BStanRamFan Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 On 3/1/2020 at 8:02 AM, sammymvpknight said: An elite DE is more valuable than an elite LB/S. All else being equal, you have to lean toward Young. I agree with this assumption and yet I still feel like I would take Simmons at #5. Being able to cover TE's is becoming increasingly more valuable. A great DE can be neutralized by a double team and you have to hope another player on your team steps up. I see Simmons as more than just elite, he is a RARE talent who can cover, rush, defend the run etc. Has an impact in so many more facets of the game than just constant QB pressure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PossibleCabbage Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 I mean, the better way to phrase the question is: "What king's ransom would it take to move from 2 to 5, knowing that Joe Burrow, Tua Tagovailoa, Chase Young, and Jeffrey Okudah will be gone." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammymvpknight Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 1 hour ago, BStanRamFan said: I agree with this assumption and yet I still feel like I would take Simmons at #5. Being able to cover TE's is becoming increasingly more valuable. A great DE can be neutralized by a double team and you have to hope another player on your team steps up. I see Simmons as more than just elite, he is a RARE talent who can cover, rush, defend the run etc. Has an impact in so many more facets of the game than just constant QB pressure. Oh, I absolutely agree. There is no question that Simmons is a stud. He’s likely worth a top 3 pick regardless of position. My point, and I think you agree, that if you have similar grades on Young and Simmons...you will probably lean toward the DE. But I wouldn’t fault any team with going with Simmons, literally anywhere in the draft. He may indeed be the best player in this draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jebrick Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 To me, Simmons is Shazier or Polamalu. Both were Jokers on the Steeelrs defense. Both were taken mid teens. LT, CB, QB, pass rusher are more important. That being said, it only takes one. I think he falls outside the top 9. Goes 10-15 range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 1 hour ago, PossibleCabbage said: I mean, the better way to phrase the question is: "What king's ransom would it take to move from 2 to 5, knowing that Joe Burrow, Tua Tagovailoa, Chase Young, and Jeffrey Okudah will be gone." #5, #18, and I'd guess AT LEAST a 2021 2nd would be the starting point/I'm not going to hang up the phone on that offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tredaddy Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 36 minutes ago, MWil23 said: #5, #18, and I'd guess AT LEAST a 2021 2nd would be the starting point/I'm not going to hang up the phone on that offer. I'd expect WAS would want more to let Young go but I'm on the same page with you here. Essentially I think this comes down to how much is the separation between Tua and Herbert and do they like Tua that much to spend an extra 1st (and likely more) to secure Tua. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diamondbull424 Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 On 2/29/2020 at 9:07 PM, HTTRDynasty said: Let's also assume Trent Williams gets the extension he's seeking and the package the Redskins receive to trade back is Miami's 2020 #5, #26 and their 2021 1st. I would easily trade down. The way I see it: Chase Young = Julius Peppers? OR Isaiah Simmons = Derwin James? Yetur Gross Matos = Chandler Jones? Likely top 15-20 pick = Kevin Zeitler? Would easily take the second haul. Especially considering that first round safeties generally have an incredibly low bust percentage, same with LBs so it’s a very safe pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiefer Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 On 3/2/2020 at 11:06 AM, BStanRamFan said: I agree with this assumption and yet I still feel like I would take Simmons at #5. Being able to cover TE's is becoming increasingly more valuable. A great DE can be neutralized by a double team and you have to hope another player on your team steps up. I see Simmons as more than just elite, he is a RARE talent who can cover, rush, defend the run etc. Has an impact in so many more facets of the game than just constant QB pressure. All the teams are talking about stopping the Chiefs right now. Neutralizing a top TE is definitely a priority. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oregon Ducks Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 1 hour ago, Chiefer said: All the teams are talking about stopping the Chiefs right now. Neutralizing a top TE is definitely a priority. lol what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 On 3/2/2020 at 12:06 PM, BStanRamFan said: I agree with this assumption and yet I still feel like I would take Simmons at #5. Being able to cover TE's is becoming increasingly more valuable. A great DE can be neutralized by a double team and you have to hope another player on your team steps up. I see Simmons as more than just elite, he is a RARE talent who can cover, rush, defend the run etc. Has an impact in so many more facets of the game than just constant QB pressure. Doesn't being such a great pass rusher that teams need to hold their TE in to double team you serve the same function as being able to cover a TE? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirill Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 1 hour ago, Oregon Ducks said: lol what? He's right you know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BStanRamFan Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 3 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Doesn't being such a great pass rusher that teams need to hold their TE in to double team you serve the same function as being able to cover a TE? Yeah, but usually a blocking TE. Kittle might be the only exception. Kelce is only chipping off the line before running his route. Not to mention Simmons ability to cover WR's in the slot makes him a valuable chess piece to drop back in coverage, rush the passer, or blow up a run play the LOS. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warsawian Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 (edited) I'm taking Isiah Simmons and it's because he has true field general potential, something that is very undervalued on the defensive side of the football in this league. You look at any great defense and you always see at least one guy at the Linebacker or Safety spot flying around, making plays, and making everyone else better. The guy that sets the tone of the defense, It's not as often that you see that out of a pass rusher or defensive lineman in general. I will never forget back when the Colts made a super bowl run and they had Dwight Freeney, Robert Mathis, and Bob Sanders. Well Bob Sanders got hurt and the defense was trash, then he comes back and they completely turned it around. You have to have a tone setter. Same thing for the Chiefs this year, while Frank Clark was a great acquisition I don't think it was what made our defense. Tyrann Mathieu is who made that defense come to life. There are other examples of this as well, Troy Polamalu, Ray Lewis, Bobby Wagner, Ed Reed, etc. The only pass rusher I can think of who ever had that kind of impact is LT and he was an OLB that could drop back into coverage as well. Also, I think Isiah Simmons could be just as effective of a pass rusher as Chase Young if he played 3-4 OLB. He's the kind of player you can build a defense around. Edited March 4, 2020 by warsawian 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 16 minutes ago, BStanRamFan said: Yeah, but usually a blocking TE. Kittle might be the only exception. Kelce is only chipping off the line before running his route. Not to mention Simmons ability to cover WR's in the slot makes him a valuable chess piece to drop back in coverage, rush the passer, or blow up a run play the LOS. An offense only gets 5 skill players. Pulling a 3rd receiver off the field to add that blocking TE helps your defense in much the same way as elite coverage does. The routes available to a TE shrinks significantly if he's being asked to chip before hand. We haven't seen if Simmons can cover NFL WRs in the slot. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BStanRamFan Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 16 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said: An offense only gets 5 skill players. Pulling a 3rd receiver off the field to add that blocking TE helps your defense in much the same way as elite coverage does. The routes available to a TE shrinks significantly if he's being asked to chip before hand. We haven't seen if Simmons can cover NFL WRs in the slot. We haven't seen if any draft prospect can do anything against NFL players. Probably why this is in the NFL Draft thread. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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