New Derek Carr thread

[BayRaider]

2 minutes ago, Blazer026 said:

I think Love could be but definitely not year 1. And I don’t think Tua is falling to use. 

Fair enough but you mentioned Burrow. 

[OG_C2X]

39 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

I don’t think Eason and Love will be better than Carr,  either.

Nice Madden sim lol.  Brady isn’t coming here but if he would Carr’s instantly dead to us.  I also don’t believe Carr could fetch a 2nd round pick, unless it’s to Chicago.  I think he’d get us a 3rd (well them it’d be some sort of “2nd plus x for 3rd and Carr” swap.  I think (Just off my head) their the only team that needs a game manager to be a contender and isn’t in rebuild mode and would value (due to limited cap) Carr’s low cap hit versus going into and paying more for Bridgewater, etc in FA.

I said it's not realistic.

Getting a mid to late 2nd (PIT @49) and a 2021 first isn't that far off FYI.

I believe that neither Gruden or Mayock want to move on from Carr so that is why I don't think Brady comes to Vegas... BUT if Carr ISN'T Gruden's guy and he approached Brady and we would pay him what he wanted, I think Vegas would be his first choice. Top 3 OL. Top 3 TE. Top 4 RB. Renefrow, Tyrell and a WR @12 with Gruden calling the offense. And that is the best offense Brady has ever had. 

 

 

[bucksavage1]

I'm reserving my opinion on the Draftable QBs until the evaluation starts and ends. (Senior Bowl, combine, workouts, )

[OG_C2X]

40 minutes ago, bucksavage1 said:

Tom Brady just showed up at the UFC fight in Vegas

The ovation was crazy. 

[BayRaider]

With Brady (who is without question still a Top 5 QB. Bottom 5 OL and #32 WR/TE core this season), a WR at Pick 12, Top 5 OL, Tyrell/Renfrow/Waller, Josh Jacobs, Gruden play calling, I think we’d have the 3rd or 4th best Offense in the NFL. 

We can even win the whole dang thing if we get a good defensive player at 19, maybe a corner or linebacker. 
 

We are not as far off as anyone thinks. Everyone predicted Niners as a 9-7 wildcard team this year. Everyone predicted the Eagles as a 9-7 wildcard team in 2017. 

 

[jimkelly02]

2 hours ago, bucksavage1 said:

means nothing but he did

that was 100% mockery,, no offense

[ragingraider]

There havre been many options presented to move on from Carr. For some, these options don't excite them. So the argument is not whether or not Carr is our guy, the argument is really about, how bad is he? Most people who post aren't arguing that Carr is good, they are arguing that there isn't a better option. Those of us who gave him this season to show are ready to roll the dice. 

I will not speak for others, but I would argue that there is very little that Carr is offering us at this point that Rivers or Dalton wouldn't do at half the price. If you want to build the team, let's get rid of a terribly overpriced player and invest those dollars in a young player that we can get in free agency. The fact that people think we can get a 2nd rounder for a bottom five QB who is 25 million a year is laughable. Nobody is giving us a second round pick so that they can have Carr be thier starter and pay him 25 mil. We aren't getting anything for him at that price. The teams that need a QB will be drafting them. Their is nobody in a worse position with an overpriced QB than us. Cam Newton has way more potential upside for a return to form and he is only 19 mil. 

Trade Carr if possible take whatever we can get otherwise cut him. Sign a vet. Dalton would probably be my first choice. He's serviceable. Pay him 12 million. Take the extra 13 million we save and sign a young star defensive player to a 4 year deal. Boom! already better off. If Gruden and Mayock like Love or Eason grab them and develop them this year. 

Here's a trade that might work- Carr and #19 for Colts #34, #44. This is about what I think it would take to get someone who even needs a QB to trade for the expensive Carr option.

We get Dalton as a starter. WR1 at #12 Ceedee Lamb. We take Qb Love or Eason at #34 to develop, CB #44 and more defense with our three third round picks unless a to RB is there. We take the 13 million we save on Carr and get Littleton in free agency along with Armstead and a FA CB Roby, Alexander, Jones. 

The extra pick and cap space make us a better team. We aren't getting our money's worth out of Carr and we can improve the roster by replacing him.

Ultimately, on this side of the debate we are arguing that Carr is more dead weight than helpful. The other side feels he is adequate and the team doesn't have a better option. 

I would argue it isn't hard to find a bottom five starter in the league. Glennon or Kizer could hardly do worse than being among the worst starting QB in the league. They would accomplish the feat at a fraction of the price.

[oakdb36]

3 hours ago, ragingraider said:

I will not speak for others, but I would argue that there is very little that Carr is offering us at this point that Rivers or Dalton wouldn't do at half the price. If you want to build the team, let's get rid of a terribly overpriced player and invest those dollars in a young player that we can get in free agency. The fact that people think we can get a 2nd rounder for a bottom five QB who is 25 million a year is laughable. Nobody is giving us a second round pick so that they can have Carr be thier starter and pay him 25 mil. We aren't getting anything for him at that price. The teams that need a QB will be drafting them. Their is nobody in a worse position with an overpriced QB than us. Cam Newton has way more potential upside for a return to form and he is only 19 mil.

Highly doubt Rivers and Dalton would come at half the price.

Any team that would trade for Carr would get him for 19M in 2020 and under 20M until 2022.

In 2019, Flacco got traded for a 4th at 34 years old, coming off a season in which he was benched. Rosen got traded for a 2nd.

[OG_C2X]

Sam bradford was making 18 million in 2016 and the eagles got a 1st and some for his scrub ***. 

