Transfers & Rumors: Deadline Drama!

[UKTexans]

4 hours ago, Hunter2_1 said:

Can't really replace Coutinho, like-for-like. He's a pretty unique player, isn't he. A wide(ish), forward who can also be used in the center, who's creative but also scores long rangers, and can dribble and pass. I mean, Lemar isn't that, I think Goretzka operates more centrally? Certainly won't be Keita, who plays deeper and is more of an engine player. 

Mahrez is a wide player who can play down the middle. 

Julian Brandt? Jakub Jankto? 

 

[LeeEvans]

7 hours ago, The LBC said:

Random question and @LeeEvans you were the closet Dortmund fan for the longest time, weren't you?, so maybe you're the best to answer this, but...

Has Klopp ever actually worked with a French player he didn't inherit?  For the most part the type of players (particularly offensively) that France has put out over the past decade fit what Klopp aspires for, but I don't recall him ever seeking out a Frenchman while at Dortmund?

 

I liked a couple of their players (Reus and Hummels mostly) so I followed them a decent bit.

As @drd23 mentioned, Aubameyang is probably the closest player and they did bring him over from Ligue 1. It does seem odd that he didn't add more players that seemingly fit his scheme very well. Even at Liverpool he's not really gone after French or Ligue 1 players unless I'm missing someone obvious. 

@amac Posts about them quite regularly in the Bundesliga thread so maybe he's got some additional ibfo.

[LeeEvans]

25 minutes ago, texans_uk said:

Lacazette, Giroud and a fit Welbeck would be your 3 strikers. 

If they were to sign a talented winger to replace Sanchez, like Mahrez I think that would help the problem. 

It would be an interesting signing but I think that would be quite a drop from Sanchez to Mahrez. I like Mahrez but I think he lacks some of the energy and drive that Sanchez has shown at Arsenal (usually). Honestly I'm not even really sure what they're plan or play style is anymore at Arsenal and I'm not sure if they really know. 

Mahrez can certainly score some goals and can take players on as well as anyone but it's going to be hard to replicate Sanchez's versatility and impact. I wonder how he and Bellerin would do on the right together, I'd imagine sides could get at them down that wing.

[AustrianNiner]

18 hours ago, The LBC said:

I think they were more closely mutually tied when you consider the wage bill.  Now, granted, they did get Champions League money this season which would have enabled a boost in their commercial revenues (thus giving more wiggle room in the wage bill), but they also brought in Salah at 120k/wk, gave pay-bumps on extensions to Lovren and more important to Coutinho, the later to the tune of 200k/wk.  If they had no other plan to do any further buying in the January window I could have seen it being financially feasible to not sell Coutinho until the summer, but was the VVD addition alone enough to maximize the chance at ensuring a Top 4 finish, particularly with Spurs (without buying anyone) seeing their lineup strengthened by returns from injury, Chelsea having already spent (and potentially spending more), and Jose bleating to every news outlet that will hear him how he feels he needs to be allowed to spend much more in January?

With the money freed up (wages) and the funds gained (even minus the expenditure on VVD), they're likely able to get in two 25-40m players (likely to earn somewhere between 65-80k/wk in wages), whereas with keeping Coutinho they could maybe have had roughly in the neighborhood of 45-50k/wk to dangle in front of one additional player without having to offload (either via loan with full wages being covered by the borrowing club or via selling) a player.

Having one of the lowest net spends in the league, we really don't need to sell to buy. 

Klopp likes certain players and if he can't get them now, he'll wait, that's happened with VvD and Keita now and probably will with Lemar and Pulisic. Almost sure now we'd have sold Coutinho in the summer already if Lallana would have been fit. That's probably why we gave Arsenal quite a big amount of cash for Oxlade-Chamberlain late August, to have him in early. 

Still stupid to sell your best player midseason. 

[Hunter2_1]

4 hours ago, LeeEvans said:

 

I liked a couple of their players (Reus and Hummels mostly) so I followed them a decent bit.

As @drd23 mentioned, Aubameyang is probably the closest player and they did bring him over from Ligue 1. It does seem odd that he didn't add more players that seemingly fit his scheme very well. Even at Liverpool he's not really gone after French or Ligue 1 players unless I'm missing someone obvious. 

@amac Posts about them quite regularly in the Bundesliga thread so maybe he's got some additional ibfo.

Damien Le Tallec was on his squad. Don't know if he signed him? @The LBC

[Dr LBC]

50 minutes ago, AustrianNiner said:

Having one of the lowest net spends in the league, we really don't need to sell to buy. 

Klopp likes certain players and if he can't get them now, he'll wait, that's happened with VvD and Keita now and probably will with Lemar and Pulisic. Almost sure now we'd have sold Coutinho in the summer already if Lallana would have been fit. That's probably why we gave Arsenal quite a big amount of cash for Oxlade-Chamberlain late August, to have him in early. 

Still stupid to sell your best player midseason. 

Net spend doesn't mean much if you're up against a wage bill cap (and yes, the FA enforces a wage bill cap, it's just not the same cap for every club).  It really could just be a case of bad timing in that new commercial deals don't really kick in with the meat until after the first year.  But ultimately, and I'd touched on this during the summer too, even with Champions League football Liverpool and Tottenham aren't going to be able to foot the amount of 100k+/wk salaries that Chelsea, United, and City are because they're not getting the level of commercial deals/revenue those three are (even when Tottenham got Nike money this summer they're still not getting NIKE money the level that Chelsea and City are and Nike aren't likely to offer that money until they prove they can stay in CL consistently to give themselves exposure AND win something of note in order to get that exposure).

[Dr LBC]

5 hours ago, texans_uk said:

Lacazette, Giroud and a fit Welbeck would be your 3 strikers. 

