Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
kurgan

kurgan 2020 mock draft+ v.2

Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

This started as a mock draft, but I run out like always.  This is my mock offseason/rest of the time till Week 1. 

Pre-Draft Position breakdown with Numerical draft priority (1-9):

 

0--QB:  Big Ben, Mason, Duck Hodges, Paxton Lynch, JT Barrett

2--RB: James Connor, Jaylen Samuels, Benny Snell, Kerrith White, Trey Edmunds, Ralph Webb, Darrin Hall, Derek Watt

2--WR: Juju, James Washington, DJ, Switzer, Cain, Darboah, Custis, Henderson, Anthony Johnson

1--TE:  Gentry, Rader, CSW, Ebron, McDonald

2--OT: Villy, Chuks, Derwin Gray, Banner

2-OG/C: DDC, Pouncey, Dilauro, Hassenhaur, Feiler, Wiznewski

 

2--DL:  Heyward, Tuitt, McCullers, Buggs, Mondeaux, Wormley

4--Edge: Watt, Ola, Tuzar, Dupree

4--ILB:  Vince, Bush, UG3, Spillane

1--CB:  Haden, Nelson, Sutton, Layne, Myres, Hilton

7--S: Edmunds, Fitzpatrick, Marcus Allen, Matthews, John Battle, Jordan Dangerfield

 

3--ST:  Berry, Bozwell, Canady

 

 

Reasoning: Offensively, we are mostly set, IMO.  Yes, I would bite on an explosive player falling to help in RB/WR with playmaking and explosion, but that would be about it.  I am good on the OL now with depth everywhere, and young guys being available and trained at most spots.  I would look at both a project OT and project OG/OC, knowing the age of our players there.

 

Defensively, the depth at ILB and OLB scares be, but the depth at S terrifies me.  We are one snap away from Marcus Allen or Dangerfield being on the field on DEFENSE.  I feel better about Ola/Tuzar/UG3 than either of those guys.  But, depth and ST must be addressed in these picks.  Also, NG must be picked to challenge/push McCullers off the roster.

 

Tier 1—(2)—Safety (Preferably FS)

Tier 2—(comp and 2 4ths)—Offensive playmaker, Edge, IOL

Tier 3—(6th/7th )—ILB/ST, NG

Tier 4 (UDFA)—WR/RB, OT, IOL, CB, Box Safety, Punter

 

2.49—Antoine Winfield Jr, FS Minnesota.  5’10” 200

NFL bloodlines-check.  P5 school-check.  Underclassman-check.  SPARQ-y athlete-check.  One chance to get safety right for our 3 safety nickel package AND cover Edmunds/Minkah for injury.  Safety is the only true ‘need’ that we have right now, and Winfield does more than cover it.  Save trading up for X. McKinney of Bama, Winfield checks the most boxes for what we look for in safeties and can come in and compete right away. 

Yes, I know that Hilton and Sutton can technically play FS, but this dude is what we look for.  Dinged for height and injury history, that is a concern for sure.  But, when he is on, he is a deep half safety that can cover TEs and run with WRs.  Down the road, he can make Minkah a more movable weapon and create a 2 high tandem with Edmunds.  I’m higher on Edmunds than most people, and I think that he and Winfield can blossom into a feared pair, and Minkah can add his skill set all over the place.

The only other target that I can see right now if he is gone is Ashtyn Davis.  He is not an underclassman, and is not as SPARQ-y as Winfield, but he can play high and cover the backend.  Maybe more of a high floor guy than Winfield, but not as good of a fit as I see Winfield.  I cannot see the Steelers taking Dugger or Chinn at this point.  They fit the athletic profile, but are not P5, and are not underclassmen.  Maybe if we had a first, they could cover this pick, but I do not see the FO hanging their hat on a guy like Dugger or Chinn.  I would love to be wrong, as I think Chinn could be a long term FS, but right now, Winfield is the pick.  So, if Winfield is gone, I would look either to Davis, or to an offensive explosion player like Swift or Taylor.

 

3.102—Antonio Gibson, RB/WR Memphis 6’0” 230

            Definition of an offensive playmaker.   High school tailback and track champion, JUCO tailback/slot WR, became a slot WR at Memphis until midseason when he took RB reps.  A do it all playmaker that is 6’0”, 230 and RUNS a 4.39!!!!  We are talking Kerrith Whyte’s speed in Jalen Samuel’s body.  Explosion waiting to happen.  He can follow the Samuels mold in that he can be drafted and placed with the RBs at first, and then moved around as he gets more comfortable in the offense.

            If he stays at WR, he is something that we don’t have… gamebreaking speed.  We would have to manufacture ways for him to get the ball, but he can go house at any time.  If he went with the RBs, he could also learn the nuances of that position as well.  He is, at least, something that we do not have on any level, and will be a game breaker wherever we play him.

