2018 College Prospect Thread

[broncofan48]

1 hour ago, jsthomp2007 said:

Which leaves Nelson and that is as safe a pick that you can get...not saying he will be an All-Pro...but could be.  Right now, that would be easier to predict than which QB will even make a few Pro Bowls. 

Since 2000 by my count 82 offensive lineman have been drafted in the first round.  11 have won a super bowl.

Kenyatta Walker was on the 2002 Bucs A good team all around.

James Carpenter got his playing with Russ.

Logan Mankins and Nate Solder played with Tom Brady, one of the best of all time.

Bryant Mckinnie (Flacco), Ryan Clady (Peyton), Michael Oher (Flacco), Russel Okung (Peyton), Bryan Bulaga (Rodgers) all had 1st round QBs at the helm of those super bowl wins.

Lane Johnson could go into this category as well with Wentz.

Jammal Brown played with Drew Brees another all time great who happens to be the #33 pick just outside of the first round.

 

Maybe I’m off base here but it just seems to me it’s a lot easier to get a decent enough OL in the middle rounds than QB.  Every team has an idea which good QBs have a shot to be successful which drives the QBs value into the first and early first at that.  Elway is going to upgrade the QB position in a big way.  No Cousins it will be a rookie at #5 unless we trade up to grab one even earlier 

[AKRNA]

1 hour ago, jsthomp2007 said:

Which leaves Nelson and that is as safe a pick that you can get...not saying he will be an All-Pro...but could be.  Right now, that would be easier to predict than which QB will even make a few Pro Bowls. 

He might as well buy a time share in Hawaii for late Jan, early Feb. He'll be spending the next decade or so over there anyway.

[thebestever6]

6 minutes ago, AKRNA said:

He might as well buy a time share in Hawaii for late Jan, early Feb. He'll be spending the next decade or so over there anyway.

Nelson  or a top 5 player and Hernandez? Given a trade up for Hernandez?

[thebestever6]

I know nelson doesn't compare but boy was robert Gallery a reach in 07.

[germ-x]

1 minute ago, thebestever6 said:

I know nelson doesn't compare but boy was robert Gallery a reach in 07.

Here’s the thing.  After the fact Gallery was a terrible reach.  Before it he was considered the best OL in a decade.  

You can look at others who were highly touted.  At one point Chance Warmack and Jonathan Cooper were the best OGs anyone had seen.

Leonard Davis is another.  He made some pro bowls and had a nice career, but wasn’t ever a game changer.

Dont get me wrong I like Nelson, but like any other player he isn’t a lock to be elite.  I’ve seen that logic fail too many times.

[thebestever6]

11 minutes ago, germ-x said:

Here’s the thing.  After the fact Gallery was a terrible reach.  Before it he was considered the best OL in a decade.  

You can look at others who were highly touted.  At one point Chance Warmack and Jonathan Cooper were the best OGs anyone had seen.

Leonard Davis is another.  He made some pro bowls and had a nice career, but wasn’t ever a game changer.

Dont get me wrong I like Nelson, but like any other player he isn’t a lock to be elite.  I’ve seen that logic fail too many times.

I think its the notre dame Zach Martin effect. But you're right anything can happen. You know he's smart and has the work ethic though.

[jsthomp2007]

9 hours ago, AKRNA said:

He might as well buy a time share in Hawaii for late Jan, early Feb. He'll be spending the next decade or so over there anyway.

How could you pass on that, if it is THAT certain in area of need.  I think you gotta go Nelson.  And, if you can get Orlando Brown in the 2nd or 3rd, because he didn't run well at the combine...get'em...I mean, you do have to run fast to be a lineman?  I don't get that?  It isn't like Brown is going to be running post patters to catch TD passes.  But can he play LT and you move Bolles to RT?  Or, can Brown man the right side?  I think you do something like all of that, and you get a really great offensive line that is relatively young...even if you move McGovern to center if Paradis not healthy...then you get even younger.  And,, we know the importance of having unity at OL.  

[broncos67]

41 minutes ago, jsthomp2007 said:

How could you pass on that, if it is THAT certain in area of need.  I think you gotta go Nelson.  And, if you can get Orlando Brown in the 2nd or 3rd, because he didn't run well at the combine...get'em...I mean, you do have to run fast to be a lineman?  I don't get that?  It isn't like Brown is going to be running post patters to catch TD passes.  But can he play LT and you move Bolles to RT?  Or, can Brown man the right side?  I think you do something like all of that, and you get a really great offensive line that is relatively young...even if you move McGovern to center if Paradis not healthy...then you get even younger.  And,, we know the importance of having unity at OL.  

I don't think guard is a certainty area of need. In fact, I think CB is more of a pressing need than guard, considering we did see some good things out of McGovern. Positional worth has to come into play. Why not take the best Punter at 5? It's because it's not a spot in the draft where you spend a premium pick on that position. Nelson is a fantastic prospect, no doubt. But a guard won't win you a SB. If we land a QB in FA (Cousins), yes, go get him, but if we don't, it would be foolish to pass up the chance at an elite QB prospect for a chance at an elite guard.

Also, there's zero chance Orlando Brown ends up in Denver. His lack of conditioning at altitude might actually kill him.

[broncosfan07]

2 hours ago, broncos67 said:

I don't think guard is a certainty area of need. In fact, I think CB is more of a pressing need than guard, considering we did see some good things out of McGovern. Positional worth has to come into play. Why not take the best Punter at 5? It's because it's not a spot in the draft where you spend a premium pick on that position. Nelson is a fantastic prospect, no doubt. But a guard won't win you a SB. If we land a QB in FA (Cousins), yes, go get him, but if we don't, it would be foolish to pass up the chance at an elite QB prospect for a chance at an elite guard.

