Jump to content

End of the Patriots era?


rocky_rams

Recommended Posts

2 hours ago, Outpost31 said:

Why are you ignoring that Tom Brady is 42 years old?  38-year-old Brady could have had Julian Edleman's handicapped nephew at WR and played better than he did this season. 

I'm not ignoring it all. You've ignored all my points twice now.

 

Hey, Rodgers has a pretty terrible away record. Close to .500 isn't it. Must ALL be his fault.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Pats#1 said:

Not a great TE and WR, a decent one. 
 

You’re hyperbole is ridiculous

So is edlemen decent or not? Sanu was one of the better #2's before coming to NE. Wasnt Dorsett feasting early in the season. Even when he had Gordon, Gronk and Edlemen last year he played poorly. Mothertime is undefeated. There is no shame in betting shot at 42. Brady isnt a top 15 qb if he comes back next year.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Bearerofnews said:

So is edlemen decent or not? Sanu was one of the better #2's before coming to NE. Wasnt Dorsett feasting early in the season. Even when he had Gordon, Gronk and Edlemen last year he played poorly. Mothertime is undefeated. There is no shame in betting shot at 42. Brady isnt a top 15 qb if he comes back next year.

Edelman has been injured all season and got double teamed because ever defense knew no other receiver could get open.

 

Sanu was bad, he wasn’t good, dropped and tipped a bunch of passes while he was here.

 

i just can’t take the opinions of people who obviously didn’t watch more than a couple Pats games this season with that much weight. Not a jab or anything, just a fact. Brady isnt what he once was, no one is arguing otherwise, but he wasn’t the one holding this team back at all. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes but not because of Brady.

The defense is going to see massive turnover and be a year older, they had this last run in them and even then they couldn't hold up late in the season. They just won't have the horses.

But the AFCE could, and should, very well be really bad next year if Allen really is gas station brand Trubisky and crashes down to earth next year. So they'll probably make the playoffs. I don't see another run in this group though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The answer everyone wants to hear: Yes, the Patriots are undoubtedly done there’s no way they’ll be good again, they’re about to go into an era of mediocrity, and it’s new peoples time to shine.

The real answer: No. Brady isn’t the best but he’s still situationally one of the best quarterbacks in the game. The Patriots failed to utilize the respectful resources they placed on acquiring Harry and Sanu. They should also get an upgrade at TE.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, Pats#1 said:

Edelman has been injured all season and got double teamed because ever defense knew no other receiver could get open.

 

Sanu was bad, he wasn’t good, dropped and tipped a bunch of passes while he was here.

 

i just can’t take the opinions of people who obviously didn’t watch more than a couple Pats games this season with that much weight. Not a jab or anything, just a fact. Brady isnt what he once was, no one is arguing otherwise, but he wasn’t the one holding this team back at all. 

Wasnt this Edleman's first 1000 yd season? I know Sanu wasnt good. My point was with Atlanta he was a good #2 and with NE he wasnt good. Is that more on Brady than Sanu? Id like to see what NE's receivers seperation metrics and drop numbers were.

I saw enough of NE to know past 2 years, Brady has very clearly regressed physically and maybe even mentally (though thats much harder to gage)... not by his standards, but by any. He isnt immortal, no player is going to outlast aging. Again, no shame in that. 

If he stays in NE, then need to go all in on weapons so there is no more doubts on what is the factor.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pats fan here. NE is in a precarious situation, even if we assume Brady stays.

The quarterback needs a deal. The Pats are operating with ~$40M in cap space, so a deal that works for both sides is very doable. But assuming the cap hit is anywhere from half to a third of that total space, it won’t leave a lot of room for others - which is the larger problem IMO. 

Kyle Van Noy is an UFA. He’s been a key piece to this defense for a couple seasons now and is a huge locker room guy. KVN hasn’t gotten his big payday yet, so he might be a pricey piece to keep around. Similar situation with Jamie Collins - Collins has been paid for a couple seasons but is a little older. Losing just one of Collins/KVN won’t be a death-blow with Hightower and Bentley still around, but the former two bring a different skill set as rushers that the Pats would miss sorely.

Devin McCourty is set to be a FA and may actually retire. Coming off one of his best seasons, he might decide to run it back again but he’s flirted with retirement in the past. His price tag, if he hits the market, could be hefty even though he’s an older guy. 

Joe Thuney is going to be an UFA. He’s been the lone bright spot on the OL this season and has been at minimum solid for his whole career. Guy is a very good guard that might get paid like an elite one. 

Danny Shelton has had a quietly good season as a defensive tackle. No, he’s not a pass rusher, but he created surprising push when given the chance and has been very stout against the run. I doubt his price tag is going to be a big one, but the dollars are racking up at this point. 

Elandon Roberts - the versatile LBer who may become more valuable if both KVN and Collins can’t be retained. Roberts showed some skill as a fullback, STer, and a run-down LBer. He’s a piece I’m sure NE would like to keep. 

Backups Phillip Dorsett (at a thin WR group), Adam Butler (teams best/only interior rusher), and Ted Karras (filled in as good as a backup could for David Andrews) are also pieces that see time. 

