Raiders Offense Thread 2.0:

[NYRaider]

16 hours ago, jimkelly02 said:

The problem with that tho If is Ruggs isn’t catching passes deep consistently then teams will again roll coverages back to Waller.  Do teams double team John Ross 24/7? Absolutely not.

Its a great idea That Ruggs will magically open up the entire offense by pulling Safeties back .... but until he consistently is beating teams deep there not going to do that.  It’s a great idea but won’t happen nearly as much in real life.  

Look at someone like Will Fuller in Houston though. He hasn't been a world beater by any means but his speed certainly opens up their offense when he's on the field. They were 8-3 with him and 2-3 without him last season.

[NYRaider]

But I do agree that CeeDee Lamb is the best fit in our offense and the guy we should select at #12 if he's on the board. With his contested catch ability and YAC ability, he'd be an excellent fit with Carr and the closest thing we've had to Crabtree who Carr loved. And in terms of a vertical threat that can take the top off of a defense we already have one in Tyrell Williams. Williams has averaged 15+ ypc every year in the NFL. 

[jimkelly02]

1 hour ago, NYRaider said:

Look at someone like Will Fuller in Houston though. He hasn't been a world beater by any means but his speed certainly opens up their offense when he's on the field. They were 8-3 with him and 2-3 without him last season.

I’m not trying to discredit Ruggs or what he brings.  I think he has great skills.  It’s just that I think Ruggs isn’t going to always have this amazing effect on the defense.  

Just like with Fuller, my point is that there will be games where Ruggs goes off but also games where he has very minimal impact.  That’s just the nature of these speedy, long ball guys.  They run hot and cold.  That’s why there almost always best as secondary WR’s.  When they’ve recently been hot the teams do plan to slide help/coverage his way and when their cold they take their chances.

look at fuller, he’s done:

(what it averages in a 16gm season)

14gm: 47rec, 635y, 2TD >>> (53r/715y/2t)
10gm: 28rec, 423y, 7TD>>>(45r/680y/11t)

10gm: 32rec, 503y, 4TD>>>(51r/805y/6t)

11gm: 41rec, 670y, 3TD>>> (60r, 822y/4T)

Just as I suspected ...I figured he’d have very inconsistent TD stats but overall they wouldn’t be too great outside of 1 year and they aren’t stats that drive an offense.  

Im not trying to talk you out of your guy to push my guy.... I’m just trying to talk football. Ya know?  I’m just giving my concerns about Ruggs if he’s a WR1 in an offense.  There are far more Will Fuller WR2s then T.Hill WR1s when it comes to this speed guys.  Part of that is because the hot/cold nature of that type of WR.  When they don’t go off the offense can easily fall flat.  
In the NFL every team has several good weapons that a defense has to gameplan for.  When these speed guys have been hot the DC’s roll coverage their way and it opens up the under for other guys.  That really helps the other WRs and TE.  But when their not hot they lay off the deep coverage.  So it’s not like these guys constantly are opening up the underneath.  It’s always an ebb and flow.  And until Ruggs can consistently beat teams deep DC’s will take their chances.  My point is just that adding Ruggs doesn’t instantly or consistently break open the opposing defenses.

[SilverNBlackFan]

On 4/10/2020 at 11:54 AM, NYRaider said:

But I do agree that CeeDee Lamb is the best fit in our offense and the guy we should select at #12 if he's on the board. With his contested catch ability and YAC ability, he'd be an excellent fit with Carr and the closest thing we've had to Crabtree who Carr loved. And in terms of a vertical threat that can take the top off of a defense we already have one in Tyrell Williams. Williams has averaged 15+ ypc every year in the NFL. 

I think Jeudy is probably the best "fit" for this Gruden offense, but Lamb is just the all around better player.

I hope that we go with Lamb but i wouldn't be shocked if we opted for Jeudy. He's your classic WCO receiver

Edited April 12, 2020 by SilverNBlackFan

[Bitty 2.0]

I just realized the Raiders overhauled the return game.

Riggs is a KR and Bowden is a PR.

I didn't think it was bad but I guess Maylock and Gruden did.

[NYRaider]

Offensive Depth Chart

QB - Carr | Mariota

RB - Jacobs | Bowden | Richard

FB - Ingold

WR - Ruggs | Renfrow | Agholor 

WR - Williams | Edwards | Jones

TE - Waller | Moreau | Witten

LT - Miller | Sharpe 

LG - Incgontio | Good

C - Hudson | James

RG - Jackson | Devey 

RT - Brown | Parker

Looks pretty damn good to me. 

[Rolni]

It's all on Gruden and Carr on offense now. They have everything for a dynamic offense. 

