2020 Titans Off-Season

[TitanSS]

6 minutes ago, TitanRedd said:

Dude I just said that Henry didn’t get a 100 yards to week 13 that year I know the stats, but you know what change what happened 🗣The titans gave him the Dam football vrabel realized he’s not a RB by committee he needs touches he’s a workhorse, it’s not that he couldn’t beat out Lewis the coaching staff was hell bent on getting their money’s worth from a guy they gave 18 mill dollars to.. & when they have him them football we started winning games oh here’s another fact 🗣 TN is undefeated when Henry rushes over a 100 yards look it up bucko

He got more touches because when we had a competent QB we were actually winning towards the end of the game, thus able to hand the ball off to close the game rather than pass to try to come back. This is the famous "teams that win run the ball" argument that has been debunked a thousand times. You sound like Booger McFarland right now.

Teams losing in the second half, especially the 4th quarter, tend to throw the ball to catch up because passing is the most efficient way to score points. Teams that are winning in the 2nd half, especially the 4th quarter, tend to run the ball more to shorten the game. 

You didn't discover anything new, nor is this fact specific to the Titans or Derrick Henry. 

We're 3-0 when Ryan Tannehill has 2+ QB kneels. Maybe we should try to incorporate that into our game-plan as well? (This is basically your argument, you just don't realize it)

 

Edited January 23, 2020 by TitanSS

[titans0021]

I’m entirely on board with the bring everyone back offseason. Logan being the biggest piece I’d be willing to let walk.

I fully understand not wanting to commit big money to a RB. Historically, it virtually never works out. I also thoroughly believe that there is a lot about Henry that cannot be measured analytically. His value as a leader in the locker room and the long-term benefit of demonstrating that you will reward players that work their ***** off and develop into special players.

Also, there is an absolute psychological advantage to having him in the backfield. The line knows he rarely goes down at first contact. And he’s just an intimidating looking dude. When he gets in space, defensive backs don’t want to tackle him. I truly believe that he can just break the spirit of a defense in a way that almost no other back can.

With that said, he benefitted from Tannehill, just as much if not more, than Tannehill benefitted from Henry. RT puts pressure on a defense with his legs, the edge can’t crash down hard on the outside zone run because of that threat. His arm allows us to test defenses deep and take advantage of stacked boxes. 

In the end, my problem with people wanting to let Henry walk OR willing to let RT go and sign Brady is simple. Why? Why is it even something we should consider? We just went 9-4 with three of the losses coming to good/great teams (and in two of them, Henry was hurt) with the two of them serving as the focal points of one of the highest scoring offenses in football.

If we were in a rough spot cap-wise, maybe it’s a discussion worth having. But we can pretty easily get to nearly $80 million in cap space, we can retain every major FA over the next couple years without any real issue. Sure, we might not be able to make splash moves in FA, but that’s what happens when you’re a good team.

 

[TitanRedd]

44 minutes ago, TitanSS said:

He got more touches because when we had a competent QB we were actually winning towards the end of the game, thus able to hand the ball off to close the game rather than pass to try to come back. This is the famous "teams that win run the ball" argument that has been debunked a thousand times. You sound like Booger McFarland right now.

Teams losing in the second half, especially the 4th quarter, tend to throw the ball to catch up because passing is the most efficient way to score points. Teams that are winning in the 2nd half, especially the 4th quarter, tend to run the ball more to shorten the game. 

You didn't discover anything new, nor is this fact specific to the Titans or Derrick Henry. 

We're 3-0 when Ryan Tannehill has 2+ QB kneels. Maybe we should try to incorporate that into our game-plan as well? (This is basically your argument, you just don't realize it)

 

Wrong h got more touches because we were going to run the ball regardless keep telling yo self that you’ll actually believe it. I just gave you his stats his 1st 6 games the titans were going to give him the nap regardless who was at QB & that OL gone move what’s ever in front of them..

[TitanRedd]

7 minutes ago, titans0021 said:

I’m entirely on board with the bring everyone back offseason. Logan being the biggest piece I’d be willing to let walk.

I fully understand not wanting to commit big money to a RB. Historically, it virtually never works out. I also thoroughly believe that there is a lot about Henry that cannot be measured analytically. His value as a leader in the locker room and the long-term benefit of demonstrating that you will reward players that work their ***** off and develop into special players.

Also, there is an absolute psychological advantage to having him in the backfield. The line knows he rarely goes down at first contact. And he’s just an intimidating looking dude. When he gets in space, defensive backs don’t want to tackle him. I truly believe that he can just break the spirit of a defense in a way that almost no other back can.

