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goldfishwars

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Nice post @goldfishwars

Some follow up questions,

- Will the following players find themselves being washed out of plays and/or find it tough to disengage from NFL blocking; Isaiah Simmons, Kinlaw, Baun?

- You've said TE Trautman is a good in-line blocker, is this relative to his division (i.e he could block small school defenders) or is this projecting that he can be a good inline blocker in the NFL as well?

- If Kmet is a prototypical TE, but doesn't play to his size and isn't a go-to option, where do you think it's appropriate to draft him, if at all (from NE's POV...so say you're in the war room)

:D

Edited by Hunter2_1
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Awesome work.

Here are a few guys I was surprised to see left off the list, albeit I know I am much higher on them than mostly everyone:

 

1. Essang Bassey CB Wake Forest. 
-I have him in my top 15 prospects when it comes to grades  Stifling cover man that excels in press coverage. Reminds me of Joe Haden 


2. Hakeem Adeniji OG Kansas.  
-Clearly a 2nd tier OL, but an elite fit to move inside to guard and dominate in a ZBS  Elite movement skills. Capable of reaching over a gap and a half in zone blocking. Adequate pass blocking should be mitigated by moving inside  


3. Shaq Quarterman MLB Miami Fl. 
-Powerfully built linebacker. Excellent leadership skills. Diagnoses very fast. Effective blitzer. Beats the crap out of guards and fullbacks. Limited athletically and will not be able to cover TEs or receiving RBs in man-man. 


4. Logan Stenberg OG Kentucky. 
-Bully OG that buries people. Very aggressive and has a great frame for a power run scheme. Plays nasty. Too stiff and clunky to play in a movement scheme or be a space blocker. IIRC, some injury concerns. 

5. Jonathan Greenard DE Florida. 
-Built very strong. Excellent leadership traits. Plays hard on every snap. Has a wide array of pass rush moves. Sets the edge in the run game. One of the best DEs in the class of maintaining gap integrity while still getting a rush. Tested a lot worse than I anticipated. 

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1 hour ago, BleedTheClock said:

Awesome work.

Here are a few guys I was surprised to see left off the list, albeit I know I am much higher on them than mostly everyone:

 

1. Essang Bassey CB Wake Forest. 
-I have him in my top 15 prospects when it comes to grades  Stifling cover man that excels in press coverage. Reminds me of Joe Haden 


2. Hakeem Adeniji OG Kansas.  
-Clearly a 2nd tier OL, but an elite fit to move inside to guard and dominate in a ZBS  Elite movement skills. Capable of reaching over a gap and a half in zone blocking. Adequate pass blocking should be mitigated by moving inside  


3. Shaq Quarterman MLB Miami Fl. 
-Powerfully built linebacker. Excellent leadership skills. Diagnoses very fast. Effective blitzer. Beats the crap out of guards and fullbacks. Limited athletically and will not be able to cover TEs or receiving RBs in man-man. 


4. Logan Stenberg OG Kentucky. 
-Bully OG that buries people. Very aggressive and has a great frame for a power run scheme. Plays nasty. Too stiff and clunky to play in a movement scheme or be a space blocker. IIRC, some injury concerns. 

5. Jonathan Greenard DE Florida. 
-Built very strong. Excellent leadership traits. Plays hard on every snap. Has a wide array of pass rush moves. Sets the edge in the run game. One of the best DEs in the class of maintaining gap integrity while still getting a rush. Tested a lot worse than I anticipated. 

Thanks dude - yeah it was weird getting to 100 and realising I was gonna be leaving a bunch of guys off I liked a lot. Still haven't watched Quarterman or much of Bassey, but will make the effort now. 

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5 hours ago, Hunter2_1 said:

Nice post @goldfishwars

Some follow up questions,

- Will the following players find themselves being washed out of plays and/or find it tough to disengage from NFL blocking; Isaiah Simmons, Kinlaw, Baun?

- You've said TE Trautman is a good in-line blocker, is this relative to his division (i.e he could block small school defenders) or is this projecting that he can be a good inline blocker in the NFL as well?

