What does Rivers have to do to make the HoF?

[Malik]

2 hours ago, Bearerofnews said:

Horrible list. Rivers has had better peaks than most of those guys. Romo hasnt had either better than Rivers. Outside Ryans 1 anamoly season of 2016, he isnt even that close of what Rivers has done. 

Rivers is in, as is. If say he goes next year and wins a SB his first year away from the Chargers... anyone with an ounce of logical compacity will have to reassess him as a top 6 qb all time and see how much GOAT potential was wasted dying on the Chargers.

How has he had better peaks than most of those guys when the first 6 guys all were literal MVPs. Brees is the only one there with only 1 MVP. Rivers has never been in the MVP conversation (much less gotten a vote) in any of his seasons. All of those guys outside of Romo have had significantly more playoff success as well.

[Canuck]

3 hours ago, Bearerofnews said:

🤣🤣🤣🤣 i cant even... ill get banned.

What has he done aside from throw for a bunch of passing yards in the era of high passing yard totals? He throws for 4K yards every year, so what?

He's topped 30 TDs 6 times. He's been mediocre in the playoffs.

His "best" years came when LT carried the offense

[blizofoz45]

The guy never shows anything like a second gear.  You never hear commentators say "This is when Philip Rivers is the most dangerous" because he doesn't appear to excel in any particular situation.  The Chargers start their playoffs usually around week 8 so he's had countless chances to put on the cape and be the leader.  He just never does it.

The only time he rises to the occasion is umm...well let's just say it's not on the field and leave it at that.

[Bearerofnews]

1 hour ago, Canuck said:

What has he done aside from throw for a bunch of passing yards in the era of high passing yard totals? He throws for 4K yards every year, so what?

He's topped 30 TDs 6 times. He's been mediocre in the playoffs.

His "best" years came when LT carried the offense

His best year came when LT was not carrying the offense. LT carried the offense in 06 and 07. Rivers peak was 08 to 2010. When LT was hardly a factor. Rivers has been consistently efficient, productive, prolific with the best of them. 

Guy you just said a MVP and multiple rings and hed be in the convo. Get outta here with that blatant troll garbage. In the future be more discreet. If Rivers had 1 marquee MVP season, he's a first ballot. Rivers with 1 MVP and 2 rings hed be in every convo as top 6 all time.

Edited February 29, 2020 by Bearerofnews

[Bearerofnews]

2 hours ago, Malik said:

How has he had better peaks than most of those guys when the first 6 guys all were literal MVPs. Brees is the only one there with only 1 MVP. Rivers has never been in the MVP conversation (much less gotten a vote) in any of his seasons. All of those guys outside of Romo have had significantly more playoff success as well.

Guy, first off Brees never won a league MVP. 2nd Rivers has had multiple seasons with MVP votes. It's so clear the people who really dont know anything about Rivers career, the minute they begin to type inaccuracies all over the place.

 

You will struggle to find more than 5 qbs all time who had a better peak of 3 consecutive years than Rivers from 08 to 2010... and he did that with Norv as head coach and some pretty avg offensive skilled players.

Literally 1 good playoff run, would put him in the same class in terms of playoff production with 70% of your list. Thats virtually 3 post season games. 

Edited February 29, 2020 by Bearerofnews

[Bearerofnews]

1 hour ago, blizofoz45 said:

The guy never shows anything like a second gear.  You never hear commentators say "This is when Philip Rivers is the most dangerous" because he doesn't appear to excel in any particular situation.  The Chargers start their playoffs usually around week 8 so he's had countless chances to put on the cape and be the leader.  He just never does it.

The only time he rises to the occasion is umm...well let's just say it's not on the field and leave it at that.

Yeah thats why for nearly a decade commentators every where coined Rivers as Philcember. Because he was dominant in December and would always take a slow starting Chargers, rallying to a post season berth or just on the brink with heroic performances left and right. 

I mean there is a reason he has the most;16 plus point comebacks, in the 2nd half of games, in NFL history.  Thats a steel cape fam.

[ClutchDJ]

Actually elevate his play in the postseason?

[megatechpc]

7 hours ago, Bearerofnews said:

Horrible list. Rivers has had better peaks than most of those guys. Romo hasnt had either better than Rivers. Outside Ryans 1 anamoly season of 2016, he isnt even that close of what Rivers has done. 