            Worst case, he is a 4 phase special teamer on day one.  Kick returner, kick cover, punt gunner and returner.  As he grows into the game, he will get better at his slot.  No matter where he goes and takes snaps, there will be a learning curve.  I would bet RB with what we have, but he has never been a RB since high school.  Still, I would bet on him more as a RB than WR, and would add him to the mix in our RB room.          

            The other considerations that I had here are more proven RBs but with warts.  Anthony McFarland of Maryland is tempting as he is an upgraded White, but his size and lack of awareness troubles me.  The kid I really like here is Darryington Evans of App State, but he is a reach here.  He is an exciting guy that is a lot of what we do not have right now.  All of the potential WRs I like for us will be gone, with Duvernay of Texas being the only one that I could see in this range.  If he is available, I am also intrigued by Antonio Gandy-Golden.  I could be talked into him if he is here, and would not be mad about him.  He is not a speed guy, but would bring serious jumpball cred to our offense.  If we took Swift/Taylor above, we would have to get a S here, whoever is the best available, like Wallace of Clemson.

 

4.124—John Simpson, OG Clemson. 6’4” 331

            *Disclaimer—I coached this kid his first two years of HS football.  I cannot say enough good things about him, so I may be a *bit* biased… lol.

            Do you like hard-nosed old-school power guards?  Do you love to see 330lbs guards mauling DLinemen and climbing to the next level?  What about a pin and pull OG that can get out in front of wide sweeps or WR screens?  If you answered yes, do I have a prospect for you.  Simpson is a gigantic mauler that is A+ in the run game, and passable in the pass game as long as he is in a phone booth.  An All-State wrestler, Simpson knows how to win with leverage and when he gets his oversized mitts on you, it is over.

            OK, so what are the bad parts?  He is NOT position versatile at all… he is a guard, plain and simple.  No tackle flexibility, or center.  He can get lazy at times and grab and draw holding calls, also sometimes seems “asleep” at the line and is the last out of his stance.  Never been able to explain it, but they are at strange times as well.  Maybe someone can figure it out on the professional level (sports phycologist maybe?) but it is NOT an effort issue.  It is more of a mental hiccup that comes on every once in a while pre-snap.  The biggest issue I have with Simpson is the lack of functional athleticism.  His lateral quickness has always been an issue, and he can get overrun and ‘in the way’ at times on pin and pull concepts.  While I do not think this takes him off the board for power running teams like us, it is something that we are going to have to scheme around.

            I do not think he is a perfect prospect for us, but with my history with this kid, I had to put him in one of my mocks.  I would LOVE to see him in Black and Gold, and share stories with him when he comes home.  I can see the reservations and also the scheme issues, but the other kid that I coached in high school that made the league is a da*n Cowboy, so we don’t talk much, TBH.  All that being said, he would be great value here, and I am going to will it to happen.

 

4.135—Alex Highsmith, Edge Charlotte 6’4” 242

            Small school edge rushers… the Steelers have a type, amirite??  Anyway, there were some reports he was supposed to be a pre-draft visitor before they got shut down, so there was interest there.  Did real well at the Senior Bowl, Highsmith is made to be a 3-4 OLB, and will add in the room with Ola and Tuzar to be a group of young and hungry guys that will fight for the bone that Chickillo left behind.  2 of 3 will end up on the 55, and will be special teams guys.

            Highsmith, at this moment, is a pass rushing specialist with several moves that will translate to the next level.  He has a lot of work to do on the run aspect of his game, as he is light in the pants to set the edge and seems slow to diagnose POA runs.  He will excel on special teams with high work ethic and 4.7 speed.  Immediate ST guy and 3rd down pass rush option, with the frame and ability to get bigger and better at his job.

           

6.198—Bravvion Roy, DT Baylor 6’1” 320

            I’ve seen Futi and Jones on here a bunch of times, and I just wanted to introduce a different name than what is per normal.  I have seen Roy a couple of times, and he, to me, is more Hargrave than Casey Hampton.  Jones is Hampton, and Roy is a bit more athletic and mobile.  Not to the degree Futi is, but he won’t make it here.

            Roy is built like an old school nose, but plays more carefree and wild.  He takes himself out of plays sometimes, and needs to be corralled and calmed down.  He does have some gap penetration prowess and a bit of pass rush.  But, he was the strongest player at Baylor for the past two years, and grew up in the shadow of Billings. 

            I like him for us since he CAN, if coached up and corralled, play nose in short yardage and kick McCullers off the roster AND have SOME ability to play in subpackage as a 1-tech inside like Hargraves did at times.  For those that just want to replace McCullers, Jones is the guy, but I wanted someone that is a bit more of a boom/bust guy.

 

7.220—Joe Reed, WR UVA  6’0” 224

*Trade* Duck Hodges to Chargers who need some depth/QB options

            Looking for a 1:1 replacement for Johnny Holton.  A little smaller, but 4.47 and willing special teamer works for me.  He can play the gunner on one side, and Gibson or Layne can play the other.  Reed can also be in the mix for kick return duties.