- If Kmet is a prototypical TE, but doesn't play to his size and isn't a go-to option, where do you think it's appropriate to draft him, if at all (from NE's POV...so say you're in the war room)

:D

Trautman was the only tight end at the Senior Bowl who looked like he could block, so I'd say that isn't relative to his school. Kmet has all the tools to get better at that, there's a school of thought that playing baseball was still prominent in his mind until very recently and that a switch to football fulltime might see him grow into the position in the NFL. 

If I'm New England, we were in a similar place a few years ago when we drafted Gronk and Hernandez. I think they will need to draft at least two in this class, the best value is in the middle rounds though. 

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Quick takes:

Too High: 
Wills - Still a good prospect, don't get me wrong, but I think he's 4th of the top 4 OT prospects
Ruggs - People are enamored with that speed, but in some of their biggest games he was held in check
Mims - Once again, i'm a fan, just see him more in the 30-45 range than top 20 player in the class
Swift - Sometimes RBs are worth a 1st rd pick, I don't think any in this class are
Murray - Iffy run defense grades in college and Oklahoma never asked him to cover, and that scares me if they didn't want an athlete like that in coverage
Pittman - I think he's more of a possession receiver in the NFL with a ceiling as a poor mans Michael Thomas.  See him in the 45-60 range
Chinn - Needs a lot of refinement still

Too Low: 
Thomas and Wirfs - I'm back and forth with these two as the top OP in the class, I think both are top 8 players.  You're not far off, just feel they are definitely top 10 guys.
Josh Jones - One of the nastiest guys in the draft.  Put him at RT and let him wreck havoc 
Taylor - My favorite RB in the draft, I see him as a fringe 1st rd
Logan Wilson - Might be my favorite LB in the draft and one of the few proven 3 down LB
Madabuike - One of my favorite interior disruptors in the draft.  Could see him thrive as a 4-3 UT or a 3-4 DE
Eason - I think he's a better pro than he was in college.  Let him sit a year or two behind a vet and refine his game and I think he can be a top 10 QB eventually.
 

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This was awesome. Write ups were a long enough to provide a perfect picture of the prospect and short enough to keep you enticed for more. Well done, Fish.

You’re surprisingly low on Tee Higgins. How much of that, if not all, is based on his combine? His tape is really spectacular to watch. He’s a really fluid athlete with great body control. He plays faster than he times, and has excellent ball skills. But his lack of explosion might be an issue at the next level. On tape I see him in that Mike Evans/Alshon Jeffery role as a boundary receiver that dominates vertically and will win most one-on-one’s when the ball is in the air. But man, that vertical jump and 10-yard split worry me. What do you think? 

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19 minutes ago, SmittyBacall said:

This was awesome. Write ups were a long enough to provide a perfect picture of the prospect and short enough to keep you enticed for more. Well done, Fish.

You’re surprisingly low on Tee Higgins. How much of that, if not all, is based on his combine? His tape is really spectacular to watch. He’s a really fluid athlete with great body control. He plays faster than he times, and has excellent ball skills. But his lack of explosion might be an issue at the next level. On tape I see him in that Mike Evans/Alshon Jeffery role as a boundary receiver that dominates vertically and will win most one-on-one’s when the ball is in the air. But man, that vertical jump and 10-yard split worry me. What do you think? 

I wouldn't say I'm low on Higgins, I just find him a harder projection to the NFL. He's been a very good college player, but something isn't aligning when you test that poorly at the stuff which is supposed to be your calling card. I had a kinda similar issue with JJ Arcega-Whiteside last year. Testing isn't the be-all, but man you gotta hit certain thresholds sometimes. 

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54 minutes ago, goldfishwars said:

I wouldn't say I'm low on Higgins, I just find him a harder projection to the NFL. He's been a very good college player, but something isn't aligning when you test that poorly at the stuff which is supposed to be your calling card. I had a kinda similar issue with JJ Arcega-Whiteside last year. Testing isn't the be-all, but man you gotta hit certain thresholds sometimes. 