With that said, he benefitted from Tannehill, just as much if not more, than Tannehill benefitted from Henry. RT puts pressure on a defense with his legs, the edge can’t crash down hard on the outside zone run because of that threat. His arm allows us to test defenses deep and take advantage of stacked boxes. 

In the end, my problem with people wanting to let Henry walk OR willing to let RT go and sign Brady is simple. Why? Why is it even something we should consider? We just went 9-4 with three of the losses coming to good/great teams (and in two of them, Henry was hurt) with the two of them serving as the focal points of one of the highest scoring offenses in football.

If we were in a rough spot cap-wise, maybe it’s a discussion worth having. But we can pretty easily get to nearly $80 million in cap space, we can retain every major FA over the next couple years without any real issue. Sure, we might not be able to make splash moves in FA, but that’s what happens when you’re a good team.

 

I’m ready to see what Amani hooker is made of he’s basically was drafted to be his replacement I believe 

[dtait93]

1 hour ago, TitanSS said:

You all can try to spin it however you want, but Derrick Henry hadn't done jack **** in his career, save for a couple random games spread out over 3.5 years, prior to Ryan Tannehill taking over. He averaged 3.7 YPC this season before Tannehill started as well.

You pulling this 3.5 number like his first 2 years wasn't because he was the backup behind Murray is funny. And even still, he was still pretty efficient averaging 4.5 and 4.2 ypc and 5 TD's each season with the carries he did get, and then he flashed his potential against KC in the wildcard.

Now, let's look at the other 2 years - 2018 and 2019:

It's been well noted he ran like a puss in 2018 to the point where we were looking to trade him, nobody is denying that. And then Eddie got in his head. That conversation took place after the Chargers game and after that he went from 3.25 ypc in weeks 1-7 to 4.56 ypc in weeks 8-12 during which he had to regain the trust of the coaches, and he did just that. The final quarter of the season is history. Nothing about that is random - he ran like trash wks 1-7 (self-admitted it), had to regain the trust of the coaches wks 8-12 (did it), and then was great to close out the season.

As for 2019, yes his start was not very good. But for you to leave out all other context besides the switch at QB is pretty ridiculous. 

Edited January 23, 2020 by dtait93

[TitanSS]

6 minutes ago, TitanRedd said:

Wrong h got more touches because we were going to run the ball regardless keep telling yo self that you’ll actually believe it. I just gave you his stats his 1st 6 games the titans were going to give him the nap regardless who was at QB & that OL gone move what’s ever in front of them..

He averaged 3.7 YPC in the first 6 games lol and got to 100 yards once. That's not exactly lighting the world on fire.

[TitanRedd]

1 minute ago, dtait93 said:

You pulling this 3.5 number like his first 2 years wasn't because he was the backup behind Murray is funny. And even still, he was still pretty efficient averaging 4.5 and 4.2 ypc and 5 TD's each season with the carries he did get, and then he flashed his potential against KC in the wildcard.

Now, let's look at the other 2 years - 2018 and 2019:

It's been well noted he ran like a puss in 2018 to the point where we were looking to trade him, nobody is denying that. And then Eddie got in his head. That conversation took place after the Chargers game and after that he went from 3.25 ypc in weeks 1-7 to 4.56 ypc in weeks 8-12 during which he had to regain the trust of the coaches, and he did just that. The final quarter of the season is history. Nothing about that is random - he ran like trash wks 1-7 (self-admitted it), had to regain the trust of the coaches wks 8-12 (did it), and he hasn't looked back since.

As for 2019, yes his start was very good. But for you to leave out all other context besides the switch at QB is pretty ridiculous. 

Have we not seen Eddie George Carey the titans offense when steve McNair wasn’t a good QB did we not see Adrian Peterson carry Christian ponder like we’re a run 1st team defenses aren’t scared of Tannehill they load up the box to stop 1 man 🤷🏽‍♂️

[TitanSS]

5 minutes ago, dtait93 said:

You pulling this 3.5 number like his first 2 years wasn't because he was the backup behind Murray is funny. And even still, he was still pretty efficient averaging 4.5 and 4.2 ypc and 5 TD's each season with the carries he did get, and then he flashed his potential against KC in the wildcard.