            Long term, he has some slot usage that he can work into the #5 WR role over time.  Former RB as well gives some jet sweep, go route possibilities.  Great comp for Holton who will make his hay on ST and be in the mix longer term due to injuries.

 

7.232—T.J. Brunson, ILB South Carolina 6’0” 220

            Vince Williams, meet Vince Williams.

            See if this sounds good to you… high energy, high motor.  Leader.  Vocal player.  Powerful and efficient tackler.  Elite blitzer.  Willing and able to play special teams.  Issues in coverage against bigger and faster players, can be caught on outside runs.  Not fast, not overly athletic.  Totally in tune with his abilities and limitations, and plays above board.

            Looking at the depth at ILB, I have a feeling that Bush and VWill are the guys, and UG3 at some point will ascend to the backup slot.  Spillane is safe since he is a ST ace waiting to happen, and Brunson will slot in as a VWill understudy and will immediately help special teams.  Brunson will appeal to Steelers fans as a VWill clone that hopefully develop into a guy that can take over for VWill at some point as a cheaper option.

 

UDFAs—(Very important this year)

*Priority:

1) Colton McKivitz, OT WVU 6’6” 304—

Local kid, visited before the shutdown.  Has the height, length and reps to be a developmental prospect that we need right now.  Long term coverage for RT.

2) Myles Dorn, FS/SS North Carolina 6’2” 205—

A fall through the cracks player as not a physical marvel or athletic genius, more of a players player.  Can play box or FS, can be a long term project at FS that can be cover for Edmunds/Minkah/Winfield.

3) Joesph Charlton, P South Carolina 6’4” 193—

I think Mann and Turk get drafted, and I cannot bring myself to do it.  Charlton is the best not draftable punter, and had a great week at the Senior Bowl.  Serious comp for Berry.

4) Kalija Limpscomb, WR Vandy 6’0” 210—

Jitter bug guy that can make plays with no blocking, so gets a chance to come here and play.  An all slot guy that is quick but not fast, he can make guys miss and get upfield.  Should do well with better players around him.

5) Charlie Taumoepeau, TE Portland State 6’2”244—

Move TE that is a willing blocker/receiver that can be used in a lot of same ways as Derek Watt.  Wants to block, just doesn’t have the butt to do it.  PS squad candidate that will need a NFL-redshirt year.

6) Zach Shackelford, C Texas  6’4” 305—

Tall short armed Center that needs some refinement and work on log blocking.  Developmental prospect that is a long term project.

7) Stanford Samuels III, CB FSU  6’2” 205—

Long DB that is a zone corner that might be a transition guy.  NFL bloodlines, underclassman, convertible, scheme diverse.  Sloppy feet, not fast and not a sure tackler knocks him into UDFA territory, but worth a flyer to compete with Marcus Allen.

8) Bryce Perkins, QB UVA  6’3” 215

High risk/high reward player that is a modern day dual threat QB.  I’ve seen him a couple of times, and his best games have been his last few.  Pure DT QB, but can run around and make throws ala Ben.  Extends plays but can also kill you with his legs.  Would, at least, be a great scout for Lamar Jackson.

9) Bronson Rechsteiner, FB/ST Kennesaw State  5’10” 223—

One of my fave prospects… I just want him to be a Steeler.  Ok, 5’10” 223, 4.48 40 (same as Swift), 35 on the bench (6 more than any other back at the Combine, #3 OVERALL), been working out with Clemson players before his pro day (yep, Kennesaw State made it on 3/11).  Triple Option FB, LOVES BLOCKING.  Ok, best part.  Dad is Rick Steiner, former WCW superstar.  That means his uncle is Big Poppa Pump, Scott Steiner.  Special teams captain/beast in the making, and short yardage master.  I mean, we took a chance with Jonathan Dwyer, who was a Triple Option FB, so why not??  Plus, what a great story.

 

Steelers 55! Man roster (48 active, 2 are PS elevations and one has to be an OL)—

QB (3)—Ben, Rudolph, Lynch

RB (5)—Connor, Samuels, Snell, Watt, Gibson

WR (7)—Juju, DJ, JWash, Ebron, Deon Cain, Switzer, Joe Reed

TE (3)—McDonald, Gentry, CSW

OL (9)—Villy, Feiler, Pouncey, DDC, Chucks, Banner, Wiz, Simpson, (Gray—PS elevation)

O=27

 

DL (5)—Heyward, Tuitt, Wormley, Buggs, Roy

Edge (5)—Watt, Dupree, Ola, Tuzar, Highsmith

ILB (5)—Bush, VWill, UG3, Spillane, Brunson

CB (6)—Haden, Nelson, Hilton, Sutton, Layne, (Alexander Myers—PS elevation)

S (4)—Edmunds, Fitzpatrick, Winfield, Dangerfield

D=25

 

