2019/2020 Offseason

[jetskid007]

Darnold will be so much better with an improved offensive line.

Quote

The Jets’ highest-graded offensive lineman this season was left tackle Kelvin Beachum(67.1). His grade ranked just 21st among qualifying players at the position, and he is set to become an unrestricted free agent this offseason. It was an overall lackluster performance from the group in 2019. They allowed pressure in 2.5 seconds or less on 27.5% of their dropbacks (second-highest rate in the NFL), and no team created fewer yards before contact in the run game than the Jets did. They could use some fresh faces among the five guys up front to lead a turnaround.

 

[doumeyer]

Interesting stat LSU QB Joe Burrow is older than Sam Darnold, & Darnold has been in the NFL two full seasons, already. 

[KingOfNewYork]

7 hours ago, doumeyer said:

Interesting stat LSU QB Joe Burrow is older than Sam Darnold, & Darnold has been in the NFL two full seasons, already. 

Sam would be a Senior right now at USC just finishing up. These two years were basically throwaways for him, he’s learned so much more than he would’ve at USC. Year 3 is always the big step for pros. 

[doumeyer]

31 minutes ago, KingOfTheDot said:

Sam would be a Senior right now at USC just finishing up. These two years were basically throwaways for him, he’s learned so much more than he would’ve at USC. Year 3 is always the big step for pros. 

I would think so also,

[Bobby816]

I think there’s a way and a likely trade partner that can get us a 1st round OT and WR. Baltimore is at the end of Round 1. JD has serious ties to Newsome. We could trade our 2nd and the NYG 3rd and move back into Round 1 for one of the great WRs still there. Bc I can’t see Jeudy, Lamb, Ruggs, Higgins and Shenhault all going before then. I think Jeudy, Lamb and Ruggs will for sure be gone. But Higgins and Shenhault could still be there. And are both guys in a lot of drafts that are top 20 picks. This trade up still has us keeping our 3rd to get a good prospect as well.

I mean a draft of let’s say Wirfs AND Shenhault would be great for this franchise. An anchor for the OL and a potential #1 WR as well, all with just really moving that 2nd up for a pick we acquired for selling away Leo.

 

Just an idea...

[jetskid007]

22 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

I think there’s a way and a likely trade partner that can get us a 1st round OT and WR. Baltimore is at the end of Round 1. JD has serious ties to Newsome. We could trade our 2nd and the NYG 3rd and move back into Round 1 for one of the great WRs still there. Bc I can’t see Jeudy, Lamb, Ruggs, Higgins and Shenhault all going before then. I think Jeudy, Lamb and Ruggs will for sure be gone. But Higgins and Shenhault could still be there. And are both guys in a lot of drafts that are top 20 picks. This trade up still has us keeping our 3rd to get a good prospect as well.

I mean a draft of let’s say Wirfs AND Shenhault would be great for this franchise. An anchor for the OL and a potential #1 WR as well, all with just really moving that 2nd up for a pick we acquired for selling away Leo.

 

Just an idea...

A better idea? Wait until 48 or 68 to take one of the 366489 other receiver prospects in the deepest receiver class ever, or use maybe a 4th or 5th to jump up a few spots in round 2 instead of mortgaging an additional top 70 pick to move up 20 spots. 

Just because the media has overlooked guys and the mock drafts are telling a different story doesn’t mean the second wave of receiver prospects aren’t as good as the aforementioned. The talent gap between a guy like Shenault to Aiyuk or even DPJ is not as big as you’d think; In fact, I’d put money on Shenault being available in round 2 this year. 

Not saying this is your position, but if you were to take the stance of “the Jets haven’t drafted good receivers in rounds 2 or 3 over the past 10 years, so I’d rather one in R1” that would be a fallacy. It’s no more likely that we’d take the right receiver just because they have a “Round 1” attached to their name than it is we’d take the right on in rounds 2, 3, and it’s an entirely different regime. 