Rivers is in, as is. If say he goes next year and wins a SB his first year away from the Chargers... anyone with an ounce of logical compacity will have to reassess him as a top 6 qb all time and see how much GOAT potential was wasted dying on the Chargers.

Lol, wut?  Anomaly season?  Just check the career stats man, Matt Ryan has almost identical numbers to Rivers (if you extrapolate for the 2+ extra seasons Rivers has played than Ryan so far).  

Passing Yards - Ryan (51,186 total - 7.5 YPA) - Rivers (59,271 total - 7.8 YPA)

TDs - Ryan (321 total - 4.7%) - Rivers (397 total - 5.2%)

INTs - Ryan (147 total - 2.2%) - Rivers (198 total - 2.6%)

Passer Rating - Ryan (94.6) - Rivers (95.1)

Completion Percentage - Ryan (65.4%) - Rivers (64.7%)

Record - Ryan (109 - 80 - 0) - Rivers (123 - 101 - 0)

This is where the comparison starts to get interesting:

Awards - Ryan (4x Pro Bowl, 1x All Pro, 1x League MVP, 2008 Off. RoY, 2016 Off. PoY) - Rivers (8x Pro Bowl, 2013 Comeback PoY)

4th Quarter Comebacks - Ryan (30) - Rivers (27)

Game Winning Drives - Ryan (38) - Rivers (32)

Matt Ryan has had more postseason success than Rivers has, reaching two NFC Championship Games and one Super Bowl compared to a single AFC Championship Game for Rivers.  Of note, Ryan's Playoffs stats absolutely nuke Rivers:

Playoffs                  Games        Record           Comp Per         Pass Yards           YPA           TDs          INTs           Passer Rating

Matt Ryan                  10                4-6                  67.52%                2672                 7.61           20              7                  100.8 QBR

Philip Rivers              11                5-6                  59.44%                2656                 7.48           14             10                  84.2 QBR

Finally, if you take their respective best STATISTICAL seasons and compare them, well, it looks like this:

                                   Record             Comp Per             Pass Yards            YPA            TDs              INTs            Passer Rating

Matt Ryan (2016)      11-5                   69.9%                     4944                   9.3              38                   7                       117.1

Philip Rivers (2013)    9-7                   69-5%                      4478                   8.2              32                  11                     105.5

I would like to also point out that Ryan's "anomaly" season in 2016 was duplicated almost identically (in terms of stats anyway) in 2018 in which he threw for just 20 less yards, 3 less TDs, same number of INTs, 1.2 less YPA, and a "paltry" 108.1 QBR compared to 2016's 117.1 QBR (incidentally BOTH Ryan's 2016 and 2018 QBR's are significantly higher than Rivers' career high of 105.5).  In my opinion, Matt Ryan has already had a more impressive QB career than Philip Rivers and he is still four years younger so he will almost certainly surpass nearly ALL of Rivers' overall stats by the time they both retire.

I say all of that simply to reiterate that I don't personally believe EITHER of them is worthy of the HOF as things stand right now.  But, either one of them WOULD be worthy (IMO) if they managed to win a SB before hanging up their cleats...

[Bearerofnews]

4 hours ago, megatechpc said:

Lol, wut?  Anomaly season?  Just check the career stats man, Matt Ryan has almost identical numbers to Rivers (if you extrapolate for the 2+ extra seasons Rivers has played than Ryan so far).  

Passing Yards - Ryan (51,186 total - 7.5 YPA) - Rivers (59,271 total - 7.8 YPA)

TDs - Ryan (321 total - 4.7%) - Rivers (397 total - 5.2%)

INTs - Ryan (147 total - 2.2%) - Rivers (198 total - 2.6%)

Passer Rating - Ryan (94.6) - Rivers (95.1)

Completion Percentage - Ryan (65.4%) - Rivers (64.7%)

Record - Ryan (109 - 80 - 0) - Rivers (123 - 101 - 0)

This is where the comparison starts to get interesting:

Awards - Ryan (4x Pro Bowl, 1x All Pro, 1x League MVP, 2008 Off. RoY, 2016 Off. PoY) - Rivers (8x Pro Bowl, 2013 Comeback PoY)