ST (3)—Charlton, Boswell, Canaday

ST=3

 

IA (7)—Lynch, Switzer/Cain/Reed, Gentry/CSW, Simpson, Highsmith, Brunson, Buggs/Roy  (based on matchups/gameplan)

 

PS (10—the extra 2 are above):  Bryce Perkins (QB), B. Rechsteiner (RB), K. Limpscomb (WR), Anthony Johnson (WR), C. Taumoepanu (TE), McKivitz (OT), Shackleford (IOL), Samuels (CB), M. Dorn (S), Tae Crowder* (ILB)

 

Roster Thoughts:

QB:  Ben is back.  He is #1. Rudolph, with the Hodges trade, is the clear #2 and right now heir apparent.  Another year to develop and to be Ben’s safety net.  Lynch rolls in as the grizzled veteran #3 who can carry the clipboard and knows how to manage the game if pressed.

RB: Lots of options here.  Connor is the #1 as long as healthy.  Samuels wins the 3rd down back job with a strong camp and also knowledge of what is role is really gonna be.  He becomes a true 3rd down back threat.  Snell emerges as the true Connor backup, and 8-10 carry a game guy (on games where Connor is healthy).  Watt is the FB/ST captain that is used some in true shortyardage and move TE guy.  Gibson starts in the back of the pack as he learns the RB position, and takes more plays as he gets used to it.  Think of how we used Kerrith White last year, a spark guy that can make guys miss and slip in situationally.  Also can line up in the slot and run some screens/jets.

WR:  Top 3 are set, JJSS, DJ, JWash.  I have Ebron here as WR #4, as he right now is the #4 WR.  I cannot bring myself to list him as a TE.  Switzer is the reliable guy who knows all the positions and is a safety net as PR (Plus is Ben’s buddy).  Cain is the speed burner/top off guy who will compete with Switz for a helmet based on matchups/gameplan.  Reed takes the Holton/DHB special teams gunner role that CAN play WR in a pinch.

TE:  McDonald is back and is the man.  Is our true TE.  In my mind, he is the most complete TE that we have.  Gentry and CSW are two dudes who will be used in different ways, and I can see them flipping based on matchups.  CSW for games with a passrusher/blocker feel as a chip and pop TE in a true 2 TE set, and Gentry if we want more flex/move sets.  Gentry will also get the hat if Ebron goes down, as he is the closest parallel. 

OL:  For me, the first OL is up in the air with bodies and dudes that can fill multiple roles.  So, we know that Villy, Pouncey and DDC are locked in.  Feiler will also be somewhere, either RT or LG.  We also know that Wiz will be either LG or interior swing, Chuks will either be starting RT or swing tackle.  I could see Banner anywhere.  Starting RT, Starting LG, Swing tackle, 3rd TE… really him and Feiler are going to decide where everyone else is going to play.  IF I WERE a betting man, I would guess Villy-Feiler-Pouncey-DDC-Chuks, with Wiz as swing interior and Banner being swing tackle AND 3rd TE.  Any way you slice it, those 8 guys are safe.  I have Simpson staying up but also being inactive, getting a helmet if someone gets hurt.  Now, I have Gray (who I see making a big jump), getting a helmet on gameday as the designated emergency OL.  I still think he is transitioning to an IOL, but he is position flexible.

(*Full Disclaimer—I tried to understand the new PS rules/55 man roster moves.  So, what I was able to understand, PS goes to 12 guys, and two of those guys get called up on gamedays to make the roster 55, even though 7 must still be inactive.  But, the two guys you call up have cannot be the inactive guys, and one MUST be an OL.  So, in effect, you have 46 active players, and 2 PS callups for your 48 even though your active roster is 55.  This created an odd scenario in which I had to call up a guy that I thought would be on the PS for the extra OL.  In this case, I could not see Simpson making it through waivers, so he stays on the active roster but is inactive, and Gray, who did make it through waivers and is on the PS, gets a helmet on gameday as the emergency OL… this was confusing, and again, I may be wrong, but this is how I did it.  That is why Myers was also called up as the PS player at DB)

DL:  This was pretty cut and dry.  Tuitt/Heyward are back, and they “start” in base at the DE, and slide inside on subpackage roles over the A and B gap.  They are truly each 80% snap players, and play all 3 downs.  I don’t think that we traded for Wormley for him not to play, and he ascends into the backup/spot starter role in a pinch.  He is a 13 game starter, and a guy that has done it before in Baltimore.  Buggs is the hype/energy guy that can be brought in and play the pass or rotate inside as well.  He played well last year, and with his college position coach as his NFL, growth will happen.  Roy will be the scheme/matchup guy with Buggs and will be the 0-tech plugger against run heavy teams, if Buggs and Wormley cannot play inside.

