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Mind Character

2020 NFL Combine Noteworthy Results & Talk

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Jarvis is the heart of the team.

Even still I'm down for a new youth movement and building it from the ground up again because I don't think we're in a window given the holes on the team.

I'm Trading OBJ and Jarvis Landry to the Raiders (or some other team) for a 1st and 2nd in this years draft and a 3rd and a conditional 4th in the 2021 draft that can be escalated to a 2nd round pick based on unlikely performance benchmarks (i.e., All Pro)

With Landry and OBJ's surgery, a lot of the picks would have to be conditional

Gives a team like the Raiders the juice they covet heading into the Vegas and either helps Derek Carr take the next jump or helps them recruit Brady.

They have extra draft capital.

Get Denzel Mims with our top 10 2nd round pick. Get Cole Kmet with the other acquired 2nd round pick. Take

1(10.) Jedrick Wills, OT Alabama // Tristan Wirfs, OG Iowa // Derrick Brown, NT Auburn // Mekhi Becton, OT Louisville

**1(19.) Henry Ruggs, WR Alabama // Justin Jefferson, WR LSU

**2.) Denzel Mims, WR Baylor

2.) Cole Kmet, TE Notre Dame

3.) Robert Hunt, OT/OG Louisiana-Lafayette

3.) Prince Tega-Wanogho, LT Auburn

Edited by Mind Character
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2 hours ago, Kiwibrown said:

Someone is overhyping combine results.

Has nothing to do with combine results. Absolutely zero.

Instead, it has everything to do with my realization regarding the true nature of this roster and how many holes we have to fill before being able to compete at a high level.

Ultimately, that realization has led me to believe we're not in a window, but can get there in 2 to 3 years.

In two to three years, OBJ and Jarvis will be 30 and 31 and either will be on expiring contracts or lacking in trade value.

Our Roster Holes:

1.) No Safeties,

2.) No complimentary DE-pass rusher,

3.) No High Quality LBs once Schobert likely isn't resigned

4.) No High Quality interior Run Stoppers and interior pass rushers at DT

5.) No Left Tackle,

6.) No Right Tackle

7.) No Right Guard

8.) No Hybrid TE

Those are all major holes. The likes of which plugging through FA and the Draft doesn't put us in a window. At least not yet.

So, trading Jarvis and OBJ in a year where the young impact WR talent is overflowing resets the sustainable winning window so that 3 years from now instead of having skill players that will be leaving the team we'll have foundational young pieces to continue building out with.

Thus, turning OBJ and Jarvis into Henry Ruggs and Denzel Mims would be trading elite level talents for young high quality talents that could be apart of the franchise and sustained winning for many many years to come instead of 2 to 3 more years at best.

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4 hours ago, pnies20 said:

Word is, Andrew Thomas is going to the giants. 

If deals get done, the top 3 picks could be QBs. Was and Det are looking to trade.

1. Burrow

2. Herbert

3. Tua

4. Thomas

Young, Ruggs and Brown will be gone.

If a run on OT goes before 10, I could see the Browns trading down to a WR needy team. There are several after the Browns. If they could trade down to the late teens and grab Josh Jones + a 2nd I’d be okay with it .

It's my opinion that, if Young falls to #3, the Lions take him without hesitation. He's the best player at our greatest position of need. I really don't see a scenario where the Lions pass on him.

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54 minutes ago, Mind Character said:

Has nothing to do with combine results. Absolutely zero.

Instead, it has everything to do with my realization regarding the true nature of this roster and how many holes we have to fill before being able to compete at a high level.

Ultimately, that realization has led me to believe we're not in a window, but can get there in 2 to 3 years.

In two to three years, OBJ and Jarvis will be 30 and 31 and either will be on expiring contracts or lacking in trade value.

Our Roster Holes:

1.) No Safeties,

2.) No complimentary DE-pass rusher,

3.) No High Quality LBs once Schobert likely isn't resigned

4.) No High Quality interior Run Stoppers and interior pass rushers at DT

5.) No Left Tackle,

6.) No Right Tackle

7.) No Right Guard

8.) No Hybrid TE

Those are all major holes. The likes of which plugging through FA and the Draft doesn't put us in a window. At least not yet.

So, trading Jarvis and OBJ in a year where the young impact WR talent is overflowing resets the sustainable winning window so that 3 years from now instead of having skill players that will be leaving the team we'll have foundational young pieces to continue building out with.

Thus, turning OBJ and Jarvis into Henry Ruggs and Denzel Mims would be trading elite level talents for young high quality talents that could be apart of the franchise and sustained winning for many many years to come instead of 2 to 3 more years at best.

No way do we move on from some of our best players, our gm and coach cannot afford big losig seasons. Jimmy will pull the trigger on them. Also we still have Myles, Baker, Ward on rookie contracts. 