Respect the thinking outside of the box, but just think you’re way too hellbent on drafting a receiver in round 1 just because of the pedigree that comes with being a 1st round pick. There will be receivers at 48 that are just as good as receivers at 28; this year, more than others, will be about teams personal preferences regarding flavor, so great WR prospects will fall in round 2- just as they did last year 

[JetsFan15]

3 minutes ago, jetskid007 said:

A better idea? Wait until 48 or 68 to take one of the 366489 other receiver prospects in the deepest receiver class ever, or use maybe a 4th or 5th to jump up a few spots in round 2 instead of mortgaging an additional top 70 pick to move up 20 spots. 

Just because the media has overlooked guys and the mock drafts are telling a different story doesn’t mean the second wave of receiver prospects aren’t as good as the aforementioned. The talent gap between a guy like Shenault to Aiyuk or even DPJ is not as big as you’d think; In fact, I’d put money on Shenault being available in round 2 this year. 

Not saying this is your position, but if you were to take the stance of “the Jets haven’t drafted good receivers in rounds 2 or 3 over the past 10 years, so I’d rather one in R1” that would be a fallacy. It’s no more likely that we’d take the right receiver just because they have a “Round 1” attached to their name than it is we’d take the right on in rounds 2, 3, and it’s an entirely different regime. 

Respect the thinking outside of the box, but just think you’re way too hellbent on drafting a receiver in round 1 just because of the pedigree that comes with being a 1st round pick. There will be receivers at 48 that are just as good as receivers at 28; this year, more than others, will be about teams personal preferences regarding flavor, so great WR prospects will fall in round 2- just as they did last year 

I agree with the stand pat or trade back approach this year.  Not just because of the depth at positions like WR in this draft but because we need to bring in as much talent as possible.  With 4 picks in the top 80 of this draft we have a chance to infuse the team with some young talent if our scouts and GM do a great job this off season.  I'd be all for trading back from 11 if we are left with no top OT, CB or EDGE choice.  Depending on how the draft shakes out, if WR (Judy, Lamb, Higgins et al) is there we can still get one by moving back a few spots I would. Picking up a 2nd or 3rd in the process would be awesome.   

[jetskid007]

3 minutes ago, JetsFan15 said:

I agree with the stand pat or trade back approach this year.  Not just because of the depth at positions like WR in this draft but because we need to bring in as much talent as possible.  With 4 picks in the top 80 of this draft we have a chance to infuse the team with some young talent if our scouts and GM do a great job this off season.  I'd be all for trading back from 11 if we are left with no top OT, CB or EDGE choice.  Depending on how the draft shakes out, if WR (Judy, Lamb, Higgins et al) is there we can still get one by moving back a few spots I would. Picking up a 2nd or 3rd in the process would be awesome.   

I'm telling you this draft is going to be crazy in terms of how the receiver boards are stacked. Some teams will have Michael Pittman as their 3rd rated receiver, others will value the Ruggs', KJ Hamler's and Jalen Reagor's speed demons more highly than most. I think this year will be a lot like 2014 except the prospect pool is better. 

Personally, one guy who has caught my eye is Quintez Cephus, but there are a lot of off-the-field that will have to be considered with him. From a pure talent prospective, I see a rock solid round 2 receiver, who will likely go in round 5. 

[Bobby816]

1 hour ago, jetskid007 said:

A better idea? Wait until 48 or 68 to take one of the 366489 other receiver prospects in the deepest receiver class ever, or use maybe a 4th or 5th to jump up a few spots in round 2 instead of mortgaging an additional top 70 pick to move up 20 spots. 

Just because the media has overlooked guys and the mock drafts are telling a different story doesn’t mean the second wave of receiver prospects aren’t as good as the aforementioned. The talent gap between a guy like Shenault to Aiyuk or even DPJ is not as big as you’d think; In fact, I’d put money on Shenault being available in round 2 this year. 