            To address the elephant in the room, I don’t see a future for Alualu here.  Expensive, older, already replaced.  Like I said, we didn’t get Wormley for him not to play, and he is more than a nose transition pick.  IF Tuitt is healthy, Alualu and Wormley are the same guy.  Both made starts, both can play early downs, both make decent money.  With Wormley on the roster, and emerging Buggs, I cannot see Alualu making the roster at $3.6 million.  6 DL seems excessive, and they are not going to throw Buggs away.  With Roy taking over McCullers, it is time to reshape and modernize the DL.  Tuitt/Heyward as starters, Wormley/Buggs as backups/flex players and Roy as the 20% NG makes sense to me.  IF Alualu makes it, he would bump Buggs to the street, or the PS.  I just can’t see it.  I’d flip him in the draft for a #7, but he just makes so much.  We have the guys to play without him, sorry.

Edge:  This one is easy.  Watt/Dupree start, and Ola/Tuzar fight for Chikillo reps.  Both are active and play ST.  Highsmith is a project, and if active, can help with 3rd down pass rush on Day 1, and that is about it.  By midseason, he might take reps from one of them, or injuries can get him active.  Should be good on ST in the coverage unit, and on passing downs.

ILB:  Another easy spot with depth concerns.  I obviously expect Bush to be a 3 down player, with VWill his partner on early downs.  UG3 ascends to the backup role, which is scary if Bush goes down for any reason.  Spillane is on the roster for ST, as was Dirty Red.  Brunson is on the 55, and is probably the 55th player, TBH.  He is inactive, and when active, will only play ST.  He is VWill’s understudy and cover, and would/should only be up if VWill goes down.

CB:  May be the 2nd easiest position on the roster.  Haden, Hilton and Nelson lead the way in nickel, Sutton coming on in dime.  Sutton is everyone’s cover as well.  Layne is working at outside corner, maybe stealing a rep or two here and there from Haden, and manning the gunner on ST role.  Myers is a gameday active, filling in as needed.

S:  Another easy set as Minkah/Edmunds start and play, with Winfield coming in for big nickel/3 safety sets.  Some flexibility with Edmunds/Winfield high and Minkah as a box player.  Dangerfield is active as another core ST guy.

ST:  Biggest comp at camp is Berry vs. rookie Charlton.  FO goes with the rookie, and he takes over the reigns.  Boz is back and Canaday does his thing.  4 phase ST guys are also set with Watt, Samuels, Ola, Tuzar, UG3, Spillane and Dangerfield.  Gunners are Layne and Gibson/Reed.  KRs are Switzer/Reed/Cain/DJ and Gibson and PRs are Switzer/DJ/Gibson.

PS: Perkins is developmental QB/Jackson practice dummy, Limpscomb/Johnson are young WR that practice hard and can come up and play slot if injuries happen, Charlie T is a move TE project, Shakleford and McKivitz will join Gray, Simpson and Banner on the youngin’s practice line, Dorn and Samuels are young players that can get better with reps and take reps off of starters/vets, Crowder is my UGA homie that is going to be a breakout star at ILB/special teams and Rechsteiner is on because it is my team now, and I love everything about this guy.

 

I know that formations and personnel are static, but based on tendencies, here are the gameday lineups in our most common formations:

Offense—11 personnel. (subs-role)

OL: Villy-Feiler-Pouncey-DDC-Chuks  (Banner-T, Wiz-IOL, Gray-E)

WR: DJ, JWash, JJSS-slot. (Cain-outside, Switz-slot, Reed-ST)

TE: EE-slot. (McDonald, CSW-Inline, Gentry-slot)

RB: Connor. (Samuels-3rd down, Snell-backup, Gibson-spark)

QB: Ben. (Rudolph)

 

Defense: nickel (subs-role)

DL:  Watt—Tuitt—Heyward—Dupree   (Ola—Buggs—Wormley—Tuzar). (Highsmith-project, Roy-base only)

ILB:  Bush-VWill.    (UG3-backup/ST, Spillane/Brunson-ST only)

CB: Haden-Hilton-Nelson. (Sutton-backup/dime, Layne-development/ST, Myers-depth)

S: Edmunds-Minkah (Winfield-backup/big nickel, Dangerfield-ST)

 

 

Ok, that took about 8 hours!!!  Thoughts, comments, questions…

Edited by kurgan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i would not be opposed to taking hurts if he's still there, would rather get him in over jameis if something were to happen to big ben

great stuff though, what you've got here... it keeps the d versatile and able to run the multiple packages that we like to do and work

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just nitpicking,

I don’t think enough was done to address our ILB depth. 

Also not the biggest fan of using that high of a pick on a “gadget” type player without a defined role like Gibson. Sure he could be a good special teamer but just don’t see him having much of an impact at all on offense year 1 with our current roster. If we use that high of a pick on him I’d hope that he could at least beat out Samuels for his spot on the roster. I am not a fan of drafting a RB unless it is one of the top 5 guys.

I like the Winfield and Highsmith picks a lot. Highsmith is someone I’m hoping they target.

