Uncle Buck Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 12 minutes ago, LionArkie said: I'm assuming you would want Tua at 3? If not, who would you be wanting? Yeah, there is some talk going on with some in the local media saying they think we should find a way to trade up and get Tua. The part that makes sense is that he could sit behind Cousins for 2020 to heal up and learn the NFL game and then become the starter in 2021. I don't blame the Lions for wanting a Herschel Walker size haul of picks to trade down that far - especially with a division rival. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 16 hours ago, Uncle Buck said: Yeah, there is some talk going on with some in the local media saying they think we should find a way to trade up and get Tua. The part that makes sense is that he could sit behind Cousins for 2020 to heal up and learn the NFL game and then become the starter in 2021. I don't blame the Lions for wanting a Herschel Walker size haul of picks to trade down that far - especially with a division rival. I think the only way that happens is if you trade up with Washington and practically hand them the keys to your franchise's future. The value of #2 is 2600 points while the Vikings' #1 is 720. That's a difference of at least two other 1st round picks straight up. Then you have to devalue future 1sts and treat them as 2nd rounders in terms of value. Then throw in QB premium of about 10% - 20%. You're probably going to have to throw in a guy like Danielle Hunter in just to make up some of that draft capital. Just for fun, I wanted to see what it could look like: 2020 1st (720 pts) Danielle Hunter (720 pts) 2020 2nd (380 pts) 2020 3rd (145 pts) 2021 1st (580 pts) 2021 2nd (145 pts) Total = 2690 (Premium of 3%) Which is on the lower side of things so you're probably looking at throwing in a 2022 mid-round pick as well. As a Lions fan, I would love to see this trade. If I'm a Vikings fan, this is the opposite way of building this team for future success. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Buck Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 1 hour ago, Karnage84 said: I think the only way that happens is if you trade up with Washington and practically hand them the keys to your franchise's future. The value of #2 is 2600 points while the Vikings' #1 is 720. That's a difference of at least two other 1st round picks straight up. Then you have to devalue future 1sts and treat them as 2nd rounders in terms of value. Then throw in QB premium of about 10% - 20%. You're probably going to have to throw in a guy like Danielle Hunter in just to make up some of that draft capital. Just for fun, I wanted to see what it could look like: 2020 1st (720 pts) Danielle Hunter (720 pts) 2020 2nd (380 pts) 2020 3rd (145 pts) 2021 1st (580 pts) 2021 2nd (145 pts) Total = 2690 (Premium of 3%) Which is on the lower side of things so you're probably looking at throwing in a 2022 mid-round pick as well. As a Lions fan, I would love to see this trade. If I'm a Vikings fan, this is the opposite way of building this team for future success. Yep. Not looking too hopeful for us. Then again, don't you guys need a cornerback? We have a one-time All-Pro cornerback named Xavier Rhodes I bet the Vikings would be willing to trade... Nah, I wouldn't want to do that to the Lions fans. Packers? Sure. Lions? No. Oh well, the Tua dream has sadly come to an end. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 23 minutes ago, Uncle Buck said: Yep. Not looking too hopeful for us. Then again, don't you guys need a cornerback? We have a one-time All-Pro cornerback named Xavier Rhodes I bet the Vikings would be willing to trade... Nah, I wouldn't want to do that to the Lions fans. Packers? Sure. Lions? No. Oh well, the Tua dream has sadly come to an end. Rhodes was an AP in 2017. His play has definitely changed over the years. I wouldn't have any other issues with you guys trading him to GB. Sorry to burst the Tua bubble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 Would you guys do this trade? I know how much you need pass-rushing help, and I'm taking into consideration that your coach and GM are both on the hot-seat this year: Redskins receive: #3 overall pick 2nd round pick 3rd round pick Lions receive: #2 overall pick Ryan Kerrigan With an agreement in place that you will not take Chase Young at #2 overall and will only trade down from #2 if the team you trade with will be taking a QB. You guys would easily be able to recoup that 2nd and 3rd round pick - and more - by trading down from 2 to 5. If not, you still get Okudah, Simmons, or Brown, but now have Kerrigan as well to make an immediate impact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 You don’t get to have your cake and get to eat it too @HTTRDynasty. But nice try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 1 hour ago, HTTRDynasty said: Would you guys do this trade? I know how much you need pass-rushing help, and I'm taking into consideration that your coach and GM are both on the hot-seat this year: Redskins receive: #3 overall pick 2nd round pick 3rd round pick Lions receive: #2 overall pick Ryan Kerrigan With an agreement in place that you will not take Chase Young at #2 overall and will only trade down from #2 if the team you trade with will be taking a QB. You guys would easily be able to recoup that 2nd and 3rd round pick - and more - by trading down from 2 to 5. If not, you still get Okudah, Simmons, or Brown, but now have Kerrigan as well to make an immediate impact. Absolutely not. If we trade to #2, we're taking Young. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 15 minutes ago, CWood21 said: You don’t get to have your cake and get to eat it too @HTTRDynasty. But nice try. Not sure I understand. One would think the Lions, given their coach and GM are on hot seats and their pass rush is terrible, would want an immediate contributor on the DL. They could easily recoup their picks and more by trading down with Miami if that’s what you’re worried about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 17 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: Not sure I understand. One would think the Lions, given their coach and GM are on hot seats and their pass rush is terrible, would want an immediate contributor on the DL. They could easily recoup their picks and more by trading down with Miami if that’s what you’re worried about. Kerrigan isn't worth anything close to a 2nd and 3rd round pick. For a 4th round pick? Maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 7 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Kerrigan isn't worth anything close to a 2nd and 3rd round pick. For a 4th round pick? Maybe. It isn’t Kerrigan alone for a 2nd and 3rd. It’s moving up to 2 (which puts the Lions in the best position possible for a trade down) plus Kerrigan. The Redskins would need to be compensated for the risk that the Lions would be dishonorable and go back on their word not to draft Young or trade the pick to another team who would draft Young. There is significant risk for the Redskins that the Lions wouldn’t care about the hit to their reputations with Young on the board. People really seem to underrate Kerrigan on this site. He had a down year last year because of injury (the first games he’s ever missed in his career), but IIRC he’s 2nd in total sacks behind only Von Miller since he was drafted in 2011 and has the type of game that typically translates well into his 30’s. I would have loved to keep Kerrigan if we hadn’t drafted Sweat last year and been in position to draft a generational pass rusher this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 If you're so concerned that the Lions would be "dishonorable", why would you... make... the... trade? Demanding compensation for that is silly. Kerrigan is 31 years old and his cap hit is $11.5M. For a team that needs to consider re-signing Glasgow, Robinson, extend Slay and seek upgrades at RT in free agency, that's a pretty good chunk of change. I'd much rather take the compensation from trading down from #3 and keeping our 2nd and 3rd round pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: If you're so concerned that the Lions would be "dishonorable", why would you... make... the... trade? Demanding compensation for that is silly. Why would the 49ers demand compensation moving down from #2 to #3 in 2017? Why would the Redskins demand compensation moving down from #21 to #22 in the 2016 draft? It happens all the time. Teams are willing to take the risk they don't get the player they want, but only if they are compensated for it. 19 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Kerrigan is 31 years old and his cap hit is $11.5M. For a team that needs to consider re-signing Glasgow, Robinson, extend Slay and seek upgrades at RT in free agency, that's a pretty good chunk of change. I'd much rather take the compensation from trading down from #3 and keeping our 2nd and 3rd round pick. Kerrigan's 2020 cap hit would easily go down with a contract extension for 2-3 years. I know fans have the convenience of endless patience, but I think the trade would be a smart move for a coaching staff and FO that don't have time for a rebuild. Historically, most 2nd and 3rd round picks are not impact players in their first couple of seasons, if ever. But I get it, you'd be against the trade. It was just a Sunday morning thought . Edited February 9, 2020 by HTTRDynasty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 I'm not suggesting that you don't deserve compensation for the trade. You just don't deserve extra compensation because you fear that the Lions might be "dishonorable". It being a Sunday morning thought is fair. I don't mean to sound critical. I just don't see the value from the Lions perspective. (It might make more sense to just trade Kerrigan.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: I'm not suggesting that you don't deserve compensation for the trade. You just don't deserve extra compensation because you fear that the Lions might be "dishonorable". It being a Sunday morning thought is fair. I don't mean to sound critical. I just don't see the value from the Lions perspective. (It might make more sense to just trade Kerrigan.) I wasn't suggesting extra compensation for that. What compensation do you think the Redskins deserve going from #2 to #3? Edited February 9, 2020 by HTTRDynasty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 12 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: I wasn't suggesting extra compensation for that. What compensation do you think the Redskins deserve going from #2 to #3? Quite a bit... unless we've made a promise that we won't take Young. Trading extra value to move up, just to seek extra value to move down, would be a wash in the end. Young would be the reason to trade up to #2. I'd trade our future 1st to move up to #2, as I think Young would significantly move this team forward, and right away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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