skywlker32 Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 On 11/9/2020 at 9:46 PM, AntonChigurh said: Tyson Alaulu makes TJ Watt, TJ Watt Of the people that you could choose, Alualu is not high on that list. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAF-N72EX Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 13 hours ago, skywlker32 said: Of the people that you could choose, Alualu is not high on that list. Over the years I have now heard that Alalua makes Watt, Watt makes Heward, and Heyward/Watt make Dupree. Where do we go from here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diamondbull424 Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 On 10/30/2020 at 4:22 PM, diamondbull424 said: The conversation between the two players was always “close” and after 4 games, I don’t see why anyone would’ve changed their opinion. Given 8-12 games? Maybe that would be enough time, maybe. But the Browns have gone through the easier portion of their schedule having already played the Bengals terrible OL twice for MG to feast off of. While TJ Watt hasn’t played against them at all. That’s definitely the kind of OL where Watt could go off for 5-6 sacks in two games vs them and it wouldn’t “shock” anyone at all. And just like that, one game against the Bengals and Garrett and Watt are nearly tied in sack production. I wonder what will happen once he plays the Bengals a second time. Could he actually overtake Garrett’s sack totals that were also enhanced by the Bengals outings? Though he might go for 3 sacks in the game. He’s a true difference maker defensively. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
43M Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 (edited) Garrett is a slightly better pure pass rusher, but Watt is a slightly better overall player IMO. Obviously I have some bias, but Watt drops into coverage a decent bit and is quite good at it for a pass rushing OLB. He has a complete game. Maybe Garrett could play coverage too, but he has never been asked to...so that point automatically goes to TJ. They are pretty close in the run game, and Garrett's athleticism is why I give him an advantage as a pass rusher. Its always hilarious seeing people discredit other players by bringing up the players around them. People have done it to Ben for years. Im not saying there is no merit to the argument, but I see people bringing up guys like Tuitt and Dupree. Tuitt was out almost all of 2019 and Watt had a big season. As far as Dupree, what did Dupree do as a pass rusher before Watt got there? He was called a bust by many until teams started gameplanning for TJ. Bud has come a long way,. but he isnt on TJs level. Bottom line....both are elite players. Not sure why one HAS to be called better than the other. They have different responsibilities and different strengths, but overall are top end defensive players. Isnt that good enough? On 11/9/2020 at 9:46 PM, AntonChigurh said: Tyson Alaulu makes TJ Watt, TJ Watt This is either sarcasm, or one of the sillier posts Ive seen in awhile. Alualu is a welcomed surprise, but he only plays about 1/3 of our defensive snaps, and lines up at different positions on our DLine. Watt dominates even when Alualu isnt on the field. So thats a pretty silly claim to make. Edited November 16, 2020 by 43M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
43M Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 (edited) On 11/14/2020 at 3:34 AM, JAF-N72EX said: Over the years I have now heard that Alalua makes Watt, Watt makes Heward, and Heyward/Watt make Dupree. Where do we go from here? Ive never heard that Watt makes Heyward. Considering Heyward was dominant long before we drafted Watt, that comment makes little sense. The Alualu makes Watt comment is comical. There was some merit to Heyward and Watt making Dupree AT ONE POINT, but Dupree has developed into a good player. I dont know how good he will be on another team (depending where he goes), but he is a good fit on this defense complimenting Watt. Edited November 16, 2020 by 43M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
43M Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 On 10/31/2020 at 12:21 PM, ET80 said: Why is this a question? I like Watt, but this is Garrett/Garrett - by a significant margin. Not a knock on Watt, but it's acknowledgement that Garrett is THAT good. Please explain how he is ahead by a "significant margin". If you would take him over Watt, so be it, but what do you have to support your claim that Garrett is significantly better than Watt? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSURacerDT55 Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 I absolutely love how these Watt chasers love to conveniently act as if Watt and MG have the same supporting cast then act as if they are on an even plane, clearly glossing over the fact that one has a way easier path to production than the other. The smart people know there is a sizable difference between the talent of both players and as time goes on it will be easier to see. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 1 hour ago, 43M said: Please explain how he is ahead by a "significant margin". If you would take him over Watt, so be it, but what do you have to support your claim that Garrett is significantly better than Watt? He's singlehandedly making that Browns defense relevant. He's very much like JJ Watt in that you can scheme against him and he still makes an impact, even if his supporting cast isn't good (which is the case in Cleveland). TJ Watt is great, very elite. But I can't tell whether or not he'd be the same without all of that talent supporting him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqOptic Posted November 16, 2020 Author Share Posted November 16, 2020 4 hours ago, ET80 said: He's singlehandedly making that Browns defense relevant. He's very much like JJ Watt in that you can scheme against him and he still makes an impact, even if his supporting cast isn't good (which is the case in Cleveland). TJ Watt is great, very elite. But I can't tell whether or not he'd be the same without all of that talent supporting him. Relevant? The Browns D - including Garrett - isn't good. You want to discuss Relevant? Discuss how this same cast of characters minus Alualu and Nelson were largely an average defensive unit until Watt came around and became the best player on that defense. And yes, Minkah was added, but the Steelers D as a good unit turned the corner when Watt arrived. Minkah was the piece that putt he D over the edge though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqOptic Posted November 16, 2020 Author Share Posted November 16, 2020 4 hours ago, MSURacerDT55 said: I absolutely love how these Watt chasers love to conveniently act as if Watt and MG have the same supporting cast then act as if they are on an even plane, clearly glossing over the fact that one has a way easier path to production than the other. The smart people know there is a sizable difference between the talent of both players and as time goes on it will be easier to see. I'm not even going to get into this argument because it's just going to be cyclical... Steelers fans point out the massive gulf in their production... Browns fans point out that Garrett doesn't have as much help. Steelers fans point out that prior to Watt's arrival Heyward and Tuitt were merely good; Dupree was bordering on "Bust" territory. Browns fans argue this is somehow irrelevant. Nothing changes. I will leave with this though.... Quote T.J. Watt has 2 sacks, 2 QB hits & 2 tackles for loss vs the Bengals T.J. Watt (2020) & J.J. Watt (2015) are the only players over the past 15 seasons to record 9+ sacks, 25 + QBH & 10+ TFL in their teams 1st 9 games of a season J.J. Watt won defensive player of the year in '15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INbengalfan Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 Late to the party, but I think Garrett is more talented. If i'm a GM, the deciding factor for me is whether my teams plays a 4-3 or a 3-4 base. I'm taking Garrett in a 4-3 and Watt in a 3-4. Sorry if others added this already, but didn't feel like fishing thru 11 pages of potential browns/Steelers fan arguments. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 Myles Garrett DE - CLE T.J. Watt LB - PIT 2020 Rankings Tackles 19 20 Assists 6 6 Sacks 9.0 7.0 Passes Defended 0 6 INT 0 1 Fumbles Recovered 2 0 Fumbles Forced 4 0 TD 0 0 Safeties 0 0 TBH, I like TJ Watt a LOT. IMO, even throwing out the supporting cast argument, I think Myles has the edge in rushing the passer, creating turnovers with strip sacks, etc. Don't get me wrong, I was actually REALLY hoping that the Browns would double up and get him and Myles both instead of Peppers, so I was disappointed when they got him...not to mention when they traded up to #29, the pick before TJ, and got Njoku instead with Watt there...so that was very frustrating. The fact that 7 EDGE guys went before Watt is laughable, and I said so at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSURacerDT55 Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 1 hour ago, BlaqOptic said: I'm not even going to get into this argument because it's just going to be cyclical... Steelers fans point out the massive gulf in their production... Browns fans point out that Garrett doesn't have as much help. Zero help is more like it, the Browns currently have noone of the caliber of the front 7 guys you all have and this is not AT ALL UP FOR DEBATE Steelers fans point out that prior to Watt's arrival Heyward and Tuitt were merely good; Dupree was bordering on "Bust" territory. Yet still had a top 10/11 defense, which one is it going to be? And lets not forget Javon Hargrave who was a stud pass rusher from the NT Browns fans argue this is somehow irrelevant. Nothing changes. I will leave with this though.... My question is why do you all continue to scoff at legit questions, TBH I think you all are intelligent people and just refuse to admit it. Watt has an easier path to production, while Garrett, well you already know....and is still productive (albeit slightly) but even that, Garrett still beats him on impact plays with forced fumbles and fumble recoveries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSURacerDT55 Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 8 hours ago, 43M said: Please explain how he is ahead by a "significant margin". If you would take him over Watt, so be it, but what do you have to support your claim that Garrett is significantly better than Watt? *clears throat* He's doing more with less, thats how..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSURacerDT55 Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 (edited) 9 hours ago, diamondbull424 said: And just like that, one game against the Bengals and Garrett and Watt are nearly tied in sack production. I wonder what will happen once he plays the Bengals a second time. Could he actually overtake Garrett’s sack totals that were also enhanced by the Bengals outings? Though he might go for 3 sacks in the game. He’s a true difference maker defensively. Such a low hanging fruit argument, so how do you explain this?, this is against one of best in the league. https://www.nfl.com/videos/myles-garrett-rips-past-laremy-tunsil-for-third-down-sack Edited November 16, 2020 by MSURacerDT55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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