Now, let's look at the other 2 years - 2018 and 2019:

It's been well noted he ran like a puss in 2018 to the point where we were looking to trade him, nobody is denying that. And then Eddie got in his head. That conversation took place after the Chargers game and after that he went from 3.25 ypc in weeks 1-7 to 4.56 ypc in weeks 8-12 during which he had to regain the trust of the coaches, and he did just that. The final quarter of the season is history. Nothing about that is random - he ran like trash wks 1-7 (self-admitted it), had to regain the trust of the coaches wks 8-12 (did it), and he hasn't looked back since.

As for 2019, yes his start was very good. But for you to leave out all other context besides the switch at QB is pretty ridiculous. 

You don't have to convince me that Derrick Henry is a good RB. I already believe that and I'm not trying to discredit that.

However, the idea that he carried this team last year is just a total farce and was easily disproven.

And I understand he was behind Demarco Murray. In year 1 that is a legitimate excuse. In year 2 Murray was a shell of his former self, averaged 3.6 YPC, and there is literally no reason Henry couldn't get on the field over him outside of the fact that he wasn't getting it done either most of the time. His last four games in 2017 are 2.5, 2.7, 3.1, and 1.8 YPC. He had some better performances prior to that, but yet again his bulk stats are really held together by two outliar performances that don't accurately represent what he really was the rest of the season.

And when I say that I don't mean that he's not a good RB, because he is. What I mean is that a RBs performance is so incredibly dependant on OL performance that it's ridiculous to pay them that much. He's a good RB, but no RB, no matter how good, is overcoming awful OL play.

Edited January 23, 2020 by TitanSS

[TitanRedd]

2 minutes ago, TitanSS said:

He averaged 3.7 YPC in the first 6 games lol and got to 100 yards once. That's not exactly lighting the world on fire.

It’s a long season dude go back and look at Adrian Peterson 2000k yard MVP season how he start off, you must forgot Lewan was missing the 1st 4 games & Davis was Raw & struggling when it’s all said & done the coaching staff trust Derrick Henry before Tannehill so there’s your argument 😩🤣🤣🤣

[TitanRedd]

1 minute ago, TitanSS said:

You don't have to convince me that Derrick Henry is a good RB. I already believe that and I'm not trying to discredit that.

However, the idea that he carried this team last year is just a total farce and was easily disproven.

Cause you’re taking the word carry the wrong way, we know Tannehill plays a role & was good but it’s fact he is our offense he were it starts with we run to setup the pass 

[dtait93]

9 minutes ago, TitanSS said:

You don't have to convince me that Derrick Henry is a good RB. I already believe that and I'm not trying to discredit that.

However, the idea that he carried this team last year is just a total farce and was easily disproven.

That's fine and all (and I'm not arguing he carried the team that was never my argument in the first place), but you can't say 2016-2018 and beginning of 2019 Henry was random. It was clear why he produced the way he produced. It doesn't matter anyways, he is the player he is now.

Edited January 23, 2020 by dtait93

[dtait93]

14 minutes ago, TitanRedd said:

Have we not seen Eddie George Carey the titans offense when steve McNair wasn’t a good QB did we not see Adrian Peterson carry Christian ponder like we’re a run 1st team defenses aren’t scared of Tannehill they load up the box to stop 1 man 🤷🏽‍♂️

It says a lot that every team we faced besides NE considered Henry as the primary threat to stop. When NE flipped that script Tannehill was terrible.

[TitanSS]

2 minutes ago, dtait93 said:

It says a lot that every team we faced besides NE considered Henry as the primary threat to stop. When NE flipped that script Tannehill was terrible.

It also says a lot that the greatest defensive mind of our generation found the best way to stop our offense and it contradicts conventional wisdom. Stats are great, but the goal of an offense isn't to put up yards or to have the longest TOP. It's to score points and all that other stuff is nothing but a by-product of that.

[dtait93]

5 minutes ago, TitanSS said:

It also says a lot that the greatest defensive mind of our generation found the best way to stop our offense and it contradicts conventional wisdom. Stats are great, but the goal of an offense isn't to put up yards or to have the longest TOP. It's to score points and all that other stuff is nothing but a by-product of that.

At the same time, KC considered Henry the primary threat, stopped him, and our offense scored 3 more points than it did against NE until a fluke fake punt made the score board prettier.

[TitanSS]

7 minutes ago, dtait93 said:

At the same time, KC considered Henry the primary threat, stopped him, and our offense scored 3 more points than it did against NE until a fluke fake punt made the score board prettier.

Then we need to get better as a passing offense, not invest more into a RB that was easily stopped by the team that's going to be in every AFC Championship for the next 10 years.