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2020 Baltimore Ravens Offseason Tracker

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1 hour ago, DreamKid said:

In the extremely unlikely event that Yannick or Chris Jones actually make it to UFA, who would you guys prefer? 

I'm assuming it would Jones in a landslide. Never know though.

I'll take either or to be honest, but man, Yannick sounds really good in a Ravens uniform. And also go get McCoy because I still want 'em.

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Wow, I would be really torn between these two. We should have drafted Ngakoue, that was a true miss from us. Or we could say Jaguars just beat us on that one. 1 friggin pick and he would have been ours if we had double dipped on outside linebacker in that draft.

Interior pass rush and run stopping ability like what Chris Jones can do is rare. I would be happy with either.

Both are quite young so that isn't even a factor. They could easily be players who would receiver a second contract for us. 

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It's been mentioned by multiple posters in here already, but Calais Campbell really would be such an impact addition that it would be hard to even call him a 'consolation prize'. Maybe the most perfect fit for us in the league. On early downs he's an elite run defender at EDGE, and on long & late downs he can shift inside to create havoc from the interior. 

Say we sign Campbell and resign McPhee. All of a sudden our outside run defense goes from highly suspect to a legit strength. And we'll still have Brandon Williams on the inside. In that scenario we also create a much more comfortable situation for a high end EDGE prospect to walk into. Instead of immediately forcing said Rookie into an every down role, much like we did with Jaylon Ferguson, we could allow them to thrive & grow in a DPR/Rotational role similar to how Suggs was brought along.

Like Yannick, Calais isn't an UFA. The hope is the Jags cut him to save 15 mill. However, it's hard to predict what they'll do. Bouye isn't super young for a CB, and he had a down year- + the Jags FO did a good job of making their contracts flexible at the right time. And Dareus is guaranteed gone. So much is at play. From Yannick's potential contract to just how much damage Coughlin and Co. did to that locker room. We definitely have a vested interest in how things shake out over there.

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3 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

If it comes down to Yannick vs. Chris Jones, I'm taking Jones without thinking twice tbh

Like both, but that's where I'm at as well. He wins out easily when factoring in versatility and overall value. Elite pass rushing DIs are one of the rarest commodities in football.

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with WAS most definitely drafting Young at #2 it seems very likely they'll part with Kerrigan for a reasonable price. He's got one year left on his contract and 31 still has some top notch football left in him.

I expect DC to go hard after him.

Also, would not be surprised to see Judon join the Jets since Douglas loves his BMore guys.

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I think signing a plug and play ILB in FA would really open up the draft for us.

A guy like Cory Littleton or Joe Schobert - if they could be got for a decent price - would ensure we wouldn’t have to essentially pigeon-hole ourselves into taking a front 7 pick with one of our first two picks.

No, it isn’t the most popular thing spending $ on an ILB, but if the price is right - look at the difference in our defense when we actually have a good player there in the middle.

Daryl Smith was a bargain and certainly cheaper than what those 2 guys would net, but having a guy set in the middle before the draft would allow us to truly go BPA in that first/second round, be it WR/IOL/Pass Rush/...hell, even if a top tier CB talent falls.

 

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2 hours ago, Ray Reed said:

I think signing a plug and play ILB in FA would really open up the draft for us.

A guy like Cory Littleton or Joe Schobert - if they could be got for a decent price - would ensure we wouldn’t have to essentially pigeon-hole ourselves into taking a front 7 pick with one of our first two picks.

No, it isn’t the most popular thing spending $ on an ILB, but if the price is right - look at the difference in our defense when we actually have a good player there in the middle.

Daryl Smith was a bargain and certainly cheaper than what those 2 guys would net, but having a guy set in the middle before the draft would allow us to truly go BPA in that first/second round, be it WR/IOL/Pass Rush/...hell, even if a top tier CB talent falls.

 

Agreed. Unless it's a first round pick like Mosley, we don't really do much at developing lower round ILBs. Peanut was okay for a while but only next to Mosley. I think the Ravens D requires a lot of smarts at that position and its tough to evaluate which college players can handle the responsibilities. 

Van Noy and even our old friend Kamelei Correa could be productive as well, they'd fit our system.  

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53 minutes ago, AngusMcFife said:

Agreed. Unless it's a first round pick like Mosley, we don't really do much at developing lower round ILBs. Peanut was okay for a while but only next to Mosley. I think the Ravens D requires a lot of smarts at that position and its tough to evaluate which college players can handle the responsibilities. 

Van Noy and even our old friend Kamelei Correa could be productive as well, they'd fit our system.  

He probably still wants to throw hands with Harbaugh and friends. I don't see anyway he'd ever come back here, haha.