[Darbsk]

7 hours ago, bucksavage1 said:

Tom Brady just showed up at the UFC fight in Vegas

Maybe he's going to challenge Carr to a fight for the privelage of leading the Raiders back to the promised land 😀

All joking aside, watching Brady multiple times thus year I think old father time has caught up with him, Patriots are still his best shot if they'll retain him.

[Chali21]

1 hour ago, Darbsk said:

Maybe he's going to challenge Carr to a fight for the privelage of leading the Raiders back to the promised land 😀

All joking aside, watching Brady multiple times thus year I think old father time has caught up with him, Patriots are still his best shot if they'll retain him.

I guess Dana White said that Brady to LV was real. Personally i think Brady is using the Raiders as leverage. He wants a big payday before he retires. When guys leave the NE bubble they don’t usually do well. If they let him walk I’m inclined to believe that there’s a reason. 

[big_palooka]

12 hours ago, Blazer026 said:

If we can upgrade from Carr I’m for it. I just don’t think we can unless it’s taking Burrow, which will never happen. 

If Healthy, Tua is on the same level of Burrow. Burrow is the hot name for obvious reason, but Tua is deserving of the #1 overall pick as well if he's recovered. 

If he slips at all I'd trade up for him in a heartbeat.

[Gannon12]

12 hours ago, jimkelly02 said:

Eason and Love need 2 years of development before starting.  Tua is going to be too costly (I really see a team trading up to #3 for him), not to mention I honestly don’t love him as a prospect.  
what the “Carr defenders” aka “Carr Insurance posters” are saying is we’ll certainly throw him The wolves if you offer us something better and logical.  I’ve yet to hear a single logic plan that has Carr released or traded this offseason.  Carr supporter don’t want to go into rebuild mode.  We all are down to draft a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round but there aren’t many great options.  
In a dream world Frohm falls to the 3rd and we draft him.  But even Frohm has very limited upside beyond what he is now.  He’d have to play Year 2 and most definitely struggle until mid year 3 and at best he’s a Carr with less arm.

the options are just so limited.  Maybe we should try to move 19 for a early 2nd and future 1st and prey we can parlay 2 ‘21 1sts into a Lawrence or fields?

2 Years seems a little ridiculous to just throw numbers out there like that. Maybe a year maybe just the offseason you never know how quickly a rookie can progress and digest.
If the medicals check out on Tua I wouldn’t be surprised if we made a move in the draft for him he has immense talent and potential.

The whole find a replacement for Carr myth isn’t that ridiculous to replace basically the healthy version of Sam Bradford’s play. Ultra Conservative checkdown with a strong run game offense. 

I trust what Mayock and Gruden will do if they keep Carr or move on. 

[Darbsk]

8 hours ago, ragingraider said:

There havre been many options presented to move on from Carr. For some, these options don't excite them. So the argument is not whether or not Carr is our guy, the argument is really about, how bad is he? Most people who post aren't arguing that Carr is good, they are arguing that there isn't a better option. Those of us who gave him this season to show are ready to roll the dice. 

I will not speak for others, but I would argue that there is very little that Carr is offering us at this point that Rivers or Dalton wouldn't do at half the price. If you want to build the team, let's get rid of a terribly overpriced player and invest those dollars in a young player that we can get in free agency. The fact that people think we can get a 2nd rounder for a bottom five QB who is 25 million a year is laughable. Nobody is giving us a second round pick so that they can have Carr be thier starter and pay him 25 mil. We aren't getting anything for him at that price. The teams that need a QB will be drafting them. Their is nobody in a worse position with an overpriced QB than us. Cam Newton has way more potential upside for a return to form and he is only 19 mil. 

Trade Carr if possible take whatever we can get otherwise cut him. Sign a vet. Dalton would probably be my first choice. He's serviceable. Pay him 12 million. Take the extra 13 million we save and sign a young star defensive player to a 4 year deal. Boom! already better off. If Gruden and Mayock like Love or Eason grab them and develop them this year. 

Here's a trade that might work- Carr and #19 for Colts #34, #44. This is about what I think it would take to get someone who even needs a QB to trade for the expensive Carr option.

We get Dalton as a starter. WR1 at #12 Ceedee Lamb. We take Qb Love or Eason at #34 to develop, CB #44 and more defense with our three third round picks unless a to RB is there. We take the 13 million we save on Carr and get Littleton in free agency along with Armstead and a FA CB Roby, Alexander, Jones. 

The extra pick and cap space make us a better team. We aren't getting our money's worth out of Carr and we can improve the roster by replacing him.

Ultimately, on this side of the debate we are arguing that Carr is more dead weight than helpful. The other side feels he is adequate and the team doesn't have a better option. 

I would argue it isn't hard to find a bottom five starter in the league. Glennon or Kizer could hardly do worse than being among the worst starting QB in the league. They would accomplish the feat at a fraction of the price.

I vehemently disagree that Carr is a bottom 5 QB, I dont know how many other teams you've watched this year but that is an absurd notion. 

Can we improve? Yes, but we can do an awful lot worse too. I'd take Carr over half the QBs in the league at least, but that's just me   

[BackinBlack]

16 hours ago, BayRaider said:

That poll was purely for keeping Carr for the 2020 season. 
 

Those 21 people, about 13-14 of them are on record, actual posts, saying they don’t think Carr is the long term answer at all. 
 

Anyways, doesn’t matter what any of us think. It matters what Mayock and Gruden think. And I trust those guys whatever decision they make. 

buddy, you gotta just take the loss on this lol. werent you saying there is no way he gets more than 14 votes?

agreed though, its all on mayock and gruden, and i absolutely trust mayock. 
i actually have a little less interest in the draft and i feel its because i know mayock will kill it haha