CriminalMind Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 35 minutes ago, BWG VIKE said: Are we going to be able to sign him long term? If not then when do we want the 3rd rd pick this year or or 2022? With the depth at some of the positions of need this may be a good year to coup that pick. No need to coup the pick now. Might as well get another good season of harris now, and potential trade next year for 3rd 2021 or let him going and get comp 3rd pick in 2022. No need to rush it, if we are not getting a 2nd now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cearbhall Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, BWG VIKE said: Are we going to be able to sign him long term? If not then when do we want the 3rd rd pick this year or or 2022? With the depth at some of the positions of need this may be a good year to coup that pick. The compensatory pick, if one were to come and it was to be at the third round level, would be in the end of the third round. If a compensatory pick were to come it is a lot more likely that it would be at the end of the fourth round. Safeties simply do not see many huge contracts and the compensatory formula only contemplates the percentile across the entire league, not within a position. With the changes to the compensatory formula in the new CBA a third round pick will be even harder to come by. To qualify at the third round level, according to the new CBA, the ranking would have to be in the top 5% across the league. An average value of $13M is still only a 4th round pick this year. It is hard to imagine Harris getting more than that. Unless the team is going to extend Harris getting a 3rd round pick anywhere in the round this year for him would be great. I would rather see the team putting those resources (cap dollars and the draft pick compensation) into a position other than safety. If the team really envisions spending that kind of cap at the safety position they may want more than a 3rd or 4th round pick this year. Personally, I hope they do not envision investing that much of their cap into the safety position. Edited April 3, 2020 by Cearbhall 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marshpit23 Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 10 hours ago, Cearbhall said: The compensatory pick, if one were to come and it was to be at the third round level, would be in the end of the third round. If a compensatory pick were to come it is a lot more likely that it would be at the end of the fourth round. Safeties simply do not see many huge contracts and the compensatory formula only contemplates the percentile across the entire league, not within a position. With the changes to the compensatory formula in the new CBA a third round pick will be even harder to come by. To qualify at the third round level, according to the new CBA, the ranking would have to be in the top 5% across the league. An average value of $13M is still only a 4th round pick this year. It is hard to imagine Harris getting more than that. Unless the team is going to extend Harris getting a 3rd round pick anywhere in the round this year for him would be great. I would rather see the team putting those resources (cap dollars and the draft pick compensation) into a position other than safety. If the team really envisions spending that kind of cap at the safety position they may want more than a 3rd or 4th round pick this year. Personally, I hope they do not envision investing that much of their cap into the safety position. Maybe this is you. Me on the other hand with numbers like compensatory forumula So how much actual cash do the Vikings have right now to still make some moves? And do you think they cut Reiff to get some more or not? Also what is the amount they have free to sign a CB in free agency? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CriminalMind Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 If they have held on to Reiff this long, I don't think they're would be a cut forthcoming, without some kind of inflection point, being a trade for Trent, or after the draft. I don't think we'll really want to sign a +5M free agent who would count towards out comp pick formula (to negate Waynes 3rd round comp pick in 2021), its better they just wait till after the compensatory date (sure they could be gone by than, but its a balance) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cearbhall Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 35 minutes ago, Ozzy said: So how much actual cash do the Vikings have right now to still make some moves? And do you think they cut Reiff to get some more or not? Also what is the amount they have free to sign a CB in free agency? As far as I can tell, the amount of cash the Vikings have on hand is not constraining them. The salary cap seems to be more of a problem than the cash on hand. The team does have enough salary cap space to make some moves yet especially considering moves at this point in free agency usually have small cap impacts. I do not think they cut Reiff to get more cap space. The only reason I can fathom them cutting Reiff is if they get a guy in the draft that beats Reiff out for the starting job. If that happened I would expect the team to try trading Reiff before cutting him. As far as how much they have free to sign a CB in free agency, that depends on how much they want to spend in other areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cearbhall Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, CriminalMind said: If they have held on to Reiff this long, I don't think they're would be a cut forthcoming, without some kind of inflection point, being a trade for Trent, or after the draft. I don't think we'll really want to sign a +5M free agent who would count towards out comp pick formula (to negate Waynes 3rd round comp pick in 2021), its better they just wait till after the compensatory date (sure they could be