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General off-season discussion/plan thread

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7 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Not sure if I agree with that. Don't get me wrong, wouldn't have minded Diggs AT ALL, but OBJ is on another level. And he's going to kill it in this season with those slant and post routes. Last year he obviously wasn't very good but was playing hurt....and that is a legitimate concern as he has been hurt the last few years. Didn't miss a game last season though and the season prior averaged 88 YPG. He's a special WR and I think Shanny has wanted him badly for some time and gets it done if the Browns bite at the #31 pick. 

But that's the thing - he hasn't been. He hasn't been in a long time. And we can give whatever reasons we want for that, but bottom line is he hasn't been "Odell!!" since 2016. That's a long time. 

Yes, there is an upside with him that you don't have with Diggs, and I do think that he would get quite a bit of that back with us in our scheme, but there is no guarantee that he reaches those heights again. But mainly Diggs gets the vote because of the contract being more valuable at 4-5 million per season less. Personally, if OBJ gets traded, I don't think he gets the return of Diggs, but I'll be curious to see if I'm right or wrong. 

 

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1 minute ago, Forge said:

But that's the thing - he hasn't been. He hasn't been in a long time. And we can give whatever reasons we want for that, but bottom line is he hasn't been "Odell!!" since 2016. That's a long time. 

Yes, there is an upside with him that you don't have with Diggs, and I do think that he would get quite a bit of that back with us in our scheme, but there is no guarantee that he reaches those heights again. But mainly Diggs gets the vote because of the contract being more valuable at 4-5 million per season less. Personally, if OBJ gets traded, I don't think he gets the return of Diggs, but I'll be curious to see if I'm right or wrong. 

 

Curious why do you say he hasn't been that type of player since 2016 when he had pretty much the same exact per game averages in 2018? 

2016 (Per game)

Catches- 6.3

YPG - 85.4

YPC - 13.5

TDs - .625

2018

Catches - 6.4

YPG - 87.7

YPC - 13.7

TDs - .50

Seems like the same exact player, no? One thing I don't really get is why his TDs have gone down since his first three years. Obviously his QB play has been borderline horrendous, but he was getting in the end zone quite often early in his career. 

 

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2 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Curious why do you say he hasn't been that type of player since 2016 when he had pretty much the same exact per game averages in 2018? 

2016 (Per game)

Catches- 6.3

YPG - 85.4

YPC - 13.5

TDs - .625

2018

Catches - 6.4

YPG - 87.7

YPC - 13.7

TDs - .50

Seems like the same exact player, no? One thing I don't really get is why his TDs have gone down since his first three years. Obviously his QB play has been borderline horrendous, but he was getting in the end zone quite often early in his career. 

 

I'm not going to lie, had no idea that his rate stats were that close. Was just basing if off memory of him not being that impressive with the Giants his last year, the complaints from Giants fans of him not being very good, and the injury. 

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As for touchdowns, just variable. I never put a tremendous deal of stock in touchdowns because they can be highly random. 

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55 minutes ago, brownie man said:

Would you all trade Odell for 13?

No. Stop. Please. Thank you. 

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2 minutes ago, Forge said:

I'm not going to lie, had no idea that his rate stats were that close. Was just basing if off memory of him not being that impressive with the Giants his last year, the complaints from Giants fans of him not being very good, and the injury. 

Yeah, maybe the expectations for him were just too high after he came out firing from day one. But make no mistake, dude was still a top level WR in 2018. 

1 minute ago, Forge said:

As for touchdowns, just variable. I never put a tremendous deal of stock in touchdowns because they can be highly random. 

It could be, but three years in a row not even being close? I don't care if he is playing here or in Cleveland or anywhere else next season, he needs to get back to the double digit range. Used to be phenomenal at fade routes while last season he could't get anything on that route....LOL Baker throwing him the ball of course. 

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4 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

It could be, but three years in a row not even being close? I don't care if he is playing here or in Cleveland or anywhere else next season, he needs to get back to the double digit range. Used to be phenomenal at fade routes while last season he could't get anything on that route....LOL Baker throwing him the ball of course. 