This draft we get to fill, up to 4 holes on  our roster, and i think we get to fill another couple in free agency. 

In  the draft we get LT, RT, and a gaurd if they do not like the mess we have with X, Teller, McCray,  the answer could be on the roster already.

If it is that deep at wr, we will take one or two, i could see us using a 3rd on Pittman. Then replace one of obj or landry next off season. Also inregards to trading our wrs, Landry will have middling value, probably a 3rd, but objs value is at an all time low, i bet they want to trade him, but it will be in the middle of year or next off season, once he has hit 1400 yards again.

We will get a FS in free agency, possibly Randall, or maybe Harris. 

That leaves us withbholes, but other teams win with holes on the roster 

 

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1 hour ago, Mind Character said:

Has nothing to do with combine results. Absolutely zero.

Instead, it has everything to do with my realization regarding the true nature of this roster and how many holes we have to fill before being able to compete at a high level.

Ultimately, that realization has led me to believe we're not in a window, but can get there in 2 to 3 years.

In two to three years, OBJ and Jarvis will be 30 and 31 and either will be on expiring contracts or lacking in trade value.

Our Roster Holes:

1.) No Safeties,

2.) No complimentary DE-pass rusher,

3.) No High Quality LBs once Schobert likely isn't resigned

4.) No High Quality interior Run Stoppers and interior pass rushers at DT

5.) No Left Tackle,

6.) No Right Tackle

7.) No Right Guard

8.) No Hybrid TE

Those are all major holes. The likes of which plugging through FA and the Draft doesn't put us in a window. At least not yet.

So, trading Jarvis and OBJ in a year where the young impact WR talent is overflowing resets the sustainable winning window so that 3 years from now instead of having skill players that will be leaving the team we'll have foundational young pieces to continue building out with.

Thus, turning OBJ and Jarvis into Henry Ruggs and Denzel Mims would be trading elite level talents for young high quality talents that could be apart of the franchise and sustained winning for many many years to come instead of 2 to 3 more years at best.

That is genius get rid of 2hof players in there prime for conditional draft picks.

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11 minutes ago, Kiwibrown said:

No way do we move on from some of our best players, our gm and coach cannot afford big losig seasons. Jimmy will pull the trigger on them. Also we still have Myles, Baker, Ward on rookie contracts. 

This draft we get to fill, up to 4 holes on  our roster, and i think we get to fill another couple in free agency. 

In  the draft we get LT, RT, and a gaurd if they do not like the mess we have with X, Teller, McCray,  the answer could be on the roster already.

If it is that deep at wr, we will take one or two, i could see us using a 3rd on Pittman. Then replace one of obj or landry next off season. Also inregards to trading our wrs, Landry will have middling value, probably a 3rd, but objs value is at an all time low, i bet they want to trade him, but it will be in the middle of year or next off season, once he has hit 1400 yards again.

We will get a FS in free agency, possibly Randall, or maybe Harris. 

That leaves us withbholes, but other teams win with holes on the roster 

 

I agree that OBJ's value is at an all time low.

It's all about 2022.

It's a big year. There's the upcoming season of 2020. The season after that in 2021 and then 2022 when decisions on Myles Garrett becoming a UFA or not have to be made, Jarvis Landry enters his expiring contract season, Baker Mayfield's 5th year option year where a contract has to get done, Denzel Ward's 5th year option year where a contract has to get done, Nick Chubb's becomes a UFA, and Joel Bitonio's expiring contract year.

Trading OBJ and Jarvis soon comes down to two questions:
1.) Will we be able to build the roster to compete for a Super Bowl or Late Round Playoff Push by the time Jarvis Landry's enters his expiring contract year (i.e., 2020, 2021, expiring year 2022)?
-- That means we have only 2 more seasons with Jarvis (this year and the year after) before he enters his expiring contract season

2.) Are Jarvis Landry and OBJ going to be in the team's plans beyond 2022?
-- I can't see us resigning Jarvis beyond that expiring year given what's likely to be their age, injury history, and contract demands. When Jarvis leaves so does Odell and vice versa.
--That means Jarvis and OBJ aren't on the same timeline as the Browns other players like Nick Chubb, Myles, Denzel, Baker, and even Bitonio who the Browns plan to be core pieces for a long time to come.
-------------------------------

At the end of the day, I don't think Andrew Berry this offseason and the next is going to be able to put together through the draft and free agency a late playoff push competitive roster. I think we're 3 years away from that type of sustainable winning. Dorsey tried to accelerate the timeline and window, but we're a long way off.. longer than any of us wanted to realize.

Trading OBJ and Jarvis brings in players on the same longterm sustained winning timeline as the Browns current Foundational roster pieces.

Berry like Dorsey and other GMs is going to hit on some and miss on others.  We're not starting rookies at LT, RT, and RG.  McCray, Teller, and Prospect X aren't solutions to anything.