Bryce Perkins can ball but Stanford Samuels is garbage. FSU fans were shocked he left early, ran a 4.65 and is a twig. Again just nitpicking, I know you have him as a UDFA.

I personally do not want or do not vision Switzer making the team next year. Waste of a roster spot.

I know Simpson is your guy but I don’t see the Steelers drafting an O-Lineman that high with no position versatility. 

I like what you did with the D Line. Alualu is old and redundant especially if Buggs takes a step forward which I think he will.

I don’t think “offensive playmaker” is a tier 2 need. We have JuJu, DJ, Washington, Ebron, and Conner. If we don’t use 49 on a starting RB or first round receiver that slips to us, I think we are best “ignoring” those positions and using our picks to sure up the trenches and improve depth on defense. Just my opinion. 

Thank you for putting this together, it was a great read.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@bigben07MVP, as an FSU what is your take on Lavonte Taylor.  A highly prized DB coming out and going to a College known for its DBs but as far as I can tell, he never really panned out.  He seems to have the size/agility to be a pretty good Nickel Safety.  What's your take?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Chieferific said:

@bigben07MVP, as an FSU what is your take on Lavonte Taylor.  A highly prized DB coming out and going to a College known for its DBs but as far as I can tell, he never really panned out.  He seems to have the size/agility to be a pretty good Nickel Safety.  What's your take?

Much better prospect than Samuels IMO. Unlike Samuels he’s not afraid to hit/tackle. He was much more consistent in coverage as well but I’d imagine he’s got a very low ceiling in the NFL. Played some free safety for us last year. He was a 5 star recruit I believe but he never lived up to that. I think injuries might have hurt him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, bigben07MVP said:

Much better prospect than Samuels IMO. Unlike Samuels he’s not afraid to hit/tackle. He was much more consistent in coverage as well but I’d imagine he’s got a very low ceiling in the NFL. Played some free safety for us last year. He was a 5 star recruit I believe but he never lived up to that. I think injuries might have hurt him.

He's from my hometown and there was such a buzz about him.. I followed him a little but it just never seemed to pan out.  I see he is a Late Rd/UDFA and I wouldn't have imagined that 4 years ago.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, Chieferific said:

He's from my hometown and there was such a buzz about him.. I followed him a little but it just never seemed to pan out.  I see he is a Late Rd/UDFA and I wouldn't have imagined that 4 years ago.  

Not a fan at all of 5 star recruits who underperform in college and are expected to all of a sudden realize their potential at the next level. Rarely does it happen. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, bigben07MVP said:

First, thanks for responding.  I love feedback of all types.

Just nitpicking,

I don’t think enough was done to address our ILB depth. 

Totally fair.  I realized I was in trouble when I was doing position breakdowns.  There was also a discussion on one of the threads about ILB depth.  UG3 will have to play above his head for sure if Bush breaks a shoelace.

Also not the biggest fan of using that high of a pick on a “gadget” type player without a defined role like Gibson. Sure he could be a good special teamer but just don’t see him having much of an impact at all on offense year 1 with our current roster. If we use that high of a pick on him I’d hope that he could at least beat out Samuels for his spot on the roster. I am not a fan of drafting a RB unless it is one of the top 5 guys.

100% get that.  I feel like we are not going to go all offense, but there are some holes on D, and so many ppl are pounding the table for skill guys.  I figured using the comp pick for an offensive player was OK, and when I got to 102, pickings were slim.  Gibson is intriguing to me, and I could see him being an upgraded spark guy over White.  All of the WR's were meh.

I like the Winfield and Highsmith picks a lot. Highsmith is someone I’m hoping they target.

Thanks.  I feel like Highsmith is a Steelers type pick.  If he played in the MAC, he would be 100%

Bryce Perkins can ball but Stanford Samuels is garbage. FSU fans were shocked he left early, ran a 4.65 and is a twig. Again just nitpicking, I know you have him as a UDFA.

Good info.  Didn't watch many FSU games and I just know with bloodlnes, these dudes are always Steelers targets.  I will take that info into account.

I personally do not want or do not vision Switzer making the team next year. Waste of a roster spot.

I tried to get rid of him... I really did.  But, his knowledge of the O, being Ben's buddy, and at least ST capable, keeps him around.

I know Simpson is your guy but I don’t see the Steelers drafting an O-Lineman that high with no position versatility. 

Again, I agree.  My only saving grace is Chuks is not position versitile and he was a 3rd.  Foster was taken as guard only as well.  But, I agree.  But, I had to get him in.

I like what you did with the D Line. Alualu is old and redundant especially if Buggs takes a step forward which I think he will.

Thanks.  I know it is not popular, but it makes sense to me.  Especially if we could flip him for a draft pick.

I don’t think “offensive playmaker” is a tier 2 need. We have JuJu, DJ, Washington, Ebron, and Conner. If we don’t use 49 on a starting RB or first round receiver that slips to us, I think we are best “ignoring” those positions and using our picks to sure up the trenches and improve depth on defense. Just my opinion. 