Higgins has definitely been hard for me to project. At first, I liked what I saw. Then saw some things that turned me away from him and moved him way down the rankings. Decided to go back and take a third look and now I'm way back up on him. Definitely disappointing to see how he tested. It's definitely a concern. But what there is to like is, you can't teach the ball skills, coordination and body control he possesses collectively. At the end of the day, he's such a natural receiver, he looks boring and lethargic on the field. And it took me a while to separate that because of how effortless he makes things look. The track record Clemson has put out at that position is definitely in his favor as well. While I don't think he necessarily compares to Nuk Hopkins as a player, his draft profile and career projection seem eerily similar to me. 

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If I had to nitpick receivers because I've watched them the most:

I feel that you're a little high on Jefferson. I don't feel that his slot production will be as valuable as outside receivers in the NFL. Spot on with Mims. I think you're a little low on Reagor. If Reagor and Jefferson swapped qbs, Jefferson would not even be mentioned in the first round conversation IMO, whereas Reagor IMO would be considered a "sure thing" top 20 prospect. 

I feel like you're a tad high on Pittman, but it's understandable because he excelled in the pac 12. I do think his lack of good DB competition in the pac 12 is a bit of a ding. I'd have him and Edwards closer to 50.

With Aiyuk you have a spot on grade. He just isn't close to a finished product at all. Don't understand the early 2nd late 1st hype.

I feel that you're low on Higgins. I have him as a late 1st. His testing wasn't ideal, but he has hands, played plenty fast, and is better in and out of his breaks than Pittman among others, while being a better YAC guy than some of the other "big" receivers. His game vs OSU and Okudah/Arnette only cemented that in my eyes. I see some positive similarities with Golladay and Michael Thomas. I see him as a productive,savvy., physical, posession receiver at the next level.

I appreciate that you also like Tyler Johnson. Draft twitter hates him for some reason (matt miller LOL).

Great eval on Duvernay as well. He is a weird projection for sure.

Great job overall, especially because grading receivers is pretty finicky.

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1 hour ago, Nex_Gen said:

Higgins has definitely been hard for me to project. At first, I liked what I saw. Then saw some things that turned me away from him and moved him way down the rankings. Decided to go back and take a third look and now I'm way back up on him. Definitely disappointing to see how he tested. It's definitely a concern. But what there is to like is, you can't teach the ball skills, coordination and body control he possesses collectively. At the end of the day, he's such a natural receiver, he looks boring and lethargic on the field. And it took me a while to separate that because of how effortless he makes things look. The track record Clemson has put out at that position is definitely in his favor as well. While I don't think he necessarily compares to Nuk Hopkins as a player, his draft profile and career projection seem eerily similar to me. 

He does have a relaxed playing demeanor, but there's not a lot of juice coming in and out of his breaks. All of those easy cushions from dudes who won't sniff the NFL and his languid comeback routes will be gobbled up at the next level. You are right, he can be a ball magnet when the ball is in the air and his body control is impressive. It also kind of needs to be, because the dude isn't shaking anybody. I think the route forward for NFL success is for him to land on a team where he has a QB who won't be afraid to consider him open, even when he's not. I think I heard someone say he could thrive in a way those big old Chargers receivers did when Norv and Rivers were bombing everybody, that made sense to me. 

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Thanks for this.  I would pretty much concur with it based off what I have looked at and read.

Love the fact that you got Bryan Edwards at 32, I think he'll be the best value receiver in this draft.

Most interesting points as picked up by some, The Higgins ranking and the Josh Jones ones for me standout.

Question, the other one that stood out to me was with regards to Blacklock. You have him the next guy on the Dline after Brown and Kinlaw and you got him at 20, why you like him so much and who is comp for him?

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Much appreciated. This is my favorite type of thread. The summaries are ideal length of summary.

I'm seeing Davon Hamilton pushed higher and higher in this type of list. As a Dolphin fan I've been hoping for a later grab. Now it looks like they might have to spend something #70 or higher, or forget about it. Their next pick is #141.

I'm reading nothing but negativity on Jordan Love no matter where I check. I often wonder if they are describing the Utah State guy or a different player. The summaries I've seen elsewhere don't describe Love at all. Fans are acting like he shouldn't be drafted. This summary isn't negative on Love, although the slotting is somewhat low. 

I think Jordan Love is going to make the naysayers look very silly, and it could happen a lot sooner than anyone expects.

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