 

[NYRaider]

One of the things that stood out to me in Gruden's press conference was him discussing how much versatility we have offensively now. He said we're going to be able to run jumbo sets with 3 TE's and a FB, we'll be able to spread the defense out with 5 WR sets, and then everything else in-between, which will change week to week depending on matchups we're trying to exploit. 

[CaliforniaKid7]

Samaje Perine got waived by the Dolphins today. I loved him coming out of Oklahoma but it’s probably over for him. 

[NYRaider]

2 minutes ago, CaliforniaKid7 said:

Samaje Perine got waived by the Dolphins today. I loved him coming out of Oklahoma but it’s probably over for him. 

Why hasn't he really played at all over the last two seasons? 

[Humble_Beast]

16 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Why hasn't he really played at all over the last two seasons? 

too slow from what I can recall

[SilverNBlackFan]

13 hours ago, CaliforniaKid7 said:

Samaje Perine got waived by the Dolphins today. I loved him coming out of Oklahoma but it’s probably over for him. 

He's more bodybuilder than football player. Never liked him as a player.

[agarcia34]

One thing that worries me with Gruden is how stubborn he can be with not wanting to adjust his style. Kind of already seen it with Derek Carr having him under center so much when Carr's best year he was working out of the shotgun way more and had really good success. Look at Andy Reid he adapted his style when he got Mahomes and just pure speed at WR and totally made a change to his offense. While Ruggs and Bowden really excite me there are some thoughts in the back of my head that come up about if Gruden can change. After the draft or after day two of the draft he said the offense will still be the same with three TE's or two TE's can't remember which. Like is that just coach talk and not wanting to come out and say what you envision your offense will look like. If that's the plan that's crazy to me. Like buying a new sports car and just deciding to keep it in the garage cause you rather drive your beat-up Honda(Jason Witten). 

Gruden showed somethings last year that he didn't show the year before and those things were good some nice concepts on offense. I just think right now I am far more concerned with Gruden than I am with Carr. 

[MrOaktown_56]

6 hours ago, agarcia34 said:

One thing that worries me with Gruden is how stubborn he can be with not wanting to adjust his style. Kind of already seen it with Derek Carr having him under center so much when Carr's best year he was working out of the shotgun way more and had really good success. Look at Andy Reid he adapted his style when he got Mahomes and just pure speed at WR and totally made a change to his offense. While Ruggs and Bowden really excite me there are some thoughts in the back of my head that come up about if Gruden can change. After the draft or after day two of the draft he said the offense will still be the same with three TE's or two TE's can't remember which. Like is that just coach talk and not wanting to come out and say what you envision your offense will look like. If that's the plan that's crazy to me. Like buying a new sports car and just deciding to keep it in the garage cause you rather drive your beat-up Honda(Jason Witten). 

Gruden showed somethings last year that he didn't show the year before and those things were good some nice concepts on offense. I just think right now I am far more concerned with Gruden than I am with Carr. 

I think we are gonna run a lot of chiefs/rams concepts. Ruggs can do a lot of what brandin cooks did on speed sweeps and we can use him off of play action. I want to see spread concepts though. Carr excels in spread/shotgun concepts and we haven't seen enough of it.

[jimkelly02]

57 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

I think we are gonna run a lot of chiefs/rams concepts. Ruggs can do a lot of what brandin cooks did on speed sweeps and we can use him off of play action. I want to see spread concepts though. Carr excels in spread/shotgun concepts and we haven't seen enough of it.

I think you hit on an idea no ones mentioned yet: we should be seeing more shotgun/spread concepts this year.  
I think that is why we’re have brought in so many WRs... if we’re going to go 4 wide we needed to expand our depth and specifically bring in guys who can plan in the slot with speed... like Agholor, Ruggs, Bowden... as well as have outside receivers like Edwards and Williams.

my biggest concern is Carr potentially not utilizing the deep ball enough due to his timidness to go deep... however one must realize we didn’t have many blazing fast WRs in the past. We shall see what happens, I’m choosing to stay optimistic he will go deep when the opportunity presents itself.

on a side note, I’d really like to see Edwards also see time in the slot on occasion in the “big slot WR” role that Michael Thomas has perfected... he’s got such a large catch radius and great frame that he could box out smaller CBs on short, possession Routes while also being a nice target down the seem, stretching the defense.  

Im digging the WR core a lot... it’s diverse and brings speed and explosiveness for the first time in years.  

I’d also like to see Ruggs sweep and end arounds.  And those plays where he goes in motion and runs a wide sweep and the QB throws it to him just behind the line of scrimmage and he’s already for a amount of steam going forward when he catches it... idk what you call that.

I think Bowden can add the nice element of shifting between WR and RB presnap and we can isolate him on LBs, which is a big advantage.

I’ll stop being but simply add I’m sure Grudens going to be putting in 100s of hours designing new plays for our team... we should keep the conservative Ball control WCO as our base but also have packages where we spread the defense and threaten deep.