule

[Cearbhall]

3 hours ago, Ozzy said:

If the Vikings make a chance it should maybe be at GM.

That is just the start.  The new GM should have the freedom to pick his coach and they together they should have the freedom to pick their QB.

This game exposed a weakness that has been around for a long time.

The Vikings leadership still has the playoffs to show their ideas on how to build and run a team work.  I'll be rooting for them. But the offseason is nigh and assuming they do not show something in the playoffs I'll be pushing hard for a new GM.

Edited December 24, 2019 by Cearbhall