Also, there's zero chance Orlando Brown ends up in Denver. His lack of conditioning at altitude might actually kill him.

Hey Keith Traylor and Sam Adams didn't die while playing here.

 

 

[AnAngryAmerican]

2 hours ago, broncos67 said:

I don't think guard is a certainty area of need. In fact, I think CB is more of a pressing need than guard, considering we did see some good things out of McGovern. Positional worth has to come into play. Why not take the best Punter at 5? It's because it's not a spot in the draft where you spend a premium pick on that position. Nelson is a fantastic prospect, no doubt. But a guard won't win you a SB. If we land a QB in FA (Cousins), yes, go get him, but if we don't, it would be foolish to pass up the chance at an elite QB prospect for a chance at an elite guard.

Also, there's zero chance Orlando Brown ends up in Denver. His lack of conditioning at altitude might actually kill him.

I agree. Even if we do land Cousins (unlikely) I would prefer to go another way than Nelson at No. 5. An OG, no matter how good he is, is not worth the No. 5 overall pick. An elite OT prospect, an Ogden/Pace/Clady type, sure, not an OG though.

Furthermore, I am almost certain that if we land Cousins that we will move down from No. 5 unless Barkley somehow falls that far. I don't see the value and the need matching up. We're not going to take Calvin RIdey or Minkah Fitzpatrick, they're both Alabama players, Nelson as I said is not worthy of the No. 5 pick. I suppose we could reach on someone like McGlinchey, Ward, Jackson, Smith, James, Vea, etc., but I'd rather pick up a more premium picks and still land a top-15 or top-20 prospect.  

The Bills, Dolphins or Cardinals are prime candidates to move up in front of the Jets to get a QB. If a package that includes a first-round swap, another premium pick this year and a premium pick next year is the offer, if I'm Elway I take it. An offer from Arizona, for example, that includes No. 15, their 2nd rounder this year and their first next year is a deal I would take, even if the value on the trade chart doesn't match up perfectly. 

[AnAngryAmerican]

6 minutes ago, broncosfan07 said:

Hey Keith Traylor and Sam Adams didn't die while playing here.

True. But Orlando Brown isn't coming here unless he falls all the way to the middle rounds and we decide to take a flier on him. Regardless of who has been making the personnel decisions - Shanahan, Mac or Elway - this team has always gone for OLs that grade out above-average in terms of their athleticism and many of those we've picked have come from higher-altitude colleges like Utah, Boise State and CSU. 

[AKRNA]

3 hours ago, jsthomp2007 said:

How could you pass on that, if it is THAT certain in area of need.  I think you gotta go Nelson.  And, if you can get Orlando Brown in the 2nd or 3rd, because he didn't run well at the combine...get'em...I mean, you do have to run fast to be a lineman?  I don't get that?  It isn't like Brown is going to be running post patters to catch TD passes.  But can he play LT and you move Bolles to RT?  Or, can Brown man the right side?  I think you do something like all of that, and you get a really great offensive line that is relatively young...even if you move McGovern to center if Paradis not healthy...then you get even younger.  And,, we know the importance of having unity at OL.  

Bolles belongs on the left side. It would have been nice to let him learn on the right but that ship sailed.

Paradis will probably chase the money so there's a good shot McGovern is looked at as his replacement. No matter, we're still weak and shallow on the OL.

[AKRNA]

3 hours ago, broncos67 said:

I don't think guard is a certainty area of need. In fact, I think CB is more of a pressing need than guard, considering we did see some good things out of McGovern. Positional worth has to come into play. Why not take the best Punter at 5? It's because it's not a spot in the draft where you spend a premium pick on that position. Nelson is a fantastic prospect, no doubt. But a guard won't win you a SB. If we land a QB in FA (Cousins), yes, go get him, but if we don't, it would be foolish to pass up the chance at an elite QB prospect for a chance at an elite guard.

Also, there's zero chance Orlando Brown ends up in Denver. His lack of conditioning at altitude might actually kill him.

I'm still wanting to know which QB prospect is elite?

To me, elite means "sure fire, can't miss, QB prospect with no real weaknesses".

I've not read or heard of one such in the draft. I agree with the bolded statement, I just haven't got a clue who that QB is. Neither do any pro scouts. They do however agree that Nelson is elite.

 

[AnAngryAmerican]

5 minutes ago, AKRNA said:

Bolles belongs on the left side.

Why? Because it's easier to commit holding penalties on the left side than it is on the right? 

[broncos67]

1 minute ago, AKRNA said:

I'm still wanting to know which QB prospect is elite?

To me, elite means "sure fire, can't miss, QB prospect with no real weaknesses".

I've not read or heard of one such in the draft. I agree with the bolded statement, I just haven't got a clue who that QB is. Neither do any pro scouts. They do however agree that Nelson is elite.

 

Not being able to agree on prospects is the result of two things- they are either all good, or they are either all bad. These are not bar QB prospects. You have two Heisman winners who profile as potentially decent QBs, Rosen is an incredible prospect whose outspokenness is getting highlighted because of the kneeling controversy this past year. Darnold is still an absolutely top notch QB prospect. Allen had everything you want physically in a QB.

The idea that unless the guy is Andrew Luck you should pass doesn't make sense to me. Luck, by the way, has been completely underwhelming in his role as Top QB of the last decade.