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Mid Iowa

Did the Saints manage their starters well during the preseason?

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Revel8    18

Preseason snaps are important. 

The Green Bay Packers went through this last season.  They coddled many of their starters, protecting them from injury in both training camp and the preseason.  Therefore they were unable to get in as much practice as other teams were getting.  This naturally showed up early in the regular season, when they came out the gate rather flat and disjointed.

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Mid Iowa    70
2 hours ago, domepatrol91 said:

How exactly didn't that work? Injuries happen, but we've got a great line when healthy.

imo you'll be singing a different tune as these guys start coming back

I agree that we need a rebuild, but imo the oline is one of few the things Payton's got right recently

 

Uh, 60 yards rushing? 3 rushing 1st downs? 2.9 yards per rush? Is this success to you? I mean, you may be right, I may be singing a different tune, but as for now, this line is mediocre at best. 

So, are we talking about Armstead? Because other than that, we've been fairly healthy, right?

Strief went down with a knee on Monday and the running game stayed about the same. The passing game too. Remember Strief about got Brees killed last season, and hasn't gotten any younger or better.
Unger is back and played well.
Who else is injured?

We've got, how many, first round picks in at line?

I'm not buying it, Dome. The Saints eeked out a 1000 yard rusher last season, and other than that, they've been a pass block only line, year after year.

So, who's coming back that's going to change this, Strief? Armstead?

Man, I hope you're right, or it's going to be a really long season.

............sorry, I'm pissed right now. Pissed and embarrassed. Monday night was F**king embarrassing, and to be in the stands made it even worse. Thank God for Midwestern hospitality or I'd probably be in a body cast right about now.

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Mid Iowa    70

So now we want to trade Peterson after a bad performance? For what?

Look at it this way, for $3mill, he's serviceable, and if one or two of our other guys go down, we know Peterson can tote the rock 30 times... and only fumble once or twice.

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domepatrol91    172
44 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

Uh, 60 yards rushing? 3 rushing 1st downs? 2.9 yards per rush? Is this success to you? I mean, you may be right, I may be singing a different tune, but as for now, this line is mediocre at best. 

Show me a line that isn't mediocre when you remove their two tackles, both of which are Pro Bowl caliber players.

It seems off to throw Payton under the bus for this and citing the 1st game of the season when he's shown for a decade that he knows how to build good offensive lines

49 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

Strief went down with a knee on Monday and the running game stayed about the same. The passing game too. Remember Strief about got Brees killed last season, and hasn't gotten any younger or better.

Did you watch Klemente when Strief went down, he's a lunger and grabber in the run game and looks like he's in 3 feet of water in pass protection.

Strief has been in the top half of the league for RTs for a while now. I don't get this notion that he's getting Brees killed. He's old, sure, but he's a fine RT. He will be sorely missed, watch.

46 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

So, are we talking about Armstead? Because other than that, we've been fairly healthy, right?

Max Unger got what, half a series of snaps in the preseason due to health? He might be healthy now but we can't forget he spent the entire offseason rehabbing. Not to mention we're gonna be lucky if he should even be playing on that foot anyways with our doctors:

As you said, preseason snaps are very important. He got NO push in the run game, he clearly wasn't up to speed in the contact department.

 Peat struggled in the passing game and Unger shored that up well, Warford was better pass blocking than I expected but worse run blocking which is what we signed him for.

55 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

I'm not buying it, Dome. The Saints eeked out a 1000 yard rusher last season, and other than that, they've been a pass block only line, year after year.

Yeah. We're a pass heavy team, we always have been. It makes sense that we have a good pass blocking line, ya know?

56 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

So, who's coming back that's going to change this, Strief? Armstead?

A very good right tackle and a great left tackle? Yeah... I think that could do the trick.

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domepatrol91    172
59 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

We've got, how many, first round picks in at line?

Just two. How many 4th 5th and later round picks has Payton squeezed good to great to HOF production out of?

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domepatrol91    172
59 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

So now we want to trade Peterson after a bad performance? For what?

Look at it this way, for $3mill, he's serviceable, and if one or two of our other guys go down, we know Peterson can tote the rock 30 times... and only fumble once or twice.

Agree. Feed him and run him into the ground. For $3m that is where his value is.

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whodatworm23    135
7 hours ago, domepatrol91 said:

Just two. How many 4th 5th and later round picks has Payton squeezed good to great to HOF production out of?

That was Doug Marrone... This is a big issue, Please lets stop giving Payton all the credit for all our success and none of the blame on our failures. 

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whodatworm23    135
7 hours ago, domepatrol91 said:

Agree. Feed him and run him into the ground. For $3m that is where his value is.

