turtle28 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 (edited) I wish Snyder would have hired Rick Smith, he built most of the current Texans but if Ron Rivera wants Morocco Brown, who used to be with the Redskins last decade - and it’s rumored he does - Rivera should get who he wants. Edited January 5, 2020 by turtle28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naptownskinsfan Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 I know that some may criticize Snyder here, and rightfully so, but what if the decision came down to Rick Smith getting cold feet because he was afraid of the specter of Bruce Allen hanging over some part of the organization? Ultimately, I feel that you need an extra layer of a team president/GM responsible for a long-term vision with a head coach executing it on the field. Having a head coach be in charge of the long-term vision as well presents a problem, as the head coach usually wants to win. The way we are going about this is not a collaborative effort, or a top-down effort, and those are what work. Coach-centered does not work unless you are named Bill Belichick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted January 5, 2020 Author Share Posted January 5, 2020 (edited) 25 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said: I know that some may criticize Snyder here, and rightfully so, but what if the decision came down to Rick Smith getting cold feet because he was afraid of the specter of Bruce Allen hanging over some part of the organization? Ultimately, I feel that you need an extra layer of a team president/GM responsible for a long-term vision with a head coach executing it on the field. Having a head coach be in charge of the long-term vision as well presents a problem, as the head coach usually wants to win. The way we are going about this is not a collaborative effort, or a top-down effort, and those are what work. Coach-centered does not work unless you are named Bill Belichick. Coach centric has worked for building winners, there are several teams in the last 20 years where coaches have had final say and they win, we did that with Gibbs last decade. Coach centric hasn’t worked for building a dynasty but for the Patriots bc the only team that’s been a dynasty the last 20 years is the Patriots. So, it’s unfair to keep holding them up as the only example. Kyle Shanahan & Sean McDermott are young coaches who have final say and they have built winner. The Seahawks are a coach centric approach - Carrol has final say and they win. He’s been to two Super Bowls and won one! The Chiefs are a coach centric approach - Andy Reid has final say and they win. The Seahawks of last decade stole Holmgren away from the Packers with a coach centric approach, he built a winner out of a laughing stock and won a super bowl. I’m pretty sure Sean Payton also has final say, and if he doesn’t, he has damn near final say over the Saints. Jay Gruden had final say in Tampa and he won a super bowl. I also think we are going to hire a GM after the draft - like Morocco Brown - or we may keep Schafer as Team President and promote Kyle Smith if/when Ron gets to know them, work with them and we have another good offseason. I wish we had hired the GM first but at the same time I’m not going to overreact and say that Ron Rivera is going to fail bc we didn’t hire the GM first and bc Ron has final say on the players we acquire and keep on the roster. I get you don’t think much of Ron Rivera but I still don’t understand why you can’t give this a chance. I do think you are overreacting. Edited January 5, 2020 by turtle28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A TRAIN 89 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 15 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said: I know that some may criticize Snyder here, and rightfully so, but what if the decision came down to Rick Smith getting cold feet because he was afraid of the specter of Bruce Allen hanging over some part of the organization? Ultimately, I feel that you need an extra layer of a team president/GM responsible for a long-term vision with a head coach executing it on the field. Having a head coach be in charge of the long-term vision as well presents a problem, as the head coach usually wants to win. The way we are going about this is not a collaborative effort, or a top-down effort, and those are what work. Coach-centered does not work unless you are named Bill Belichick. Pete Carroll, Kyle Shanahan and Sean McDermott amongst others bed to differ. I’m not a fan of complete power, but it doesn’t seem like that is what Rivera wants. He’s stressed collaboration thus far. Only time will tell, but axing Bruce and hiring a respected coach is what everyone truly wanted. I think all fans just want football people making football decisions. The key here is that everyone is on the same page. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 After the draft they will hire a GM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naptownskinsfan Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 Pete Carroll and Andy Reid are collaborative examples. Carroll and Schneider were hired within a week of each other. Andy Reid came in with executives he knew from Philadelphia. Mickey Loomis is the GM of the Saints and the architect of their whole run, and Payton has nearly left a time or two as well. As for the Bills, Doug Whaley was there when McDermott was hired. But......they went the collaborative approach after the draft, where they replaced Whaley with someone that he knew from Carolina. As for Mike Holmgren, well, he had personnel power stripped from him, and then the team started succeeding, so I don't think he's a great example. And Jon Gruden is widely believed to have won with Tony Dungy's team. So if Kyle Smith is just getting an on-the-job interview and is in line for the GM job, great, this could work. But if this person is put in place that does not work well with Rivera and is not on the same page as Rivera, this is going to be a disaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted January 5, 2020 Author Share Posted January 5, 2020 24 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said: Pete Carroll and Andy Reid are collaborative examples. Carroll and Schneider were hired within a week of each other. Andy Reid came in with executives he knew from Philadelphia. Mickey Loomis is the GM of the Saints and the architect of their whole run, and Payton has nearly left a time or two as well. As for the Bills, Doug Whaley was there when McDermott was hired. But......they went the collaborative approach after the draft, where they replaced Whaley with someone that he knew from Carolina. As for Mike Holmgren, well, he had personnel power stripped from him, and then the team started succeeding, so I don't think he's a great example. And Jon Gruden is widely believed to have won with Tony Dungy's team. So if Kyle Smith is just getting an on-the-job interview and is in line for the GM job, great, this could work. But if this person is put in place that does not work well with Rivera and is not on the same page as Rivera, this is going to be a disaster. Rivera and Morocco Brown will also be a collaborative example unless you’re calling Rob Rivera liar before he even coaches his first game as a HC. He said he will work with the front office and decisions will be made collaboratively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted January 5, 2020 Author Share Posted January 5, 2020 1. Rick Smith 2. Morocco Brown 3. Bills assistant GM, Joe Schoen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naptownskinsfan Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 7 minutes ago, turtle28 said: Rivera and Morocco Brown will also be a collaborative example unless you’re calling Rob Rivera liar before he even coaches his first game as a HC. He said he will work with the front office and decisions will be made collaboratively. "I don't have patience for a five year rebuild, and from what I've heard, neither does he" "There is no one pure authority on this other than the owner" "If we have to continue to discuss things and it goes a little longer, then we will ask Mr Snyder to help" The truth from the mouth of Rivera tells me all I need to know about our "coach centered approach" so no need to put words in my mouth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostnote Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 The narrative here is, the team is too far down the draft path to bring in a guy that will subjectively change direction on what the rest of the team has been doing for the past 9 months. What needs to be understood is, that this team cannot rest solely on the Coach being the GM. After the draft, I expect a GM will come in, one that Rivera would be happy with, and a guy that will be able to work with Rivera to build a team that Rivera is going to want to work with. it would be nice to see Kyle Smith or Doug Williams or Eric Shafer to be Team President. I am in strong favor for Doug Williams, as he seems to be more apt to not be in control of everything like Bruce was. He also has a handle on the nuances of the draft and would let the people who are in charge of doing the draft, do their thing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted January 7, 2020 Author Share Posted January 7, 2020 2 hours ago, mike23md said: The narrative here is, the team is too far down the draft path to bring in a guy that will subjectively change direction on what the rest of the team has been doing for the past 9 months. What needs to be understood is, that this team cannot rest solely on the Coach being the GM. After the draft, I expect a GM will come in, one that Rivera would be happy with, and a guy that will be able to work with Rivera to build a team that Rivera is going to want to work with. it would be nice to see Kyle Smith or Doug Williams or Eric Shafer to be Team President. I am in strong favor for Doug Williams, as he seems to be more apt to not be in control of everything like Bruce was. He also has a handle on the nuances of the draft and would let the people who are in charge of doing the draft, do their thing. Plus Doug is such a great ambassador for the Redskins. A much better ambassador then Brice could ever hope to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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