Let's say Berry bats .500 hitting on 2 of our first 4 picks (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd) with a starter. That would put him on par with his successful peers.

Let's say we hit with a Tackle (Jedrick Wills Jr) and a Safety (Xavier Mckinnie). Then we turn to free agency and hit with another Tackle (Halapoulivaati Vaitai) and Safety (Anthony Harris) and Guard (Graham Glasgow). We're still not competing in the playoffs with those additions, and I don't think another offseason gets us to that level quite yet either, but I do think we get there and stay there for a sustainable time 3 years/3 NFL seasons from now.

I'd be glad to be wrong, but ultimately I don't think given our major roster holes that Jarvis and OBJ put us over the top within 2 years before Jarvis' deal heads into it's expiring year. Therefore, it would likely be best to trade them both to acquire more longterm roster pieces that can help the team make the sustainable winning leap 3 years from now.

The issue is that they are both coming off of injury. Even still if deals should arise it makes sense now in my mind when it didn't before.

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There is no reason to trade OBJ atm when he would only get a 2nd, if he returns to form you could get a 1st and a 3rd, we have to wait for that, it is almost a 100% increase in value. Also, he is probably worth $100,000,000 to the cleveland browns brand right now. (LEBRON is apparently worth over 1 billion to a teams brand obj is 10% of that at his best). Jimmy wont let it happen unless the price is right, a desperate team could do it, who need to sell tickets, that would be someone like the chargers or the jags, if they gave us their top pick in the draft, sure do it. But it wont happen. 

Furthermore, if we lose obj and landry then we could have a terrible season on offense and defense. We need them so we can win some games this year, go 10-6, if we have no one to throw to and a terrible defense then it is the same old browns, berry and kevin cannot afford that mark on their resume, especiallythis early. The goal for 2020 isnt the playoffs it is stability. 7-9-10-6. 

Jimmy wants some w's that doesnt involve losing obj.

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If Baker comes out guns-a-blazing and the defence holds up, then we should be playoff bound this year. I'm happy to place 85% of the blame on last seasons inept coaching/playcalling and should see vast improvement across the board regardless.

It is very unlikely that we're going to be able to fill all of our holes, but we have enough top-end talent to at least compete, we just lack depth.

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3 hours ago, Mind Character said:

1.) No Safeties,

2.) No complimentary DE-pass rusher,

3.) No High Quality LBs once Schobert likely isn't resigned

4.) No High Quality interior Run Stoppers and interior pass rushers at DT

5.) No Left Tackle,

6.) No Right Tackle

7.) No Right Guard

8.) No Hybrid TE

I don’t view some of these positions as all that important, difficult to fill, or necessary to compete.

 

Not to mention, you’ll always have holes. Hell Kansas City technically has holes at RB, interior offensive line, linebacker, and CB. They’re a Tyreek Hill injury away from a bad WR core.

Edited by candyman93

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Quez Watkins had an impressive combine at his size. He also has had good production in his career.

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9 hours ago, Mind Character said:

Jarvis is the heart of the team.

Even still I'm down for a new youth movement and building it from the ground up again because I don't think we're in a window given the holes on the team.

I'm Trading OBJ and Jarvis Landry to the Raiders (or some other team) for a 1st and 2nd in this years draft and a 3rd and a conditional 4th in the 2021 draft that can be escalated to a 2nd round pick based on unlikely performance benchmarks (i.e., All Pro)

With Landry and OBJ's surgery, a lot of the picks would have to be conditional

Gives a team like the Raiders the juice they covet heading into the Vegas and either helps Derek Carr take the next jump or helps them recruit Brady.

They have extra draft capital.

Get Denzel Mims with our top 10 2nd round pick. Get Cole Kmet with the other acquired 2nd round pick. Take

1(10.) Jedrick Wills, OT Alabama // Tristan Wirfs, OG Iowa // Derrick Brown, NT Auburn // Mekhi Becton, OT Louisville

**1(19.) Henry Ruggs, WR Alabama // Justin Jefferson, WR LSU

**2.) Denzel Mims, WR Baylor

2.) Cole Kmet, TE Notre Dame

3.) Robert Hunt, OT/OG Louisiana-Lafayette

3.) Prince Tega-Wanogho, LT Auburn

Sign fowler

Sign Dupree

Draft Thomas 

Draft kindley

Let go schobert,randell,cut vernon

Savings 37,000,000

Spent 44,000,000

Then draft a safety and wr round 3.

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If we trade OBJ and Jarvis before the seasons starts I might take a hiatus from the league.

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6 hours ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said:

It's my opinion that, if Young falls to #3, the Lions take him without hesitation. He's the best player at our greatest position of need. I really don't see a scenario where the Lions pass on him.

Probably the case but the lions are actively shopping pick #3 same with skins at 2.

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