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Elky

Why is Cleveland so unstable?

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With the Browns being bad for so long there is a pressure every year to have success. That results in impatience from the ownership with their desire to win immediately and turn things around.

GMs come and GMs go and coaches get thrown out with the bath water each time.

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4 minutes ago, Thelonebillsfan said:

Pilot-Flying-J-w-Jimmy-Haslam_840x480.jp

But Cleveland was still a black hole when the Lerners were in charge.

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2 minutes ago, Elky said:

But Cleveland was still a black hole when the Lerners were in charge.

at least we went 10-6 once and went to the playoffs once.  and this was from an absentee owner.  literally not caring did better than what the haslams are doing

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Just now, Hunter2_1 said:

What about the previous 15 years ?

lol. I only started really getting into football over the past 5. So I’m going to provide some NHL thoughts to this as well.

If I had to guess, it’s mostly about ego and culture.

Culture
- The Toronto Maple Leafs had a tough time with there culture when we were trying to buy out the Muskoka five, which really set the team back multiple years. Not sure how this relates to Browns but might have some relevance.

- when a team is considered to be a poor performer and has a history of it, it’s extremely hard to break. For instance, the San Jose Sharks always were a 2nd playoff exit team for like 5 years in a row. They became labelled as a non-contender, just cause of that.

Ego

-from Brett Kollmans breakdown the team figured out where Baker Mayfields succeeds last year by week 10 than fired the coach and the Kitchens became the head coach, got new flashy toys and went back to stretching the field and not what made Baker successful. He became his own worst enemy.

- the Browns have also in the past few drafts went with their ego over logic. Sam Darnold is the better player, but they wanted to go with a player who worked with their market. Don’t know why that means. Not saying Baker can’t be successful cause he can.

- I also think when Odell asks for a trade your dealing with either the player having an ego or a superior having an ego. For example, the Leafs players “purposefully” lost games this year until Mike Babcock was fired. Came out Babcock had a huge ego and there were rumblings beforehand, but once he was gone they’ve become great again.

Other potential factor

The Edmonton Oilers were in tank mode and had the #1 draft pick for like 4 out of 6 years and the NHL even rewrote the draft lottery to attempt to mitigate this after them. They always got the #1 guy, but there 2nd - last round never were mostly busts. Got to put time and effort in the Later round scouting.

 

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browns were somehow worse this decade than they were in the 00s when they came back as a expansion team. these last 21 yrs have been legendary in the worse way for their fans

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Elky said:

But Cleveland was still a black hole when the Lerners were in charge.

The Lerners just had a team that drafted poorly and most of their influence is now gone, Ralph Wilson had the same issue, just couldn't land on a GM that could get the Bills "back in it" despite some decent seasons, but they weren't unstable, they just didn't care.. The Browns were not THIS level of comically bad until Jimmy bought the team. They were in the same boat as other middling to bad franchises, the Lions were demonstrably worse for instance. They were in the same cluster of the bad teams like Oakland, Houston, Arizona, Buffalo, Cinci and San Fran. They've been turbocharged awful and unstable since 2011. They won a full 21 more games in the 2000's even including the 2000 Browns who were still functionally an expansion team.

Edited by Thelonebillsfan

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It’s Haslam, entirely.

Lerner didn’t have success, but coaches were given an opportunity and there was structure.

Jimmy has literally no idea what he’s doing and refuses to allow anyone to step in and run things completely and show any modicum of patience.

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Don't know. For a team that has had so many resets over the past few years you'd think they'd eventually get something right. 

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21 minutes ago, Thelonebillsfan said:

Pilot-Flying-J-w-Jimmy-Haslam_840x480.jp

First of all, as a Truck Driver, let me tell you this guy is as bad a business owner as he is a team owner. Some of these Truck Stops shouldnt even be operating they are in such poor shape. Well...okay he must be doing something right cuz they're still in business and he is filthy rich lol.

 Seriously though this strikes me as a guy who we all know was a minority owner for the Pittsburgh Steelers and decided you know what I can do this and I can do it better so I'm gonna go by the Cleveland Browns and make them a competitive team and beat the steelers twice a year.

 The problem is,  S some people suggested he is extremely impatient John Dorsey made a mistake with the head coaching hire,  But I understand why he did it he allowed his quarterback to influence the positional placement  I am assuming because he fell it would benefit his team what he did not know is that Freddie kitchens would turn out to be completely oblivious to what it takes to be a head coach. John Dorsey bill a very good team he had success with teams in the past this it is a general manager who could have set them in the right path so unless you're gonna go out and replace him with someone like Ireland from the Saints, idk what your mentality was moving on so quick.

 I don't know that Mike McCarthy is actually going to be intrested in Cleveland but I think that it would be a good hire what they need is a head coach with a strong personality and the proven capability to succeed.

Until they're willing to do that instead or recycling failed coaches and making risky hires, theyll continue to fail as a team, imo.

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5 hours ago, YogiBiz said:

Browns Ownership: Looks at past few drafts under Dorsey. Sees they finally made some picks that aren't complete busts. "We should probably fire this guy, right?" 

That is not even close to what actually happened.  

They wanted to alter Dorsey's responsibilities as GM, and he didn't like the idea, so they parted ways.  

They never actually fired Dorsey.  He left on his own terms. 

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4 minutes ago, RamblinMan99 said:

That is not even close to what actually happened.  

They wanted to alter Dorsey's responsibilities as GM, and he didn't like the idea, so they parted ways.  

They never actually fired Dorsey.  He left on his own terms. 

They wanted to demote him so that they could give Paul DePodesta more power, and rightfully he declined that. No matter how you spin this, the Browns are downright stupid.

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When the Chiefs fired Dorsey I was upset, but there were rumors that he wasn't good at relationships with players and personnel behind the scenes. Maybe he had similar problems during his tenure in Cleveland. Ultimately, Dorsey hired Freddie Kitchens, and the Browns had a number of problems this season with players acting out on the field and social media. He's gotta take the lions share of the blame for that. With that roster the Browns should have been able to get a much better coach than Kitchens.

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12 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

They wanted to demote him so that they could give Paul DePodesta more power, and rightfully he declined that. No matter how you spin this, the Browns are downright stupid.

Never said Cleveland wasn't stupid.  

Just wanted to make it clear that they never terminated Dorsey from the organization.  

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