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The whole is less than the sum of it's part - or is it 2.0


bruceb

LB  

28 members have voted

  1. 1. LB

    • Top notch
      0
    • Above average
      1
    • Average
      18
    • Below average
      9
  2. 2. OL

    • Top notch
      1
    • Above average
      1
    • Average
      6
    • Below average
      20
  3. 3. QB

    • Top notch
      2
    • Above average
      17
    • Average
      8
    • Below average
      2


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"Hope clouds observation" - Frank Herbert, Dune

I hope everyone will agree that our RBs, if we keep Hunt, are top notch.

Although the homer in me is showing a bit in this as I am high on our K and over the moon on our P I think we all can agree that our ST are above average.

We already voted on DL, CBs and WRs.

Now let's look at other position groups.

 

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Add the names @bruceb so i know who to judge. 

Bakers floor is above average and ceiling is top notch imo. So much arm talent, balanced out by average character. A lot will depend om his mental and emotional life, his marraige is possibly on the verge of breakdown. 

The oline has two great players, and 3 gaping holes, priority 1 and 2 for the offseason. 

Linebackers, are average with Joe and below without him. 

Joe is a mixed bag, average vs the run, sometimes bad, and excellent vs the pass. He is a playmaker. Mack should get better, but he is more like schobert than a dominant 3 down linebacker. 

If we had a player like devin busb it would be awesome.

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LB - Meh. If we keep Schobert it's average or above average just because there are only so many LB's in the league who make a difference in coverage. If not, it's ugly as heck unless Mack/Takitaki make a jump fast.

OL - Our interior is above average because of Bitonio/Tretter and could be elite if we get a stud RG or one of our youngsters develops. Our OT's are some of the worst in the league.

QB - I think we still have a situation that half the teams in the league would trade theirs for if we assume that the Freddie stink comes off this year, so above average. List of teams that would at least have to have a long conversation about flip flopping QBs with us because of skill, age, or contract - NE, TEN, BUFF, MIA, PITT, INDY, JAX, DEN, OAK, LAC, NYG, WAS, CHI, DET, GB (yeah, I said it, he looks old), TB, SF, LAR (contract). That's 18, so even if you knock out 6 of them, still thoroughly average. But I'd say above average, with potential for elite with a bounce back year.

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I probably should have prefaced both of the topics on this with Herbert's quote ("Hope clouds observation" - Frank Herbert, Dune) because I think we all are guilty to one extent or another of our hope clouding our observations about the team and its prospects.

I am trying see a half glass of water, not half full or half empty (which actually are idiotic expressions since a half is a half).

But I digress.

I was sucked into misplaced optimism regarding the team's prospects last year (think I was a 10-6 guy) through my own failure to observe things accurately and do not want to go there again.

 

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35 minutes ago, bruceb said:

I probably should have prefaced both of the topics on this with Herbert's quote ("Hope clouds observation" - Frank Herbert, Dune) because I think we all are guilty to one extent or another of our hope clouding our observations about the team and its prospects.

I am trying see a half glass of water, not half full or half empty (which actually are idiotic expressions since a half is a half).

But I digress.

I was sucked into misplaced optimism regarding the team's prospects last year (think I was a 10-6 guy) through my own failure to observe things accurately and do not want to go there again.

 

In retrospect, we had many failures in team building. The 1st and most grave offense was the popular hiring of Kitchens. Assuming the coaching is corrected and the offensive line has two very good players and a good rookie and two average players, where dp you expect thos team to place? 

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18 minutes ago, Kiwibrown said:

Assuming the coaching is corrected and the offensive line has two very good players and a good rookie and two average players, where dp you expect thos team to place? 

I am trying hard to determine what we have in terms of players."I do not think we are as strong a team as many others believe.

I mean, for example, that I cannot convince myself that our D is anything but average unless I assume Vernon, Kirksey (assuming he still is here) and Ward will answer the bell all year, which their injury histories indicate they will not.

I want very much to believe that the coaching is fixed or at least will be decidedly better, although that is an unknown at this time.

Fixing the OL obviously would be huge since it currently is our deepest black hole.

I subscribe to Parcells' "you are what your record says you are".

Right now our record says that we are a 6-10 team.

Even assuming that the coaching and OL get fixed I still have doubts about our QB who is the make or break of any team.

So unless we majorly improve on D and our QB steps up, with those assumptions I would say 8-9 wins at best.

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12 hours ago, bruceb said:

"Hope clouds observation" - Frank Herbert, Dune

I hope everyone will agree that our RBs, if we keep Hunt, are top notch.

Although the homer in me is showing a bit in this as I am high on our K and over the moon on our P I think we all can agree that our ST are above average.

We already voted on DL, CBs and WRs.

Now let's look at other position groups.

 

Did I miss that Topic???

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Linebackers are mediocre at best.  Schobert is a good player, other that that it’s nothing but question marks.

OL.... oof.  We have C and LG locked down, but those are two of the easier positions to fill.  The one remaining tackle we have who may actually be a viable option (with plenty of help from TE’s and RB’s is average at his best.  We don’t have a LT, which is the toughest spot to fill.

I think Baker is actually pretty solid.  For reasons that have been beat to death, I don’t think he had much help last season.  I expect a much better 2020.

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3 hours ago, MWil23 said:

I can't see who voted for what???? BOOOOO!!!!

I went with average LB but if we lose Kirksey and Schobert we are probably easily the worst in the league.

I went below average O-Line. Tretter and Bitonio are both between above average and good and the other 60% of our line doesn't currently exist, at least in my mind.

I went above average at QB. Still trust Baker more than the starter for most of the teams but he can make his way to top notch with a good showing in '20.

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