If they were to sign a talented winger to replace Sanchez, like Mahrez I think that would help the problem. 

Honest question from an outsiders position because I've been back and forth on this myself, do Arsenal actually have a natural winger on the squad?  For years we've watched Wenger take non-winger and shoe-horn them into the position trying to get his best players all on the pitch at once even though they weren't playing in their natural positions (for the longest time it was pretty much a right of passage that any new attacking player at Arsenal would deputize at winger).  I'd argue the closest thing is probably Iwobi, but that's probably just me arriving at the realization he just plain doesn't have a future as any sort of #10 or central midfielder and fits on the wing better than anywhere else, not so sure he's a "natural" there.  If Walcott had ever actually learned to carry the ball at his feet, you could probably make an argument for him but that ship sailed long ago and it took him half his prime to learn to cross somewhere other than Row Z.

[AustrianNiner]

1 minute ago, The LBC said:

Net spend doesn't mean much if you're up against a wage bill cap (and yes, the FA enforces a wage bill cap, it's just not the same cap for every club).  It really could just be a case of bad timing in that new commercial deals don't really kick in with the meat until after the first year.  But ultimately, and I'd touched on this during the summer too, even with Champions League football Liverpool and Tottenham aren't going to be able to foot the amount of 100k+/wk salaries that Chelsea, United, and City are because they're not getting the level of commercial deals/revenue those three are (even when Tottenham got Nike money this summer they're still not getting NIKE money the level that Chelsea and City are and Nike aren't likely to offer that money until they prove they can stay in CL consistently to give themselves exposure AND win something of note in order to get that exposure).

As far is I'm aware, the wage bill cap is mostly about a limit of increasing the wage bill from season to season, but it can still be higher if other incomes increase, commercial sales(like the new TV deal) and others...I can't see LFC having a big problem(not like it's not there, but imo it's not the biggest problem and certainly not a reason to sell your best player) with that, have you got any numbers?

 

[Dr LBC]

Just now, AustrianNiner said:

As far is I'm aware, the wage bill cap is mostly about a limit of increasing the wage bill from season to season, but it can still be higher if other incomes increase, commercial sales(like the new TV deal) and others...I can't see LFC having a big problem(not like it's not there, but imo it's not the biggest problem and certainly not a reason to sell your best player) with that, have you got any numbers?

 

Numbers are always shaky this time of year as typically wage bill info doesn't really get showcased a ton until April and May (it's a shade easier for me to get Arsenal's stuffs because I know the specific resource to go to in the form of a shareholder whose big thing is working out the numbers and explaining them to the layman fan), so I fully admit I'm working from potentially outdated numbers and a general understanding of the structure.

That said, when your best player is making almost twice as much as the next guy on the bill, that's going to have an impact.  I can genuinely see it having been sound strategy and intent to get him signed to that extension at an amount they were well aware wasn't sustainable on the immediate front in order to ensure having more a bargaining position for when he was inevitably sold-on.  I think ultimately this same sort of thing is looming for Spurs as well at some point.  It's just the nature of the market and how things are going to tend to work when (the Leicester one-off aside) three clubs have won the league for the past decade-plus, and neither of our clubs have been one of those clubs so it's a case of being on the short end of the stick this time around.  You had 6 players on 100k+ before signing VVD and not counting Coutinho, another 2 at 90k, and it's safe to assume that VVD came in at at least 100k/wk.  With those kind of numbers, unless you're pulling in the commercial revenues of those Top 3, you're not going to fit ~ 9 players on 100k/wk (Countinho would count as 2 in this instance) under the wage cap.

[UKTexans]

1 hour ago, The LBC said:

Honest question from an outsiders position because I've been back and forth on this myself, do Arsenal actually have a natural winger on the squad?  For years we've watched Wenger take non-winger and shoe-horn them into the position trying to get his best players all on the pitch at once even though they weren't playing in their natural positions (for the longest time it was pretty much a right of passage that any new attacking player at Arsenal would deputize at winger).  I'd argue the closest thing is probably Iwobi, but that's probably just me arriving at the realization he just plain doesn't have a future as any sort of #10 or central midfielder and fits on the wing better than anywhere else, not so sure he's a "natural" there.  If Walcott had ever actually learned to carry the ball at his feet, you could probably make an argument for him but that ship sailed long ago and it took him half his prime to learn to cross somewhere other than Row Z.

The three closest you have are Walcott, Iwobi and Welbeck. 

All 3 are shoe horned there because ultimately they aren't good enough to hold down a CF position. They have their pros and cons, but ultimately they aren't good enough. 

[UKTexans]

6 hours ago, LeeEvans said:

Honestly I'm not even really sure what they're plan or play style is anymore at Arsenal and I'm not sure if they really know. 

I was thinking this too when replying to @The LBC.

[TomRalph]

[UKTexans]

2 minutes ago, TomRalph said:

Why do they even get a latest headshot?

[Dr LBC]

16 minutes ago, texans_uk said:

I was thinking this too when replying to @The LBC.

I don't think they do.  Wenger has always been someone who has more a concept in mind than an out-and-out fully-fleshed idea.  And he's notorious for his "go play your natural game" type of directions versus, by stark contrast, Pep's (for instance) "when the ball is here, this is where you're expected to be".  At best you can call the concept of play style that Wenger wants as "free flowing."  And he has his finger in so many (read: all of the) pots that even if others like Gadzidis, Gatting, Mislintat might have ideas of their own, it's ultimately Wenger (lack of finite) vision that's driving (and pretty much botching) everything.

[Eagles $5$]

In what world is he worth 20m??? If Arsenal sells I will lose all respect for Wenger (the little I have).