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Dave Gettleman and the New York Giants

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5 minutes ago, Gmen19851 said:

What talent?  Am I missing something?  Landon Collins is one of the most overrated players in the league and the Giants we're absolutely right for letting him walk for that kind of money.  Same thing with snacks, who sure, is a great run stuffer but is due to count 12 million against the cap next year.  

 

And no, the big spending that Reese did didn't work.  Being good for 1 season isn't working.  Reese whiffed on draft after draft and tried to cover it up with big spending.  This is the nfl though and eventually you need depth.  That doesn't happened when you don't have a good draft for 7 years and spending can only hide so much.   

 

Again, I'm not defending Gettleman, I just think the hate has gone a little too far because of the person he is and not the job he has done.  I will say this though.  This is his offseason.  If the team doesn't make significant strides in the next year then its time to go.  

I'll have to disagree with you, when you bring in quality players that make the All-Pro team, I don't see it as a waste. Mcadoo was not the person to lead the team. I do blame Reese for not getting our offensive line fix.  As for the job he has done,  I believed he should have done far better. What do you consider significant strides, going 8-8?

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4 minutes ago, Go_Giants said:

I'll have to disagree with you, when you bring in quality players that make the All-Pro team, I don't see it as a waste. Mcadoo was not the person to lead the team. I do blame Reese for not getting our offensive line fix.  As for the job he has done,  I believed he should have done far better. What do you consider significant strides, going 8-8?

I wouldn't put a record on it, but I would say significant strides would be: Hiring a coach that is the right fit, Daniel Jones making the next step, offensive line imprving to an above average unit, defense improving to an above average unit, playing meaningful football games in December.  Whether that equates to 7-9 or 10-6 it is what it is but that's what I'd look for.  

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15 minutes ago, Gmen19851 said:

Look at drafts from 2011-2017.  Its ugly.  1 first round pick signed a second contract with the team. (Beckham)

I'll give you Prince and Flowers but that is it. Engram is contract is not up yet so can't count him. Not counting David Wilson cause no one saw that injury coming (unlike with Sam Bael). Gettlemen did not want to resign Pugh and he got rid of Apple and Odell.

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25 minutes ago, Gmen19851 said:

Again, I'm not defending Gettleman, I just think the hate has gone a little too far because of the person he is and not the job he has done.  I will say this though.  This is his offseason.  If the team doesn't make significant strides in the next year then its time to go.  

I think the "have patience" has gone on far too long.  I don't understand what you mean by making his person and the job he's done two seperate things.  His person is a reflection of the job he's done or vice versa or to say it differently, idiots do stupid things and he's done a lot of stupid things standing behind reasoning that makes even less sense.

Saying this is "his offseason" as if the other ones weren't?  His past offseasons have cost the team roughly 90 million in dead money without having anything to show for it and he still isn't anywhere closer to fixing the issues with the offensive line or edge rushers. 

We absolutely needed that early 3rd rounder and would have been a prime pick to snag an offensive lineman with it.  But instead the front office is faced with overspending on a defensive end that flashed in one game, just to get a better look at him....just another prime example of an idiot doing something stupid.

   

 

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Well at least he admitted that he was wrong about thinking that this team could win and rebuild at same time. Regardless that’s no excuse of thinking that in the first place. A reasonable person should’ve seen that this team needed rebuilding from get go. 
 

People point to the drafting of Gettleman and how he has drafted/acquired so much young talent yet there is little to show for that on the field. 

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10 hours ago, Kip Smithers said:

Well at least he admitted that he was wrong about thinking that this team could win and rebuild at same time. Regardless that’s no excuse of thinking that in the first place. A reasonable person should’ve seen that this team needed rebuilding from get go. 
 

People point to the drafting of Gettleman and how he has drafted/acquired so much young talent yet there is little to show for that on the field. 

Gettleman does deserve credit for a few things. He has acquired young talent in the draft and his drafts as a whole have been above average. I think a lot of it not showing up on the field is due to player development by the coaches. It is obvious Shurmur was in over his head as a head coach. Bettcher had this defense lacking in basic fundamentals.

I have little problems with his drafting and scouting. It is the other parts of the job that he is lacking in.

Good news though is the Giants seem to have done some successful self-evaluating, at least in my opinion. A head coach with great managerial skills is most important right now, along with hiring great position coaches and coordinators, to teach good fundamentals and get the best out of all these young talented players. By their own admission, that is what they are looking for.

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5 hours ago, minutemancl said:

Gettleman does deserve credit for a few things. He has acquired young talent in the draft and his drafts as a whole have been above average. I think a lot of it not showing up on the field is due to player development by the coaches. It is obvious Shurmur was in over his head as a head coach. Bettcher had this defense lacking in basic fundamentals.

I have little problems with his drafting and scouting. It is the other parts of the job that he is lacking in.

Good news though is the Giants seem to have done some successful self-evaluating, at least in my opinion. A head coach with great managerial skills is most important right now, along with hiring great position coaches and coordinators, to teach good fundamentals and get the best out of all these young talented players. By their own admission, that is what they are looking for.