gone by than, but its a balance) I agree with you on Reiff, but any free agent signed would cancel out Mackensie Alexander, not Trae Waynes in the comp formula. After that they still have Andrew Sendejo as another net compensatory loss. It would take signing a compensatory free agent to a deal worth over $13M per year for that signing to offset the loss of Waynes. At this point in free agency, the odds of that are vanishingly slim. With respect to waiting until after the compensatory signing period, that isn't too far from now. The new CBA moved that date up to the Monday after the draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heimdallr Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 I think makes sense to trade Harris, because FFMD is more fun with more picks 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gnat Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 Morning doughnut run complete. Only bear claws today for @vike daddy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heimdallr Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 3 minutes ago, The Gnat said: Only bear claws today for @vike daddy Wow, so apparently what I have known as a "bear claw" is actually called an apple fritter. Never seen an actual bear claw before. My whole life is a lie. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpMc Posted April 3, 2020 Author Share Posted April 3, 2020 I'm leaning towards accepting the Harris deal with Tampa Bay that is valued around the 70th pick in the draft. I know it's something that a GM would never admit, but we are not a super bowl competitive team with what we currently have, and tying up 20+ million in the safety position for the foreseeable future isn't going to help us get there. Gives us some more valuable currency in the draft to move around with to pick/choose our targets. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 19 minutes ago, RpMc said: I'm leaning towards accepting the Harris deal with Tampa Bay that is valued around the 70th pick in the draft. I know it's something that a GM would never admit, but we are not a super bowl competitive team with what we currently have, and tying up 20+ million in the safety position for the foreseeable future isn't going to help us get there. Gives us some more valuable currency in the draft to move around with to pick/choose our targets. So the Vikings could get a 3rd rounder for a starting safety? Then not only need to absolutely draft a CB, now would need to also absolutely draft a S as well, that would be a bad move. Could have two rookie starters in that secondary compared to just one, yeah give me one. See how Harris plays this season to decide on giving him more money or not. Maybe they could go DE and S 1st round and hope a CB falls to them in the 2nd but then the OL is not being addressed at all which is also not good. If the Vikings do not think they will be a competitive team, then why did this resign Kirk Cousins? If they will not be competitive or get to the playoffs, why resign him when they could have drafted his replacement in Love or Herbert if they fall to them which is most likely not going to happen. Or go with Eason or Fromm later in the draft but even that is not very likely especially with Eason going early 2nd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpMc Posted April 3, 2020 Author Share Posted April 3, 2020 Pushing the decision a year, and now you've got to decide if you want to lock up a 30 year old safety to a long term deal. I've already made my thoughts on the Cousins resigning clear in another thread, so I won't muck up this one with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted April 3, 2020 Share Posted April 3, 2020 34 minutes ago, RpMc said: Pushing the decision a year, and now you've got to decide if you want to lock up a 30 year old safety to a long term deal. I've already made my thoughts on the Cousins resigning clear in another thread, so I won't muck up this one with them. The entire point of the tag is for them to buy time, filling one starting secondary position is easier to do than filling two. Sure they probably will not resign him long term but at least can use him this season and then draft a safety next year. Only positive in this is getting what that $11 million back to be able to use? That an having the chance to draft Winfield Jr who would be a great fit at safety. If they can then use that cash to get a veteran corner it would make more sense. Because no way they can address the DE, CB, OG, and S position not to mention OT or DT or WR all with only three selections in the top 80 picks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpMc Posted April 3, 2020 Author Share Posted April 3, 2020 The entire point of the tag was to not lose a good player for free, they tagged him and immediately started shopping him. So in that sense, yes, it was to buy time. What's the point of having Harris for one year, that realistically won't be a Super Bowl year instead of adding another player or two this year, letting them learn on the job, and come back better next year in likely a more competitive year for the team. Minnesota sports franchises have a terrible habit of being okay with being good, not calling a spade a spade (or a subpar team, subpar), and being stuck in mediocrity for too long. By letting go of Rhodes, Joseph, Waynes, and Alexander already we've started the re-tooling process; holding on to Harris, especially if it's just for a year, puts a stopper in that process. The cap space created can be used for veteran signings, re-signing our own players, or rolling forward the unused cap into next year for signings/re-signings. There are also a few veteran safeties that are available in free agency as well that could be stop-gap players if that's the route we want to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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