Well, one year was just 4 games, and 2018 was 12 games. He still got the opportunity, and he may have just been having a standard down year. Maybe he woudl have finished 7/8 in a full 16 games

Last year though, it was a lot about opportunity. He only got 15 red zone targets, and that was by far the fewest of his career. The next lowest he had was 21 in 2018, and he did that in 12 games. 

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, Forge said:

Well, one year was just 4 games, and 2018 was 12 games. He still got the opportunity, and he may have just been having a standard down year. Maybe he woudl have finished 7/8 in a full 16 games

Last year though, it was a lot about opportunity. He only got 15 red zone targets, and that was by far the fewest of his career. The next lowest he had was 21 in 2018, and he did that in 12 games. 

Only 15? Interesting, from the games I watched I remember him getting quite a bit, the Bills game in particular he got a few. But yeah, could just be opportunity. 

And totally forgot about the four games played in 2017. Had three TDs during that stretch so was on pace to eclipse 10.

Either way bring him to SF! 

 

Edited by J-ALL-DAY

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2 hours ago, brownie man said:

Would you all trade Odell for 13?

We might not even trade #31 straight up. Probably need something else back 

WR market is depressed because of how good the draft is. We could just hold that pick and get a cheap rookie who is talented. Someone without the drama. Y'all traded for him and now you want to trade him away. That means you have no leverage. 

Odell +2020 3rd for #31 and 2021 2nd. 

I know people think 2020 3rd = 2021 2nd but moving that up a year would be huge in my eyes. 

 

So, either meet our price, or be stuck with the malcontent and we will cash in our lottery ticket and be happy about it. 

In Kyle we trust 

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Posted (edited)

The only vet player i'd trade 31 for is Joey Bosa (including Ford + future picks)

BTW...Sanders for 2/16? I wish we were in on that. We still could have drafted a top WR and have a trio of Sanders, Samuel, & Jeudy/Lamb/Ruggs, with Bourne/James as depth. The rest of our WR's are total question marks. Taylor has been ineffective/injured for 2 years straight. Pettis is on the verge of being cut. As for Hurd, i read he wasn't even medically cleared in February....6 months after his injury. At this point, i wouldn't be surprised if he just retired. Everyone else is roster fodder 

Edited by 49ersfan

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No interest in Beckham. Would much rather have a rookie WR at #13 or #31 under a cheap rookie contract for 5 years plus he would obviously be younger. One FA WR I wouldn't mind going after would be Robby Anderson around $8m a season or less. He'll be 27 at the end of May and has good size being 6'3/190. Has played 62/64 games. His market appears to be ice cold right now and maybe, we can swoop in and get for a cheap price and not give up any draft picks in the process.

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Posted (edited)

Sanders got away. Damn squad...

no-money.gif

Even with a star rookie added in the first, Samus gonna have to step up. 

Edited by PapaShogun

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I know we haven't seen him play(reg season gms) but we actually have a talented young wr coming back. Yeah I'm talking about Hurd. Dude has all the physical traits to be a productive wr for us. This isn't a late rd flyer we hope can be good for us. They spent an early 3rd rd pick(67) on him. To put that in perspective we traded this yrs 2nd rd pick(63) for Dee Ford and this yrs 3rd rd(95) on Sanders. If I said we could get either of those picks back everyone on this board would do it. 

He's going to be part of our wr core going forward. My guess would be a big part of our wr plans as we try to figure out the depth at the position.

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12 hours ago, Forge said:

And we can give whatever reasons we want for that, but bottom line is

But see, reasons actually matter. 

 

I ask myself three questions:

1) will adding OBJ make us stronger SB contenders? easy answer is YES

2) will our offense function well as is if an injury occurs to GK or Deebo? easy answer is Definitely NOT

and lesser extent:

3) how much trust should I really put in an unproven WR, even if a top one. answer is not so much trust

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