Who are these abundance of young talented players we have though? We got a young team o know that but i wouldn’t be able to discern which ones are struggling due to coaching and who are struggling because they’re just not as talented as they appear?

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4 hours ago, Kip Smithers said:

Who are these abundance of young talented players we have though? We got a young team o know that but i wouldn’t be able to discern which ones are struggling due to coaching and who are struggling because they’re just not as talented as they appear?

Young guys I would say that Gettleman brought in that can be contributors are: Barkely, Hernandez, Bj Hill, Lorenzo Carter, Daniel Jones, Dexter Lawerence, Deandre Baker, Julian Love, Ryan Connelly and Darius Slayton.  I'd also say that I think both Oshane Ximenes and Corey Ballentine can potentially contribute at the next level.  

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Sounds like Daniel Jones was more Pat Shurmur's golden nugget.

I still and will continue to believe that this front office fired the wrong person.

 

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On 1/2/2020 at 6:53 PM, Gmen19851 said:

Look at drafts from 2011-2017.  Its ugly.  1 first round pick signed a second contract with the team. (Beckham)

Why stop at 2011, Reese was the GM starting back in 2007.  Rarely are you going to have a draft that hits with every pick, but I think Reese in large part was decent at finding talent.  Even if they didn't develop into pro bowlers, they had their moments...Like Jay Alford getting the sack on Brady in the super bowl.  I wouldn't call his draft history ugly he drafted us some really good players.  

Year Rnd Pick Player Pos
2007 1 20 Aaron Ross DB
2007 2 51 Steve Smith WR
2007 3 81 Jay Alford DT
2007 4 116 Zak DeOssie LB
2007 5 153 Kevin Boss TE
2007 6 189 Adam Koets T
2007 7 224 Michael Johnson DB
2007 7 250 Ahmad Bradshaw RB
2008 1 31 Kenny Phillips DB
2008 2 63 Terrell Thomas DB
2008 3 95 Mario Manningham WR
2008 4 123 Bryan Kehl LB
2008 5 165 Jonathan Goff LB
2008 6 198 Andre Woodson QB
2008 6 199 Robert Henderson DE
2009 1 29 Hakeem Nicks WR
2009 2 45 Clint Sintim LB
2009 2 60 Will Beatty T
2009 3 85 Ramses Barden WR
2009 3 100 Travis Beckum TE
2009 4 129 Andre Brown RB
2009 5 151 Rhett Bomar QB
2009 6 200 DeAndre Wright DB
2009 7 238 Stoney Woodson DB
2010 1 15 Jason Pierre-Paul DE
2010 2 46 Linval Joseph DT
2010 3 76 Chad Jones DB
2010 4 115 Phillip Dillard LB
2010 5 147 Mitch Petrus G
2010 6 184 Adrian Tracy DE
2010 7 221 Matt Dodge P
2011 1 19 Prince Amukamara DB
2011 2 52 Marvin Austin DT
2011 3 83 Jerrel Jernigan WR
2011 4 117 James Brewer T
2011 6 185 Greg Jones LB
2011 6 198 Tyler Sash DB
2011 6 202 Jacquian Williams LB
2011 7 221 Da'Rel Scott RB
2012 1 32 David Wilson RB
2012 2 63 Rueben Randle WR
2012 3 94 Jayron Hosley DB
2012 4 127 Adrien Robinson TE
2012 4 131 Brandon Mosley T
2012 6 201 Matt McCants T
2012 7 239 Markus Kuhn DT
2013 1 19 Justin Pugh T
2013 2 49 Johnathan Hankins DT
2013 3 81 Damontre Moore DE
2013 4 110 Ryan Nassib QB
2013 5 152 Cooper Taylor DB
2013 7 225 Eric Herman OL
2013 7 253 Michael Cox RB
2014 1 12 Odell Beckham WR
2014 2 43 Weston Richburg OL
2014 3 74 Jay Bromley DT
2014 4 113 Andre Williams RB
2014 5 152 Nat Berhe DB
2014 5 174 Devon Kennard DE
2014 6 187 Bennett Jackson DB
2015 1 9 Ereck Flowers T
2015 2 33 Landon Collins S
2015 3 74 Owamagbe Odighizuwa DE
2015 5 144 Mykkele Thompson S
2015 6 186 Geremy Davis WR
2015 7 226 Bobby Hart G
2016 1 10 Eli Apple CB
2016 2 40 Sterling Shepard WR
2016 3 71 Darian Thompson S
2016 4 109 B.J. Goodson OLB
2016 5 149 Paul Perkins RB
2016 6 184 Jerell Adams TE
2017 1 23 Evan Engram TE
2017 2 55 Dalvin Tomlinson DT
2017 3 87 Davis Webb QB
2017 4 140 Wayne Gallman RB
2017 5 167 Avery Moss DE
2017 6 200 Adam Bisnowaty T

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