Thanks.  I am always defensive minded and would have loved to go S, ILB, Edge... ect.  But, I know Colbert is gonna take a WR at some point.  I also know we have a small history with player position conversions.

Thank you for putting this together, it was a great read.

Thanks for the feedback.  I really appreciate it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

I'm ok with the Winfield pick.  I know I've been beating a dead horse but this pick only solves the ILB "problem" if you expect Edmunds to slide into that spot.  If the plan is for VW to "Start" and then have Edmunds slide down to ILB and add Winfield on "Passing" downs then ok.  But I don't think that's what the Steelers want.  Your strategy could work but I believe they want a Full time Hybrid ILB and only have VW come in on 3rd and short.  Is that Edmunds?  Maybe.  But drafting Winfield early would all but assure that.  Again, I like what Winfield brings.  I just don't know if that's the direction they wanna go.  

-Because holes were filled in FA, I actually don't mind the Gibson pick.  He would certainly bring some unpredictability and needed explosiveness to the Offense.  Depending on available OL and/or WR, I wouldn't mind it.  I see it as the "Dri Archer experiment" 2.0 but with a better all around player.

-It's pretty cool you have such a close tie to Simpson.  If the OG/OCs are gone, he'll provide nice depth.

-Highsmith is a good get here.  Good rotational player and a possible starter down the road.  Could be a 3rd and Long nightmare early. 

-It's no secret I prefer Jones but Roy does fit a need and would at least kick McCullers out.

-No issues with Reed.  Holton is gone so that's already a good start.  

-I don't think we need another VW. Switch out Brunson for Floyd (VT) and we have our Hybrid ILB.   

Edited by Chieferific

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the Steelers might be interested in T.Muse the SS from Clemson as a possible ILB.
They had dinner with him, and in our D, he's not really a safety. His 4.449 at 6'3 220 (roughly) surprised a lot of folks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Chieferific said:

I'm ok with the Winfield pick.  I know I've been beating a dead horse but this pick only solves the ILB "problem" if you expect Edmunds to slide into that spot.  If the plan is for VW to "Start" and then have Edmunds slide down to ILB and add Winfield on "Passing" downs then ok.  But I don't think that's what the Steelers want.  Your strategy could work but I believe they want a Full time Hybrid ILB and only have VW come in on 3rd and short.  Is that Edmunds?  Maybe.  But drafting Winfield early would all but assure that.  Again, I like what Winfield brings.  I just don't know if that's the direction they wanna go.  

Eh, it is bit more complicated than that.  Let's assume that Bush is a 3 down backer.  So, on run downs, we are OK with VWill being in the game in base (Either a true 3-4 or some version of base/nickel with 4 down linemen.) . As we go "subpackage" nickel and dime, VWill has to come off.  Now, in nickel, Hilton comes on.  No big deal, we are in nickel more anyway.  Again, Bush is still on the field.  Now, big nickel/dime is usually 4 DL (2 IDL, 2 Edge) 1 backer (Bush) and some mix of 6 DBs (4 CB/2 Safeties for dime, 3 of each for big nickel).  Again, we are operating under the assumption that Bush is still on the field as the dimebacker.  In this scenario, either Sutton or Winfield come on as 6th DB.

So, in my mind, in base nickel which we are in 60% of the time, Hilton is on the field anyway, and Bush is the only LB on the field.  You have to remember that when we go from base to subpackage, we actually go to a bigger front as Watt and Dupree roll down to the line.  Essentially, the nose comes off and Hilton comes on.

Now, to @bigben07MVP 's point, the issue comes if Bush can't go.  We have a real issue then.  The easy answer is UG3 steps up, but in reality, subpackage would look more like what you describe above.  You would still take the NT off and but Hilton on, but what I would do is add Winfield and roll Minkah down to dimebacker, but the concept is the same.  It essentially takes big nickel off the table, but you would be OK in dime with Sutton and Hilton.  Or,  you could even tag Sutton as your dimebacker, and he comes on with Hilton, and then Layne would come in in dime.  Either way, it is still doable, but not ideal.

-Because holes were filled in FA, I actually don't mind the Gibson pick.  He would certainly bring some unpredictability and needed explosiveness to the Offense.  Depending on available OL and/or WR, I wouldn't mind it.  I see it as the "Dri Archer experiment" 2.0 but with a better all around player.

Yea, I am not too keen on the Archer comparison, but I get it.  I actually enjoyed how Fichner used White late in the year last year, and can see Gibson as a better version of him.  Faster and bigger. He is going to take some time for sure, but he is a homerun hitter.  i actually like the McFarland pick later, but Gibson won't make it till the 4th, and I really like what he would be able to bring as a gimmick guy first, then a long term RB later.  I guess its my old OC talking, and I would love to have a spark guy like him to use.