4th Quarter Comebacks - Ryan (30) - Rivers (27)

Game Winning Drives - Ryan (38) - Rivers (32)

Matt Ryan has had more postseason success than Rivers has, reaching two NFC Championship Games and one Super Bowl compared to a single AFC Championship Game for Rivers.  Of note, Ryan's Playoffs stats absolutely nuke Rivers:

Playoffs                  Games        Record           Comp Per         Pass Yards           YPA           TDs          INTs           Passer Rating

Matt Ryan                  10                4-6                  67.52%                2672                 7.61           20              7                  100.8 QBR

Philip Rivers              11                5-6                  59.44%                2656                 7.48           14             10                  84.2 QBR

Finally, if you take their respective best STATISTICAL seasons and compare them, well, it looks like this:

                                   Record             Comp Per             Pass Yards            YPA            TDs              INTs            Passer Rating

Matt Ryan (2016)      11-5                   69.9%                     4944                   9.3              38                   7                       117.1

Philip Rivers (2013)    9-7                   69-5%                      4478                   8.2              32                  11                     105.5

I would like to also point out that Ryan's "anomaly" season in 2016 was duplicated almost identically (in terms of stats anyway) in 2018 in which he threw for just 20 less yards, 3 less TDs, same number of INTs, 1.2 less YPA, and a "paltry" 108.1 QBR compared to 2016's 117.1 QBR (incidentally BOTH Ryan's 2016 and 2018 QBR's are significantly higher than Rivers' career high of 105.5).  In my opinion, Matt Ryan has already had a more impressive QB career than Philip Rivers and he is still four years younger so he will almost certainly surpass nearly ALL of Rivers' overall stats by the time they both retire.

I say all of that simply to reiterate that I don't personally believe EITHER of them is worthy of the HOF as things stand right now.  But, either one of them WOULD be worthy (IMO) if they managed to win a SB before hanging up their cleats...

Now do all that taking out the 2016 "anamoly season" and see how "not that close it is".

Take out that outlier 2016 season and its

3 probowls vs 8

1 season with 100 plus passer rating vs 5

Its 2-5 playoff record for Ryan vs 5-6 for Rivers.

Two 30 plus td seasons vs 6.

Rivers hasnt had an outlier season that beefed up his resume like Ryan. Rivers has had a great peak, high medium with an avg low. He has been insanely consistent. 

I respect Ryan... because like Peyton and Rivers.... Ryan and Rivers on a lessor level than Peyton have done it without a single coach attached to them and with multiple bad coaches.. which is huge and insanely enough people UNDERRATE to nearing alarming rates. But outside an outlier season to his norm that really top loaded his resume... he hasnt been as close to Rivers as some people pretend.

Edited February 29, 2020 by Bearerofnews

[Malik]

10 hours ago, Bearerofnews said:

Guy, first off Brees never won a league MVP. 2nd Rivers has had multiple seasons with MVP votes. It's so clear the people who really dont know anything about Rivers career, the minute they begin to type inaccuracies all over the place.

 

You will struggle to find more than 5 qbs all time who had a better peak of 3 consecutive years than Rivers from 08 to 2010... and he did that with Norv as head coach and some pretty avg offensive skilled players.

Literally 1 good playoff run, would put him in the same class in terms of playoff production with 70% of your list. Thats virtually 3 post season games. 

Brett Favre (95-97), Peyton Manning (almost any 3), Tom Brady (almost any 3 post 2010), Aaron Rodgers (14-16), Dan Marino (84-86), Drew Brees (almost any 3 honestly), Joe Montana (87-89), Steve Young (92-94), Russell Wilson (17-19), Ben Roethelisberger (16-18), and you could argue Kurt Warner if you wanted or wait until Patrick Mahomes next season and they would have all won more than 1 playoff game outside of Russell as well.

Vincent Jackson and Antonio Gates are not average offensive skilled players. Gates is literally one of the greatest tightends of all time and Vincent was great with and without Rivers. Considering Rivers has currently 1 good playoff game that would seem to be a tall task for him.

