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18 minutes ago, Gmen said:

I brought up the ESPN grades to disprove your perception that Fields is on a different level as a prospect than Manziel, etc.  There is nothing subjective in the chart posted by Lee.  It’s an objective analysis comparing received draft value in all trade up scenarios where a QB is drafted since 2002.  I don’t think this should be that difficult to grasp for someone working in analytics tbh.  It’s simply a linear combination of weights. 

Not sure why you're so confrontational, but a lot missing here.

For the ESPN argument to have any relevance it would need to hold true for everyone on the list, which it most certainly doesn't (Not all these guys are grouped in the same tier as Fields). If that were the case, sequentially, you would be arguing that every quarterback was perceived equally as a prospect -- that really a stance you want to take?

Moreover, using ESPN as a baseline is subjective in and of itself, is it not? I for one didn't have Johnny Football ranked anywhere near Justin Fields coming out. The lack of standardized grading makes the entire analysis intuitive to the individual running the report. By simply swapping ESPN criteria, which again isn't even being held constant here, with another 'objective' source, the results could change drastically. 

The irony in all this is that we're arguing two different things. I don't care the chart is objective in what it seeks to accomplish, by dismissing 'quality of prospect' it has no bearing on the value acquired (Justin Fields) as it relates to individual circumstance.

Slicing up data is the easy part, knowing how to extrapolate said data to a given circumstance is entirely different. Just because your calculations are structurally sound, doesn't mean they're worth a damn.

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14 hours ago, NJC33 said:

Not sure why you're so confrontational, but a lot missing here.

For the ESPN argument to have any relevance it would need to hold true for everyone on the list, which it most certainly doesn't (Not all these guys are grouped in the same tier as Fields). If that were the case, sequentially, you would be arguing that every quarterback was perceived equally as a prospect -- that really a stance you want to take?

Moreover, using ESPN as a baseline is subjective in and of itself, is it not? I for one didn't have Johnny Football ranked anywhere near Justin Fields coming out. The lack of standardized grading makes the entire analysis intuitive to the individual running the report. By simply swapping ESPN criteria, which again isn't even being held constant here, with another 'objective' source, the results could change drastically. 

The irony in all this is that we're arguing two different things. I don't care the chart is objective in what it seeks to accomplish, by dismissing 'quality of prospect' it has no bearing on the value acquired (Justin Fields) as it relates to individual circumstance.

Slicing up data is the easy part, knowing how to extrapolate said data to a given circumstance is entirely different. Just because your calculations are structurally sound, doesn't mean they're worth a damn.

Draft position correlates with QB prospect grade. Obviously with some amount of variance, particularly as we go deeper into the draft.  But I think using draft position as a proxy for prospect quality is worth the trade off of  not having to introduce subjectivity into this analysis. 

So no, I don’t think you should value the #11 pick higher just because your perception is that Justin Fields should have been drafted higher.

Its almost like you want to make this subjective so then you can say - this is worthless because it’s subjective 😂

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So, can anyone sell me on Brady Christensen as a LT for Carolina? I feel like this is another example of a Seattle guy taking mid-round flyers and just hoping something sticks. Nothing I have seen from him at any point suggested to me he was a LT in the NFL. Am I missing it? Overall I thought out draft was alright, but passing on guys like Little and Cosmi to trade down repeatedly and end up with Christensen is painfully disappointing.

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5 minutes ago, Cypher said:

So, can anyone sell me on Brady Christensen as a LT for Carolina? I feel like this is another example of a Seattle guy taking mid-round flyers and just hoping something sticks. Nothing I have seen from him at any point suggested to me he was a LT in the NFL. Am I missing it? Overall I thought out draft was alright, but passing on guys like Little and Cosmi to trade down repeatedly and end up with Christensen is painfully disappointing.

I thought he was pretty much undraftable

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Bottom 5/Top 5 drafts, according to Jeezla:

Bottom 5
LAR
GB
IND
LV
WFT

 

Top 5
CAR
DET
JAX
MIA
NYG
 

Honorable mention good draft
NYJ
PIT
TEN (If Farley is healthy)
DEN
BAL
ATL
 

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2 hours ago, Jeezla said:

Bottom 5/Top 5 drafts, according to Jeezla:

Bottom 5
LAR
GB
IND
LV
WFT
 

I'm not saying we had a top one, but I didn't expect to see us in anyone's bottom drafts either. 

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2 hours ago, Jeezla said:

Bottom 5/Top 5 drafts, according to Jeezla:

Bottom 5
LAR
GB
IND
LV
WFT

 

Top 5
CAR
DET
JAX
MIA
NYG
 

Honorable mention good draft
NYJ
PIT
TEN (If Farley is healthy)
DEN
BAL
ATL
 

Are you honestly saying that we had the worst draft? Dude. 

 

Okay, we probably did. 

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13 hours ago, Jeezla said:

Bottom 5/Top 5 drafts, according to Jeezla:

Bottom 5
LAR
GB
IND
LV
WFT

 

Top 5
CAR
DET
JAX
MIA
NYG
 

Honorable mention good draft
NYJ
PIT
TEN (If Farley is healthy)
DEN
BAL
ATL
 

So, according to you, Cleveland didn't even have a top 11 draft?

Strongly disagree with that.

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1 hour ago, DawgX said:

So, according to you, Cleveland didn't even have a top 11 draft?

Strongly disagree with that.

Forgot to put Cleveland in honorable mention

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34 minutes ago, Jeezla said:

Don't really care for your draft besides Amari.

Again, I'd ask why?  Other then the agility scores, he tested like an elite CB prospect which shows up in the tape.  And it's not like the ball skills are non-existent.  Unless you think the COD skills are going to keep him from succeeding, he's a good pick that late in the draft.  Josh Myers is a plug 'n play C.  He offers some positional versatility, but he's going to slide into that C position quite nicely.  Amari Rodgers is a body type they haven't had since Randall Cobb left, and slides in as a slot WR and return man.  Think their 5th round picks are solid developmental types, and then grabbed a slew of ST players in the 6th and 7th rounds of the draft.  It's nothing special, but I think it's a solid draft.  Just off the top of my head, I'd say Houston, LA Rams, Seattle, Dallas, and Las Vegas had worse drafts.

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Well the Jalen Ramsey trade is finally done all picks are spent. I think it's one of those rare trades that each side won. Regardless of the players taken dumping Ramsey who didn't want to be there and losing a few extra games that he might have helped them win allowed them to end up with Lawrence. Win win situation IMO. 

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9 hours ago, Jeezla said:

Forgot to put Cleveland in honorable mention

 

10 hours ago, DawgX said:

So, according to you, Cleveland didn't even have a top 5 draft?

Strongly disagree with that.

 

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