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2020 Off-season Discussion Thread

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1 hour ago, {Family Ghost} said:

Both of those decisions were mistakes.  If Gute makes another mistake in keeping Graham it will make him look incompetent. 

 

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1 hour ago, {Family Ghost} said:

Cobb had a nice 2019 .. didn't look like he had any legs left the previous few seasons when Gute had decisions to make.

So like he grew miracle legs or? I think he moved from Cobb as soon as anyone shouldve moved from him. Put in a healthyish season and didnt produce. I dont think you look at that and say it was stupid. It was a fine gamble considering the pieces at play. Sometimes gambles dont work, doesnt mean that wasnt the move.

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7 hours ago, Malfatron said:

TJ Watt > Kevin King

Was upset when it happened and still am ...  Watt over King all day long.

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13 hours ago, Outpost31 said:

Letting him go was kinda dumb.

Letting Breeland go was only dumb in hindsight.  With what we thought at the time, it was the proper move.  We had what looked like a promising UDFA in Crazy Tony, and a second round pick in Josh Jackson.  If we had let either go at the time instead of Breeland, everyone here would have been extremely angry.  He did well, good for him.  He is like a crap version of Casey Hayward.  Now we wish we had him, but it made sense at the time to move on.  

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6 hours ago, HighCalebR said:

So like he grew miracle legs or? I think he moved from Cobb as soon as anyone shouldve moved from him. Put in a healthyish season and didnt produce. I dont think you look at that and say it was stupid. It was a fine gamble considering the pieces at play. Sometimes gambles dont work, doesnt mean that wasnt the move.

I think he should have cut Cobb loose two years ago when he chose to cut Nelson loose.  I was basically trying to say that Gute held on to Matthews and Cobb a year too long .. just like he did with Graham. 

Edited by {Family Ghost}

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22 minutes ago, {Family Ghost} said:

I was basically trying to say that Gute held on to Matthews and Cobb a year too long .. just like he did with Graham. 

I'm down with this theory only if you feel opportunity to better the player's production was either available on the roster or would have been brought on board. Okay. Graham cost a few short term bucks. Fine. Would I have liked more production from him (and the entire TE position?) Sure, but its not "our money" and it didnt hamstring the organization from making moves / enhancing the roster where deemed more necessary. 

Graham got us through the year and we'll probably move on now. Turns out, we certainly didnt have anybody on board ready to step up. Sternberger -  maybe - long shot - if he hadnt gotten hurt, but who knows - so it is what it is.
 

Edited by Leader

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When I looked up positional spending, GB is # 4 in the league in cash allocated to LB's. As a 3-4 team, you'd expect them to be in the upper half no matter what
But still, number 4 is pretty high. In 2021 and 2022, the Mighty Green Bay Packers will be # 1 in the entire league in LB spending and that's without spending anything on Martinez or another FA replacement at ILB.  (or a FA Fackrell replacement)

That's why I don't think the Packers can "afford" to spend big on a FA ILB. They can probably make it work capwise, but that's a disproportionate amount to spend at the LB position. Meanwhile the DL is ranked at # 24 for 2020 and # 25 for 2021. Adding in Kenny's deal just puts GB in the middle of the pack for DL spending

Seems like that points to a draft pick at ILB  and a FA on the DL -  when viewed from the positional spending POV.
Of course there are always other factors to consider

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23 minutes ago, Shanedorf said:

In 2021 and 2022, the Mighty Green Bay Packers will be # 1 in the entire league in LB spending and that's without spending anything on Martinez or another FA replacement at ILB.  (or a FA Fackrell replacement)

That's probably because we are one of the few teams (if not the only team) that has his top 3 OLBs signed through 2022 (although we will obviously be one of the top teams spending there.

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7 hours ago, VonKarman said:

That's probably because we are one of the few teams (if not the only team) that has his top 3 OLBs signed through 2022 (although we will obviously be one of the top teams spending there.

And it isn't like the LB money was bad money.  We had a first round pick and the top sack producing duo on the roster.  We didn't pay anyone besides the Smiths and Goodson non-rookie contracts.  Fackrell made more money (according to spotrac) than Martinez.  All of our money is in the Smiths and Gary.  

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More to the point, all that Packers money tied up in LBs, is on OLBs.

If you separate OLB and ILB the Packers have one currently cheap ILB in Martinez that sees the field regularly and not much else.

The consequences of this, is that Martinez's big contract jump will see him going elsewhere. More importantly, to keep the LB room's cap $ in check, you draft replacements (a coverage ILB and a run-stopper ILB) which will be relatively cheap for years.  If the Packers went the route of getting in a vet ILB, the total cap cost for all Packers LBs would rise into the stratosphere.

Edited by OneTwoSixFive

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21 hours ago, ThatJerkDave said:

Letting Breeland go was only dumb in hindsight.  With what we thought at the time, it was the proper move.  We had what looked like a promising UDFA in Crazy Tony, and a second round pick in Josh Jackson.  If we had let either go at the time instead of Breeland, everyone here would have been extremely angry.  He did well, good for him.  He is like a crap version of Casey Hayward.  Now we wish we had him, but it made sense at the time to move on.  

I have to disagree with this. Tramon really showed his age this year and we could've used a younger, more explosive body in Breeland to shore up that secondary. It's not like Breeland was a liability in coverage. People get too wrapped up into the whole "Williams is a mentor" business when he's no Charles Woodson. 

That aside, putting Crazy Tony on the PS could've created room for Breeland. 

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Gary's contract is under 4 years, < 16 mil total. It's really overall negligible.

 

We have no idea if they made a competitive offer on Breeland. He was a UFA.

Similar point on Matthews. Would he have taken a 1 year/5 mil offer from GB to be a rotational edge maybe a little ILB? It's hard to take a major step back like that in house. It might have even been offered. I think it would have been a harder change to try it than move on for both parties.

Cobb on the other hand played well in a prove it year. It sucks given the Packers lack of talent at WR, but there is still no reason to expect his body could replicate that.

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13 minutes ago, spilltray said:

Gary's contract is under 4 years, < 16 mil total. It's really overall negligible.

 

We have no idea if they made a competitive offer on Breeland. He was a UFA.

Similar point on Matthews. Would he have taken a 1 year/5 mil offer from GB to be a rotational edge maybe a little ILB? It's hard to take a major step back like that in house. It might have even been offered. I think it would have been a harder change to try it than move on for both parties.

Cobb on the other hand played well in a prove it year. It sucks given the Packers lack of talent at WR, but there is still no reason to expect his body could replicate that.

How old do you think Randall Cobb is right now?

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Just now, AlexGreen#20 said:

How old do you think Randall Cobb is right now?

I know he's pretty young, it's more about his health. 27-28?

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Just now, spilltray said:

I know he's pretty young, it's more about his health. 27-28?

He's 29, not even 30 yet. Other than missing 7 games with us in 18, Cobb has been pretty darn healthy. 

The dude isn't what he was at 26, but he's still a respectable slot weapon. Here's coming off his best season since he was 24. 

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