[Bearerofnews]

6 hours ago, Malik said:

Brett Favre (95-97), Peyton Manning (almost any 3), Tom Brady (almost any 3 post 2010), Aaron Rodgers (14-16), Dan Marino (84-86), Drew Brees (almost any 3 honestly), Joe Montana (87-89), Steve Young (92-94), Russell Wilson (17-19), Ben Roethelisberger (16-18), and you could argue Kurt Warner if you wanted or wait until Patrick Mahomes next season and they would have all won more than 1 playoff game outside of Russell as well.

Vincent Jackson and Antonio Gates are not average offensive skilled players. Gates is literally one of the greatest tightends of all time and Vincent was great with and without Rivers. Considering Rivers has currently 1 good playoff game that would seem to be a tall task for him.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1_hint=Brett+Favre&player_id1_select=Brett+Favre&fromyear_1=1995&toyear_1=1997&player_id1=FavrBr00&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Peyton+Manning&player_id2_select=Peyton+Manning&fromyear_2=2003&toyear_2=2005&player_id2=MannPe00&idx=players&player_id3_hint=Tom+Brady&player_id3_select=Tom+Brady&fromyear_3=2012&toyear_3=2014&player_id3=BradTo00&idx=players&player_id4_hint=Ben+Roethlisberger&player_id4_select=Ben+Roethlisberger&fromyear_4=2016&toyear_4=2018&player_id4=RoetBe00&idx=players&player_id5_hint=Drew+Brees&player_id5_select=Drew+Brees&fromyear_5=2008&toyear_5=2010&player_id5=BreeDr00&idx=players&player_id6_hint=Philip+Rivers&player_id6_select=Philip+Rivers&fromyear_6=2008&toyear_6=2010&player_id6=RivePh00&idx=players

 

Stop playing yourself. Outside Peyton the others didnt even manage to break 100 passer rating.

Its clear you are wrong, once again.

Rivers has 5 of 11 post season games with 92 plus passer rating... 4 with over 100.

 

Edited February 29, 2020 by Bearerofnews

[Bearerofnews]

Oh and for Peyton, i literally picked his greatest 3 year consecutive stretch.  Any other 3 year consecutive stretch and he wouldn't of done as good as Rivers.

 

Yes Passer rating is what i go by. Ive said that day 1. It is the best cumulative stat that takes multiple factors into consideration.

 

Unless you were talking about accomplishments. Which comparing them isnt apples to apples. 

Carroll, Dungy, Belichick, Payton, Holmgren, Tomlin, Mccarthy and Norv.

One of those is not like the other. Coach is the single biggest factor in determining NFL team accomplishments.

Edited February 29, 2020 by Bearerofnews

[braylon]

I am blown away by the fact that multiple posters in this thread have said Ryan > Rivers. Ryan is the most overrated player I have seen in my time as a fan of the NFL.

[Malik]

4 hours ago, Bearerofnews said:

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1_hint=Brett+Favre&player_id1_select=Brett+Favre&fromyear_1=1995&toyear_1=1997&player_id1=FavrBr00&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Peyton+Manning&player_id2_select=Peyton+Manning&fromyear_2=2003&toyear_2=2005&player_id2=MannPe00&idx=players&player_id3_hint=Tom+Brady&player_id3_select=Tom+Brady&fromyear_3=2012&toyear_3=2014&player_id3=BradTo00&idx=players&player_id4_hint=Ben+Roethlisberger&player_id4_select=Ben+Roethlisberger&fromyear_4=2016&toyear_4=2018&player_id4=RoetBe00&idx=players&player_id5_hint=Drew+Brees&player_id5_select=Drew+Brees&fromyear_5=2008&toyear_5=2010&player_id5=BreeDr00&idx=players&player_id6_hint=Philip+Rivers&player_id6_select=Philip+Rivers&fromyear_6=2008&toyear_6=2010&player_id6=RivePh00&idx=players

 

Stop playing yourself. Outside Peyton the others didnt even manage to break 100 passer rating.

Its clear you are wrong, once again.

Rivers has 5 of 11 post season games with 92 plus passer rating... 4 with over 100.

 

Rivers had a 105 passer rating in his game against the Steelers. Now you know all those stats were achieved in garbage time. The same thing happened in the Broncos game. They were down 3 scores in the 4th quarter. 

Marino, Young, Rodgers, Wilson and Montana all broke 100. What are you talking about. 

Edited March 1, 2020 by Malik

[Ty21]

Nothing. Edgerrin James made it so he’ll be fine.