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Russell Wilson Named PFF's MVP

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In terms of the true meaning of the word valuable, I would absolutely agree Russell Wilson was your MVP this year.

However, in the traditional "best QB on the best team in the NFL" definition that the NFL uses, it's still Lamar Jackson. The only quarrel I have with this list is how low Lamar is. In no way should he be lower than freaking Dak and Aaron Rodgers.

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The ole what is the definition of "MVP" deal, based on the points brought up in this thread, definitely can see it

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LOL

Imagine that you had two QBs on run-first teams. Both QBs have similar yardage, with one of them sitting out the equivalent of almost 2 games (due to already securing a positive outcome for his team). That QB also have more 25+% more TDs scored, albeit with one extra turnover, and much better efficiency numbers. His team led the league in scoring and was 2nd in yardage while the other QB's team just squeaked inside the top 10.   

There is simply no way that Greased Weasel Wilson had a better year than Lamar and trying to argue him being more valuable and placing Jackson at #5 is just asinine. Both QB's need their run game to win (Wilson is 1-8 dating back to Oct 2017 when attempting 36+ passes in a game (i.e. above league average)) and if you want to argue that Wilson is somehow even close to being as big of a factor in the run game as Lamar, please make your case.

 

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On 1/22/2020 at 5:05 PM, DawgX said:

I think Seattle would be far worse off without Wilson than Baltimore would be without Lamar.

I honestly saw them as being roughly the same, but I will say that after comparing the stats I am inclined to agree with you more than I originally did. Lamar has 1000 less passing yards, but over 1000 total rushing yards.

Essentially the same contribution to moving the ball, Wilson just did it with his arm. Only 4 less TD's and everything else is about the same.

Which leaves me asking myself, who had better weapons? Clearly, as mentioned below, BLT had a better defense and seemingly one of the best offensive lines in the league this year.

I think my position has changed to become more agreeable with PFF.

18 hours ago, x0x said:

Lamar Jackson could be argued to have had a better defense to lean on and at least a slightly better line to help in blocking (Ingram had 5.0 YPC to Carson's 4.4)

I will agree with this.

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If I lose $300 because people are trying to be cute with their definition of MVP, Imma be pissed

Edited by M.10.E

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1 hour ago, M.10.E said:

If I lose $300 because people are trying to be cute with their definition of MVP, Imma be pissed

It's a little bit easier to be objective now that the season has ended. Considering what some others are pointing out about Wilsons performance vs Jacksons, and the options made available to both... It's not hard to put Russell and Jackson right aside one another no matter what side of the fence you're on.

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Joke site is a joke

But if it’s all “WAR” how tf is the top 3 not comfortably Wilson, Watson, Jackson?

Only offense that might even be close to KCs talent outside the QB position is New Orleans. And Dak? Dallas should’ve at least been 12-4. Ravens and Seahawks wouldn’t be playoff teams with average QBs and Houston might be a top 5 draft pick

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3 hours ago, evilflamingo said:

LOL

Imagine that you had two QBs on run-first teams. Both QBs have similar yardage, with one of them sitting out the equivalent of almost 2 games (due to already securing a positive outcome for his team). That QB also have more 25+% more TDs scored, albeit with one extra turnover, and much better efficiency numbers. His team led the league in scoring and was 2nd in yardage while the other QB's team just squeaked inside the top 10.   

There is simply no way that Greased Weasel Wilson had a better year than Lamar and trying to argue him being more valuable and placing Jackson at #5 is just asinine. Both QB's need their run game to win (Wilson is 1-8 dating back to Oct 2017 when attempting 36+ passes in a game (i.e. above league average)) and if you want to argue that Wilson is somehow even close to being as big of a factor in the run game as Lamar, please make your case.

PFF has to be using the classic definition of what is value. In that case, it's really hard to argue against Wilson. He has literally nothing around him sans Lockett and Carson, and Carson has major fumbling issues and went down to injury. He also has no offensive line (never has in his entire career), and this year his defense was abysmal.

What Wilson accomplished this year, though at face value it wasn't better than Lamar, should be weighted heavier because of the context surrounding how Wilson did it, and the pieces that were around him while he was doing it.

Let's also not forget that Wilson is playing in a system that actively tries to hide him for 3 quarters until they have to let him take over the game. Lamar's offense is completely built around him as the main weapon. I don't think that can be ignored.

So while I agree that in the NFL's definition of MVP - the best QB on the best team - it's absolutely Lamar Jackson. But if you really want to dig into the value aspect of MVP, Russell Wilson should be your winner. But like I said previously, having Lamar at #5 below guys like Rodgers and Dak is a complete joke.

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Thinking Wilson got the bump considering most of Seattles offensive players got really awful grades (defense too). It helped spur  the difference in WAR accumulation. 

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If you would have said 5 years ago that a player would lead the National Football League in touchdown passes (as well as  total touchdowns), and break the single season rushing record for a QB in the same season, first off, you would have said “what video game are you playing”.

Secondly, if you would have said, about that player, “people thinking that guy is the MVP are IDIOTS LMAOOO THE TRUE FOOTBALL FANS KNOW THE MVP”, you would have been laughed off the face of the planet. And you should still be laughed at now.

Some people in this thread just - for whatever reason - really don’t like Lamar Jackson. And that’s fine. But get over yourselves, stop diminishing what was one of the best seasons we’ve seen from an offensive player in this league, and stop acting like you’re the objective, level-headed, rational ones in this conversation. Because you’re absolutely not.

Lamar Jackson was the NFL MVP in 2019. It’s pretty cut and dry. Get over it or don’t, but just stop with the ridiculous half arsed attempts at trying to downplay what that 22 year old kid who was left out in the cold by most “football experts” (including some of you in this very same thread) after that playoff game last year just did this season.

🤫

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Head to head, Lamar Jackson beat Russell Wilson. Sure, it is a team game, but at home, you don't throw a terrible pick 6 to the opponent. 

To think anyone would give it to Wilson over Lamar's record breaking year just display a poor judgment of what an MVP is.

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1 hour ago, Silver said:

Head to head, Lamar Jackson beat Russell Wilson. Sure, it is a team game, but at home, you don't throw a terrible pick 6 to the opponent. 

To think anyone would give it to Wilson over Lamar's record breaking year just display a poor judgment of what an MVP is.

Best team record. Best fantasy stats. H2H win. Far more productive and efficient offense. Lamar's going to win the real award and it won't be close. I mean come on, once Lamar passed Wilson in PASSING TDs (on significantly fewer possessions BTW) and passer rating, it was over.

Edited by wackywabbit

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