My willingness to trade him has zero to do with Peterson himself. His mere pressence creates conflict now because...

 

1. Payton has proven he has zero clue how to deploy all three in this offense.

 

2. Peterson can spin it all he wants, he was p***ed that he wasnt getting his touches and this situation will only get worse.

 

3. The defense proved their not capable of allowing this offense to not have the ball in Brees hands. So the running game will much less prominent in this offense this year than originally thought.

 

It would be addition by subtraction IMO. Signing Peterson was a mistake on many levels and the sooner the Saints realize this and move on the better but Paytons arrogance will never allow him to do that. Which i could care less because i want him gone!

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Jlowe22    89

It's  one road game against a great defense, lets not trade Peterson just yet.

 

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Jlowe22    89

And let's give Brees a little credit for past oline success.  He gets the ball out quick, and is more mobile and evasive than he gets credit.  He's a veteran HOF qb that knows how to call protections.  

He's older now, and may lose some quickness, but looking at career stats, he rarely gets sacked.  If everyone is gonna give manning and Brady credit for not getting sacked, Brees gets credit to.

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Mid Iowa    70

@domepatrol91 we're talking about preseason, right? And how it can affect the players, right?

So, you say Unger didn't get the push because he didn't get snaps in PS. What about Ramchyk (however the h*ll you spell it)? What about Peat? What about all they guys who did get snaps and still played like crap. Where's the depth? If Payton's doing such a great job, why is there no depth? Why did we bring in 2 O-line for workouts Wednesday?

If building a line means the minute 2 guys are out, you go looking to sign 1-2 more guys, you've failed at your job of coaching and training. Part of that training is Preseason, no?

You don't get the notion Brees is getting killed? Did you watch last season? Remember Brees' arm against Tampa? JJ Watt telling the coaches to pull Strief because he was afraid he was going to hurt Brees.

I can't wait to see how bad Strief sucks now that he's got a bum knee, and Payton will be so stubborn he puts him back in the lineup anyway. Then we'll be working out QBs.

I'll give it to Armstead, I think he's a really good lineman, and he's fragile. The guy's never played a full season. But then again, that's most of our team now.

I'm sticking with my guns here
- our line is just okay, and we'll always suck at rushing while Payton's at the helm.
- missing 1 or 2 guys shouldn't have your team looking like they're lost. 
- pro bowl caliber guys have good rushing and pass blocking skills. I'm failing to see the combo.

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domepatrol91    172
1 hour ago, whodatworm23 said:

Please lets stop giving Payton all the credit for all our success and none of the blame on our failures. 

I was one of the first saints fans to call for his firing and made the first fire Sean Payton thread on the old forums.

not sure where you're getting these ideas that Im blindly defending payton.

seems like the last few days you're finally getting really vocal about the Wanting Payton gone and somehow have convinced yourself you're the only one that feels that way.

We've been calling for his head for years worm. You don't gotta convince me! :D

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domepatrol91    172

IMO you some of you guys are rewriting history.

Our line has been above average to great with all but a few exceptions. Now that you're mad at Payton you're willing to just act like that's not true so he doesn't get ANY credit at all.

I get wanting him fired, since I was one of the first Saints fans on this forum to publicly take that opinion. But you guys are letting your frustrations change what you've known to be true about this team for years. 

Y'all know how important continuty is on the oline right? You are trying to get these guys on the same page, but they've been shuffling around all preseason. It's like pretty premature to write this line off based on one game where they're fighting injuries or just freshly back.

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domepatrol91    172
53 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

JJ Watt telling the coaches to pull Strief because he was afraid he was going to hurt Brees.

JJ Watt? Huh?

who doesn't look bad against Watt? And since when is he a talent evaluator?

And the Tampa game, wasn't  Brees arm pretty much shot? I don't know what Strief can really do about that. Unless I'm thinking of another game.

Im just not buying. Strief has been average at worst, top 10ish RT at his best. Of course he's not in his prime anymore but Brees trust in him should tell you all you need to know.

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domepatrol91    172
47 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

So, you say Unger didn't get the push because he didn't get snaps in PS. What about Ramchyk (however the h*ll you spell it)? What about Peat? What about all they guys who did get snaps and still played like crap.

Ramy missed a lot of time this preseason too. He's also a rookie playing against a fierce Minny line, so giving up a sack and getting minimal push isn't exactly troubling or even unexpected.

Peat played the run better than pass pro and Warford was the opposite. I don't think either of them stood out as awful considering the adjustments they were having to make on the fly with two inexperienced tackles on either end.

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