So with all these guys looking to leave, amongst others in 2021 (Hightower, Harmon, Ghost, Guy, Andrews, White, Burkhead, Jackson, McCourty), it’s going to be tough to field a familiar roster. Add in a relatively thin draft class that is likely to get hacked even thinner from league discipline, and the 2020 roster is going to be...different. NE is likely going to have to do a little cap magic by extending the 2021 UFAs in order to create some room and retain players. 

Not all is doom a gloom however - some younger players can get healthy and finally acclimate, Edelman hasn’t been healthy most of the year, so having him back a little healthier will be big. Sanu and Harry can get healthy themselves and have an offseason in the offense. Now-2nd year players Froholdt, Cowart, Williams, and Cajuste can come in and possibly work their way into a rotation. At the end of the day, it’s going to be a rocky offseason and the Pats aren’t loaded with ammunition to take it on, but we’ll see. It starts with Brady.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 1/5/2020 at 12:15 AM, rocky_rams said:

The Patriots 2001-present era/dynasty/run is the greatest in the history of the NFL  

Did we finally just witness their demise? 

And if we did, who do we think will be the next to take the throne?

I believe the answer is yes. Even last season, it was clear that Tom Brady was beginning to perform below his standards, and this season he took another step down. He'll be 43 in August, and I just don't see him performing at an elite level or carrying a team anymore. The Patriots had an unprecedented run, but nothing lasts forever.

As for "the next dynasty," if there is one, then I want to say it's the Chiefs. I still haven't seen enough of the Ravens to trust them yet. We could soon enter a period like the late 1990s and early 2000s, when there's no clear dynasty and not as many Hall-of-Fame-caliber QBs.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Brady going away would be a huge blow. But in 2008 when Brady was IR'd the whole season, the Pats got 11 wins with Matt Cassel (who dat?)  at the helm. 
If BB has a chance to prepare for Brady no longer being the QB, he will look for better than his backup. Translation: Losing Brady does not end the Patriots dominance. My opinion.

Belichick has a knack for fixing problems. He doesn't always produce a SB winning team but  always produces a double-digit win, division winning team. Outside of that 2008 season where Brady was IR'd, the Pats have won the division every year back to 2002. That is a dominance the likes of which I've never seen and likely never will again. Same with y'all, not in salary cap era.

Also, ever notice how the Patriots are the one team that visits the super bowl and come back strong the next year? Since 2000, there have been 40 teams go to the bowl. Most of them are less than spectacular the next year. The last team to win back-to back championships is the 2003-04 patriots. Belichick knows how to keep the ball rolling, although no one knows his secret. As long as BB is there, the Patriots will never be Bengals, Lions, or Browns. They are always respectably in the game.

I'm concerned for my Patriots, of course. We always are. But whatever the future is, I'll be cheering them on. Go Patriots!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Who knows. I am pretty sure Belichick isn't leaving, so it is all about what happens to Brady and McDaniels.

Those who think Belichick is the prime reason for the success of this team, who comment repeatedly about how well the team has done with Cassel and Garoppolo and Brissett, they must think that Brady retiring or going to another team would not be the end of the era. Ditto the people who think Brady is done. They must be afraid of Brady retiring or leaving, right? Personally, I feel like Brady is still one of the better QBs in the league, but he absolutely is declining, and signing him to a big deal severely limits how well the team can rebuild around him for another championship run. But I also wouldn't blame Brady for wanting a big deal. He has always signed team-friendly deals.

Brady might see what materializes around him before he decides what to do. Will McDaniels leave? Say what you want about McDaniels, but he and Brady have a very close working relationship. If McDaniels went to the Browns, would the Browns be willing to get rid of Mayfield for a couple more seasons of Brady to chase a championship? I could see that being an attractive landing spot for Brady with the offensive weapons they have, but at the same time, I'm not sure he'd want to uproot his cosmopolitan family from the CT suburbs to go to Cleveland. Ditto the Panthers and Cam Newton, but that seems less likely.

I also feel like Brady has some incentive to stay with his whole TB12 business.

I do feel like Belichick wants to prove that he can win with another QB and realizes he will only be coaching for so long. Paying Brady top FA money throws a wrench in his ability to build toward that, and if it's a multiyear deal, that's the case even more.

Whatever does happen, I am fine with. Can't complain for the rest of my life as a Pats fan.

Edited by childofpudding
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Split the Sticks said:

Brady going away would be a huge blow. But in 2008 when Brady was IR'd the whole season, the Pats got 11 wins with Matt Cassel (who dat?)  at the helm. 

Yeah, but unfortunately, the infrastructure is completely different. We returned almost ALL the starters from an 16-0 season (and still dropped 5 games...pretty drastic, 16-0 to 11-5 doesn't sound bad, but what about 9-7 to 4-12?). So we had a good situation with plenty of pieces to make up for TB's loss.

We fundamentally don't have that now. Brady isn't the same, but the drop off in talent elsewhere is drastic compared to the 08 situation. Imagine Stidham trying to make it work with our receivers and OL....then imagine he had Moss, Welker, etc. 

Again, Tom isn't the same, but I think we NEED him back

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Teddy Bridgewater is a Free Agent. I think the stars are aligned for him t get signed by the Pats unless there's cap issues they can't get around.

Drew Brees looks extremely likely to return for at least 1 more season and Taysom Hill seems to be the next man up though only because Bridgewater is a free agent this year.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...