rcon14 Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 Epenesa doesn't even come close to clearing the athletic thresholds GB uses at either EDGE or DL. Using percentiles for EDGE because that's easier to showcase than raw numbers... Threshold for EDGE... 40 SPEED: 38th percentile Agility: 41st percentile Epenesa 40 SPEED: 2nd percentile Agility: 42nd percentile You could say "oh he's not a good long runner, being bursty is what matters. Expect his 10 SPEED percentile is also 2nd percentile. His scores actually rank worse at IDL where he clears neither Speed nor Agility thresholds. I'm not even saying he's a bad player, but GB has never taken that level of athlete on the DL/EDGE before. He's either a bad athlete at EDGE or a very undersized IDL with pretty underwhelming athleticism. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubz41 Posted March 31, 2020 Author Share Posted March 31, 2020 5 minutes ago, CWood21 said: No. I'm just not a huge fan of drafting positional tweeners, and expecting them to put on 20 pounds and not lose functional athleticism. The same damn thing could be said about Datone Jones that we're saying about Epenesa. Do you still have your Datone Jones jersey? Epenesa has a track record of production, I'm not worried about him being able to play 5 tech. To use your logic....Gary is going in the HOF because he has all the measurables and is a fantastic athletic freak? C'mon, put down the tape measure and just watch his tape. His lack of measurables is why he is going to be there at 30. Plus, we need him on the roster so we can see how many times people misspell his name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 2 minutes ago, rcon14 said: He's either a bad athlete at EDGE or a very undersized IDL with pretty underwhelming athleticism. This. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubz41 Posted March 31, 2020 Author Share Posted March 31, 2020 3 minutes ago, rcon14 said: Epenesa doesn't even come close to clearing the athletic thresholds GB uses at either EDGE or DL. Using percentiles for EDGE because that's easier to showcase than raw numbers... Threshold for EDGE... 40 SPEED: 38th percentile Agility: 41st percentile Epenesa 40 SPEED: 2nd percentile Agility: 42nd percentile You could say "oh he's not a good long runner, being bursty is what matters. Expect his 10 SPEED percentile is also 2nd percentile. His scores actually rank worse at IDL where he clears neither Speed nor Agility thresholds. I'm not even saying he's a bad player, but GB has never taken that level of athlete on the DL/EDGE before. He's either a bad athlete at EDGE or a very undersized IDL with pretty underwhelming athleticism. I will bet my left nut that Epenesa's rookie year will surpass the uber athletic Gary's first year.! Sometimes you just have to get a football player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcon14 Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 2 minutes ago, Dubz41 said: Do you still have your Datone Jones jersey? Epenesa has a track record of production, I'm not worried about him being able to play 5 tech. To use your logic....Gary is going in the HOF because he has all the measurables and is a fantastic athletic freak? C'mon, put down the tape measure and just watch his tape. His lack of measurables is why he is going to be there at 30. Plus, we need him on the roster so we can see how many times people misspell his name. A: GB just gave the 5-tech on the roster an extension last season B: Teams don't really use the 5-tech that often anymore. If you assume you have two EDGE at pretty much all times, you're only using the 5-tech in the way you are describing with a great deal of regularity in base personnel, which is becomming a smaller and portion of your snaps. C: At 275 he'd be a puny 3T, so the value he'd provide there would primary be as a pass rusher, except ZDS is often used as a stand-up 3T in obvious passing situations. I'm not even saying Epenesa is a bad player (though his poor athletic scores would lead me to believe he has a low ceiling). I just don't see where the value is for him here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcon14 Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 4 minutes ago, Dubz41 said: I will bet my left nut that Epenesa's rookie year will surpass the uber athletic Gary's first year.! Sometimes you just have to get a football player. I like how the insinuation here is that I thought Rashan Gary was a good pick. I hated the Gary pick. You want EDGE guys that are both elite athletes and good football players. Gary was not the latter. Epenesa is not the former. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 21 minutes ago, CWood21 said: No. I'm just not a huge fan of drafting positional tweeners, and expecting them to put on 20 pounds and not lose functional athleticism. The same damn thing could be said about Datone Jones that we're saying about Epenesa. Epenesa has little functional athleticism. He's a pure technician, let him add the weight. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 14 minutes ago, rcon14 said: Epenesa doesn't even come close to clearing the athletic thresholds GB uses at either EDGE or DL. Using percentiles for EDGE because that's easier to showcase than raw numbers... Threshold for EDGE... 40 SPEED: 38th percentile Agility: 41st percentile Epenesa 40 SPEED: 2nd percentile Agility: 42nd percentile You could say "oh he's not a good long runner, being bursty is what matters. Expect his 10 SPEED percentile is also 2nd percentile. His scores actually rank worse at IDL where he clears neither Speed nor Agility thresholds. I'm not even saying he's a bad player, but GB has never taken that level of athlete on the DL/EDGE before. He's either a bad athlete at EDGE or a very undersized IDL with pretty underwhelming athleticism. Those thresholds are going to be thrown in the trash this year when you have a pool of maybe 25-30% of this class with a full athletic testing portfolio. Scouts are going to have to watch tape this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcon14 Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 Just now, Packerraymond said: Those thresholds are going to be thrown in the trash this year when you have a pool of maybe 25-30% of this class with a full athletic testing portfolio. Scouts are going to have to watch tape this year. Not necessarily be thrown in the trash, but it's moreso that fewer players eliminate themselves from "the board." Guys like Epenesa who did everything and were bad have no reason to stay on the board. 1 minute ago, Packerraymond said: Epenesa has little functional athleticism. He's a pure technician, let him add the weight. He'd have to add about 20 pounds and not become a worse athlete. Seems incredibly unlikely for him to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 9 minutes ago, rcon14 said: Not necessarily be thrown in the trash, but it's moreso that fewer players eliminate themselves from "the board." Guys like Epenesa who did everything and were bad have no reason to stay on the board. He'd have to add about 20 pounds and not become a worse athlete. Seems incredibly unlikely for him to do that. None of the 49ers DL is anything to write home about athletically. We like RAS and we use it, though I refuse to believe we watch tape, recognize a good football player, than take him off the board if he doesn't test well. You'll end up with loads of Oren Burks' doing so. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcon14 Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 1 minute ago, Packerraymond said: None of the 49ers DL is anything to write home about athletically. We like RAS and we use it, though I refuse to believe we watch tape, recognize a good football player, than take him off the board if he doesn't test well. You'll end up with loads of Oren Burks' doing so. Nick Bosa 9.43 RAS, 4.14 shuttle (96th %tile for DEs), 7.1 3C (81st%tile for DE), 1.62 10-split (90th %tile for DEs) Dee Ford 8.04 RAS, 7.07 3C (83rd %tile for DEs), 4.59 40 (98th %tile for DE), 10'4'' Broad (94th %tile for DEs), he did run a terrible shuttle Arik Armstead was quite mediocre for a DE, but once you move him to DT 8.67 RAS, 95th+ %tiles in broad and vert, 71st %tile 10-split, and 65th+ %tile for 3C and shuttle Buckner was again quite mediocre at DE, but moving him to DT 8.26 RAS, 97th %tile broad, 82nd %tile shuttle, 58th %tile 10-split, 86th %tile vert, 72nd %tile 3C All 4 of them, when playing their actual position, are plus athletes, and Bosa is an AWESOME athlete. And if you do the same thing for Epenesa (move him from DE to DT), he does get quite a bit better. Except Armstead and Buckner were both over 290 and Epenesa is 275. The difference there is massive. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 6 hours ago, Packerraymond said: Epenesa has little functional athleticism. He's a pure technician, let him add the weight. So...what little athleticism he has, what do you anticipate it happening when he puts on another 20+ pounds? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaegybomb Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 As fun as he is to watch I think he gets drafted by a team that lets him do what he does best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 7 hours ago, Dubz41 said: Plus, we need him on the roster so we can see how many times people misspell his name. Not as much as Daved Baktere 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 14 hours ago, Packerraymond said: None of the 49ers DL is anything to write home about athletically. We like RAS and we use it, though I refuse to believe we watch tape, recognize a good football player, than take him off the board if he doesn't test well. You'll end up with loads of Oren Burks' doing so. ??? The 49ers DL are awesome athletes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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