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I would not be surprised if Littleton gets $10-12m in FA this year.  

Schobert, or maybe Danny Trevathan, might be more likely

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13 hours ago, Ray Reed said:

I think signing a plug and play ILB in FA would really open up the draft for us.

A guy like Cory Littleton or Joe Schobert - if they could be got for a decent price - would ensure we wouldn’t have to essentially pigeon-hole ourselves into taking a front 7 pick with one of our first two picks.

No, it isn’t the most popular thing spending $ on an ILB, but if the price is right - look at the difference in our defense when we actually have a good player there in the middle.

Daryl Smith was a bargain and certainly cheaper than what those 2 guys would net, but having a guy set in the middle before the draft would allow us to truly go BPA in that first/second round, be it WR/IOL/Pass Rush/...hell, even if a top tier CB talent falls.

This is only true if we have already signed an edge and IDL. It’s much easier finding an impact ILB in the top few rounds of the draft then finding an impact pass rusher. So unless we’ve addressed those spots, signing an ILB wouldn’t really open much up. We were able to sign street free agents as an answer to the ILB position and they played at a very high level. The same was not true for the pass rush aspect.

10 hours ago, AngusMcFife said:

Agreed. Unless it's a first round pick like Mosley, we don't really do much at developing lower round ILBs. Peanut was okay for a while but only next to Mosley. I think the Ravens D requires a lot of smarts at that position and its tough to evaluate which college players can handle the responsibilities. 

Van Noy and even our old friend Kamelei Correa could be productive as well, they'd fit our system.  

Meh... I can’t agree.

The Harbaugh era has a long list of stabilization at the ILB position. We started with Bart Scott (UDFA) next to Ray. Then we developed Dannel Ellerbe (UDFA) and Albert McClellan (UDFA) as ILBs, (along with Brendan Ayenbadejo to a degree). We miss on Arthur Brown. Then we add Daryl Smith and CJ Mosley to stabilize the position. After Smith leaves we stabilize again with Zackary Orr (UDFA). Then he retires and we stabilize with Peanut (UDFA). Mosley leaves and we stabilized with bargain free agent signings leading us to now.

We've literally stabilized the ILB position with next to no draft/FA resources in comparison to the much longer list of misses with the pass rush weakness on the roster. Quite easily that’s the more important position to target in FA and high up in the draft. We’ve proven less apt at developing that position as we’ve spent a boatload of draft resources on the position and have only Zadarius Smith and Matt Judon to show for it... and Smith didn’t truly blossom (or get an opportunity to blossom) until his final season with us.

FWIW I do believe we’ve got something good developing with Tyus Bowser, but that still remains to be seen... what’s more he's not a game wrecker either.

Edited by diamondbull424
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10 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

The Harbaugh era has a long list of stabilization at the ILB position. We started with Bart Scott (UDFA) next to Ray. Then we developed Dannel Ellerbe (UDFA) and Albert McClellan (UDFA) as ILBs, (along with Brendan Ayenbadejo to a degree). We miss on Arthur Brown. Then we add Daryl Smith and CJ Mosley to stabilize the position. After Smith leaves we stabilize again with Zackary Orr (UDFA). Then he retires and we stabilize with Peanut (UDFA). Mosley leaves and we stabilized with bargain free agent signings leading us to now.

Good points, but I question how good some of those guys were since they were playing next to a good, intelligent ILB. Look at Peanut, we thought he was good but he really wasn't, it was Mosley who was taking all the difficult assignments. 

Bart Scott was really from the Billick era, his last year with Ravens was Harbaugh's first. 

Ellerbe played decently for 1/2 a season when Ray went down in 2012, but the defense really fell off at that time. He was good next to Ray in the playoffs but did nothing his whole career. He only started 14 games over 4 years for us. 

Ayenbadejo and McClellan were really special team players who could fill in at LB. Not starter quality. 

Zack Orr was good for one season next to Mosley. But he was more of a downhill player, if he were to have had the coverage assignments of Mosley he would have really struggled (like Peanut). 

My point is, if you don't have a stud ILB, all these complementary ILBs who played well in limited roles get exposed. Right now we need to find that stud player again. Unless we spend a first round pick on one, a good choice would be to get one through FA.  

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1 hour ago, AngusMcFife said:

Good points, but I question how good some of those guys were since they were playing next to a good, intelligent ILB. Look at Peanut, we thought he was good but he really wasn't, it was Mosley who was taking all the difficult assignments. 

Bart Scott was really from the Billick era, his last year with Ravens was Harbaugh's first. 

Ellerbe played decently for 1/2 a season when Ray went down in 2012, but the defense really fell off at that time. He was good next to Ray in the playoffs but did nothing his whole career. He only started 14 games over 4 years for us. 