-It's pretty cool you have such a close tie to Simpson.  If the OG/OCs are gone, he'll provide nice depth.

Thanks.. its about right for him here.  I am worried about scheme usage for us, but I hope I am wrong.

-Highsmith is a good get here.  Good rotational player and a possible starter down the road.  Could be a 3rd and Long nightmare early. 

He fits our mold for sure.  Needs to work on run defense put you are right, he is a pass rush nightmare

-It's no secret I prefer Jones but Roy does fit a need and would at least kick McCullers out.

I actually like Jones better as well, but he is everyone's choice in every mock draft.  Roy is more of a passrusher, while Jones or one of the Nebraska boys are pure NG.

-No issues with Reed.  Holton is gone so that's already a good start.  

Yea... he is bit bigger and a bit slower.  BUT, is more WR capable and is a dog.  Plus, I think we have to cut ties with Hodges if Rudolph is the guy.  As long as Hodges is around, Rudolph will be compared to him.

-I don't think we need another VW. Switch out Brunson for Floyd (VT) and we have our Hybrid ILB.   

Agree to disagree... early round ILBs are important.  If VWill goes down, early downs are going to be a mess.  You still have to have a thumper in the middle on early downs and in base sets.  He might be a 40% player, but he is important.  Having an understudy for his role is important, just like the development of UG3 is important to cover for Bush if he can't go.

THanks for your insights.... 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, bigben07MVP said:

Not a fan at all of 5 star recruits who underperform in college and are expected to all of a sudden realize their potential at the next level. Rarely does it happen. 

Yeah, beyond stupid.  

Its hype that never dies.  Look at Christian Hackenberg.   He sucked throughout college and under normal circumstances, wouldve been a late rounder or UDFA, but no...he goes 2nd round because people felt he had the tools to turn it around.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, mwalker said:

I think the Steelers might be interested in T.Muse the SS from Clemson as a possible ILB.
They had dinner with him, and in our D, he's not really a safety. His 4.449 at 6'3 220 (roughly) surprised a lot of folks.

i have seen him mocked as a 4th to us a couple times and i am on board there. I am not as concerned about getting a thumping lb to add to that group as much as i would like to continue to add guys who can cover ground. 2 down run stuffing lbs can be picked up off the pile mid season a lot easier if need be. having him and gilbert doing speical teams and some sub package stuff is good for me

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, kurgan said:

Eh, it is bit more complicated than that.  Let's assume that Bush is a 3 down backer.  So, on run downs, we are OK with VWill being in the game in base (Either a true 3-4 or some version of base/nickel with 4 down linemen.) . As we go "subpackage" nickel and dime, VWill has to come off.  Now, in nickel, Hilton comes on.  No big deal, we are in nickel more anyway.  Again, Bush is still on the field.  Now, big nickel/dime is usually 4 DL (2 IDL, 2 Edge) 1 backer (Bush) and some mix of 6 DBs (4 CB/2 Safeties for dime, 3 of each for big nickel).  Again, we are operating under the assumption that Bush is still on the field as the dimebacker.  In this scenario, either Sutton or Winfield come on as 6th DB.

So, in my mind, in base nickel which we are in 60% of the time, Hilton is on the field anyway, and Bush is the only LB on the field.  You have to remember that when we go from base to subpackage, we actually go to a bigger front as Watt and Dupree roll down to the line.  Essentially, the nose comes off and Hilton comes on.

But that's not what they did last year. Baron and Bush were on the field at the same time the vast majority of the snaps. 

The Dri Archer comparison wasn't a player comparison. It was a scheme comparison. I like the idea of bringing a quick and explosive guy out of the backfield. That's what Dri was supposed to be. 

Edited by Chieferific

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Chieferific said:

But that's not what they did last year. Baron and Bush were on the field at the same time the vast majority of the snaps. 

The Dri Archer comparison wasn't a player comparison. It was a scheme comparison. I like the idea of bringing a quick and explosive guy out of the backfield. That's what Dri was supposed to be. 

I see what I did now.  Yea, I am a visual learner, and when I had it all sketched out, I missed the transition.  Yes, I have Winfield coming in on nickel, and VWill going out.  I have Winfield and Edumunds as FS, and Minkah as the dimebacker.  Or Edmunds.  At least by midseason.  I could see Sutton being the extra DB early, since he has some experience with it from before, and leaving Minkah/Edmonds deep until Winfield gets his feet wet.  In this scenario, the extra dime DB would be Layne.

So... 'base' is Bush/VWill, nickel is Bush/Sutton (or Minkah), dime is just Bush.

I agree that the Steelers might want a true cover backer on the field, a true replacement of Barron.  That would be UG3 now.  I could see us looking at Muse/Wallace from Clemson to come and fill that role, TBH.

Sorry about the confusion.

 

Yes, I like the scheme comparison.  Exactly how we used White last year, but with a whole year, and some passing duties as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  



×