Not saying this is your position, but if you were to take the stance of “the Jets haven’t drafted good receivers in rounds 2 or 3 over the past 10 years, so I’d rather one in R1” that would be a fallacy. It’s no more likely that we’d take the right receiver just because they have a “Round 1” attached to their name than it is we’d take the right on in rounds 2, 3, and it’s an entirely different regime. 

Respect the thinking outside of the box, but just think you’re way too hellbent on drafting a receiver in round 1 just because of the pedigree that comes with being a 1st round pick. There will be receivers at 48 that are just as good as receivers at 28; this year, more than others, will be about teams personal preferences regarding flavor, so great WR prospects will fall in round 2- just as they did last year 

I see a bigger talent gap than you do clearly. I think Ruggs is WAY better than Hamler. I think Higgins is WAY better than Aiyuk. I think Shenhault is WAY better than Reagor.

It’s a deep OT class as well so I could throw the same thing right back at you. Becton, Jackson, PTW, Adams, Jones, Niang are good prospects as well. Like I said I am all for going OT at 11. But I don’t view the guys you see falling to us at 48 on the same level as the 5 guys I listed. Doesn’t mean I don’t like some of those guys. I’d be happy with Aiyuk, Hamler at 48. But I see the 5 mentioned as A LOT better players. Hence why they’re projected 1st rounders and the others aren’t. 

[jetskid007]

23 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

I see a bigger talent gap than you do clearly. I think Ruggs is WAY better than Hamler. I think Higgins is WAY better than Aiyuk. I think Shenhault is WAY better than Reagor.

Please elaborate without pointing to "size" or "production" 

[Bobby816]

32 minutes ago, jetskid007 said:

Please elaborate without pointing to "size" or "production" 

Ruggs is a speedster. I think he will go top 20 bc his 40. Not as polished of a route runner as Jeudy... but speed kills and teams like that. Higgins I think is just a Lamb lite. Has great size, hands and is very agile for his size. A comparison to Aiyuk isn’t similar to him bc Aiyuk is more a Jeudy type guy just not as crisp of a route runner. Higgins also makes a great red zone target. A QBs best friend. Shenhault has all the tools. The key for him will be to go to a team that will utilize him. If a team is just going to like him up at WR and expect him to be great, he will fail. But he’s in the mold of Harvin and Hill, where you need to get the ball in his hands in several ways. His combine will dictate a lot with him. He runs well and he’s a 1st rounder. He doesn’t and he could slip. I view him as the 5th best WR. Like I stated... I don’t dislike Aiyuk and Hamler. I just view the guys I stated as superior prospects. I should also say I really like Jefferson as well. But I see no way he falls to 48 either. I should have put him in this group with the 5 mentioned. I actually like him more than Shenault probably. Bc I don’t have confidence in Gase utilizing Shenault correctly. 

 

No different than I view the OT class deep.

I have Thomas, Wills and Wirfs ranked high. Becton and Jackson still with 1st round grades. But I do still like guys like Adams, PTW, Jones and Niang in Round 2.

[jetskid007]