Ayenbadejo and McClellan were really special team players who could fill in at LB. Not starter quality. 

Zack Orr was good for one season next to Mosley. But he was more of a downhill player, if he were to have had the coverage assignments of Mosley he would have really struggled (like Peanut). 

My point is, if you don't have a stud ILB, all these complementary ILBs who played well in limited roles get exposed. Right now we need to find that stud player again. Unless we spend a first round pick on one, a good choice would be to get one through FA.  

Meh... all this feels revisionist and excusing Mosley for his declining play. Sure Peanut struggled, but was it really Mosley leaving that caused it or just him? As LJ Fort and Josh Bynes had no trouble with playing well, Bynes notably was picked up off the street and had an outstanding season in CJ Mosleys same role with the more “difficult assignments”. Even then Peanut didn’t play to his same level, his blitzes weren’t as effective inside. Again he was an UDFA. We’ve only added one day two pick at the position under Harbaugh. There’s not enough precedent to say that a quality ILB prospect in the middle rounds, like Jacob Phillips, couldn’t grow into a stud.

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9 hours ago, diamondbull424 said:

This is only true if we have already signed an edge and IDL. It’s much easier finding an impact ILB in the top few rounds of the draft then finding an impact pass rusher. So unless we’ve addressed those spots, signing an ILB wouldn’t really open much up. We were able to sign street free agents as an answer to the ILB position and they played at a very high level. The same was not true for the pass rush aspect.

Meh... I can’t agree.

The Harbaugh era has a long list of stabilization at the ILB position. We started with Bart Scott (UDFA) next to Ray. Then we developed Dannel Ellerbe (UDFA) and Albert McClellan (UDFA) as ILBs, (along with Brendan Ayenbadejo to a degree). We miss on Arthur Brown. Then we add Daryl Smith and CJ Mosley to stabilize the position. After Smith leaves we stabilize again with Zackary Orr (UDFA). Then he retires and we stabilize with Peanut (UDFA). Mosley leaves and we stabilized with bargain free agent signings leading us to now.

We've literally stabilized the ILB position with next to no draft/FA resources in comparison to the much longer list of misses with the pass rush weakness on the roster. Quite easily that’s the more important position to target in FA and high up in the draft. We’ve proven less apt at developing that position as we’ve spent a boatload of draft resources on the position and have only Zadarius Smith and Matt Judon to show for it... and Smith didn’t truly blossom (or get an opportunity to blossom) until his final season with us.

FWIW I do believe we’ve got something good developing with Tyus Bowser, but that still remains to be seen... what’s more he's not a game wrecker either.

Disagree.

Signing a guy we’re confident that can hold down a starting ILB job day 1 would absolutely open up our draft.

It would mean that we could theoretically take WR/Pass Rush/IOL and feel just as good about any of it, and then keep the draft flowing with no real anxiety. 

If we don’t bring in an ILB in FA we are virtually guaranteed to take a front 7 defensive player with one of our first two draft picks. It gives us much less leeway to go true BPA rounds 1-4 if we need an ILB AND a Pass Rusher that can contribute right away.

Take away the ILB need via FA and all we really pigeon-hole ourselves into doing is taking a pass rusher in the first 4 rounds. 

All of this isn’t accounting for acquiring a pass rusher pre-draft, btw. If we were able to somehow land via FA or trade an ILB AND a good pass rusher we could very well see the truest BPA draft we’ve seen in forever around here.

Edited by Ray Reed
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7 hours ago, diamondbull424 said:

Meh... all this feels revisionist and excusing Mosley for his declining play. Sure Peanut struggled, but was it really Mosley leaving that caused it or just him? As LJ Fort and Josh Bynes had no trouble with playing well, Bynes notably was picked up off the street and had an outstanding season in CJ Mosleys same role with the more “difficult assignments”. Even then Peanut didn’t play to his same level, his blitzes weren’t as effective inside. Again he was an UDFA. We’ve only added one day two pick at the position under Harbaugh. There’s not enough precedent to say that a quality ILB prospect in the middle rounds, like Jacob Phillips, couldn’t grow into a stud.

Fair enough. I think Fort and Bynes were okay, but only compared to the outright terrible play by Peanut, Board, and Young. Those three were so terrible, that even mediocre play seems good in comparison. Also from game 7 or so on our offense was on absolute fire, allowing our defense to rely on our great secondary and not expose weaker components. 

I'm not against adding at middle round ILB prospect, but honestly I wouldn't have much faith in him developing. Once you get that far down in the draft, its 50/50 whether the guy will even be in the league in a few years, let alone be a competent starter. 

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