19 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

Ruggs is a speedster. I think he will go top 20 bc his 40. Not as polished of a route runner as Jeudy... but speed kills and teams like that. If this is your rationale, there is very little difference between KJ Hamler and Jalen Reagor... all 3 of them will run the same, but what separates a Ruggs from a Hamler or Reagor is his hands, otherwise, they're extremely similar prospects in terms of their speed, body control, and YAC ability. Higgins I think is just a Lamb lite. Has great size, hands and is very agile for his size. Higgins' game is nothing like Lamb's game. At this point Higgins is a lot like former Clemson WR Mike Williams; not a very diverse route tree- but is an "in your face" type player who is going to beat you one-on-one due to his natural "competitive" athletic traits, kind of like AJ Green (may not test overly well but it shows on tape), whereas Lamb is smaller/slighter than Higgins but plays tough and is a technician with vice grips for hands and the best hand-eye coordination of any receiver in the class... very similar to Davante Adams; his ability to manipulate the defender, sink his hips, and extend his arms/hands at catch point won't show up on a combine measurement, but it shows up on tape. A comparison to Aiyuk isn’t similar to him bc Aiyuk is more a Jeudy type guy just not as crisp of a route runner. Don't disagree here, both have instincts for the position which NFL teams will love, but what separates Jeudy is truly rare foot speed, which makes him a far more advanced route runner naturally. Higgins also makes a great red zone target. A QBs best friend. Shenhault has all the tools. The key for him will be to go to a team that will utilize him. If a team is just going to like him up at WR and expect him to be great, he will fail. But he’s in the mold of Harvin and Hill, where you need to get the ball in his hands in several ways. His combine will dictate a lot with him. He runs well and he’s a 1st rounder. He doesn’t and he could slip. I view him as the 5th best WR. What are those tools, specifically? What about his game makes him a top prospect? How is he in the mold of a Harvin or Hill other than that Colorado asked him to play in a number of roles? What are his feet like? Hand-eye coordination? Hips? Catching ability? Is his route running raw because of his usage or does he have the tools to become a better route runner in the NFL? Why? All these questions need to be asked, and when teams get in war rooms to try to make a decision between a guy like Shenault - who has all the hype but will need time to develop - vs. a Jauan Jennings - who has tons of off the field issues but is a very rare, talented natural receiver prospect despite the lack of statistics and flash, can probably come in and be an impactful receiver right away while displaying tremendous upside given his rare ability as a downfield receiver given his size/ability to track the football and his elusiveness/hip flexion for such a big player; teams have have to balance which player is going to fit their offense, how they're going to produce early on, what will be needed in order to make sure that player reaches their potential, etc... it's not as simple as "put the ball in his hands like Florida did with Harvin"; there's a lot more that goes into an evaluation. His 40 speed will be the least of teams concerns, it will be his transition to WIDE RECEIVER Like I stated... I don’t dislike Aiyuk and Hamler. I just view the guys I stated as superior prospects. You're not explaining why you have that view. All I'm left to assume is that you're formulating a judgment on a player because of what the size or stats say and where the Draftniks have been listing that player for the past 4-6 months... ex/ if KJ Hamler were listed at 5'11 and had been higher than Ruggs in the media's big boards since July, you would fall in line with that logic.  I should also say I really like Jefferson as well. Why do you like him so much? What about his game is appealing to you? Is it that he has an uncanny ability to read the soft spots in a zone defense and mirror his QB on plays that break down? Is it his foot quickness? Is it the chip/toughness he plays with? Is it his strong hands? Because if you're going to point to him as a prototypical #1 receiver: newsflash, he's been playing in the slot... how do we know he's not Jarvis Landry 2.0? We don't yet, but that's why the details in terms of what a player is capable of is so important. But I see no way he falls to 48 either. I should have put him in this group with the 5 mentioned. I actually like him more than Shenault probably. Bc I don’t have confidence in Gase utilizing Shenault correctly. Gase developed Demaryius Thomas into - at one point - one of the best receivers in the NFL, despite the fact that he was a raw football player who happened to play WR at Georgia Tech... ever think that maybe Gase just wants his receivers to play receiver and not settle for on them being a gadget player?

No different than I view the OT class deep.

I have Thomas, Wills and Wirfs ranked high. Why? Becton and Jackson still with 1st round grades. Why? But I do still like guys like Adams, PTW, Jones and Niang in Round 2. Why?????

 

[Bobby816]

38 minutes ago, jetskid007 said:

 

I’ll elaborate more on Tuesday. I just landed on vacation in Aruba.

[rickyt31]

I'm in love with this 49ers team. They are tough and fun to watch. 

[jetskid007]

Feels like a direct shot at the Jets/Bell