CWood21 Posted January 22, 2021 Share Posted January 22, 2021 18 minutes ago, VanS said: Mariota also had a great rookie season. Look where he is now. One season of great stats (especially as a rookie before teams have a beat on you) doesn't move me. Especially when I'm not impressed by the player when I watch him play. Nothing moves you. You're still going down with the Josh Dobbs boat. And Mariota's season pales in comparison to Herbert's. I'm not sure there's any statistic that Herbert doesn't blow Mariota out of the water from their rookie year. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetjuice Posted January 22, 2021 Share Posted January 22, 2021 On 4/28/2020 at 5:15 PM, VanS said: Odell rewrote the record book for WR production to start a career with a broken down Eli Manning. I never claimed DeAndre Hopkins wasn't also great. Just that Odell is better. Put him in Hopkins spot and he outproduces him. OBJ better than Hopkins? Can I have some of whatever you got? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanS Posted January 22, 2021 Share Posted January 22, 2021 17 minutes ago, CWood21 said: Nothing moves you. You're still going down with the Josh Dobbs boat. And Mariota's season pales in comparison to Herbert's. I'm not sure there's any statistic that Herbert doesn't blow Mariota out of the water from their rookie year. True. But Mariota still had a teally good rookie season. And I remember the hype. How many thought after that season he would be a backup just 4 years later at Tennessee and eventually let go? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 22, 2021 Share Posted January 22, 2021 1 hour ago, VanS said: True. But Mariota still had a teally good rookie season. And I remember the hype. How many thought after that season he would be a backup just 4 years later at Tennessee and eventually let go? It was okay. Let's not blow things out of proportion. His ANY/A of 6.10 ranked 21st among the 36 QBs who qualified. Herbert's ANY/A was 6.84 which ranks 15th out of 36 QBs who qualified. The problem was Mariota's numbers didn't really improve outside of the 2016 season. His 3rd and 4th year in the NFL, he ranked 22nd (out of 34) and 27th (out of 33). He plateaued as a rookie. If you think Herbert is going to plateau as a rookie, I'd ask you to explain why. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oregon Ducks Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Can anyone tell me how Dobbs is doing? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicMT Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 5 hours ago, VanS said: Oh I watched all of them. Especially Young. I saw nothing to make me change my pre-draft views. For the record, when I say bust its in relation to draft position and hype. So take Leonard Williams for example. He was drafted 6th overall in 2015 and was hyped as arguably the best player in that draft. He's had a decent career thus far as a solid starter. But he's made only 1 Pro Bowl and has been nowhere close to living up to his draft position or pre-draft hype. To me he's a bust given the hype despite still being a solid starter. Don't forget Chase Young was hyped as a generational pass rusher in the same class as Myles Garrett. That hype helped him get selected as a Pro Bowler in his rookie year despite mediocre production (7.5 sacks). For reference sake, just last year Raiders 4th round rookie Maxx Crosby had 10.0 sacks and didn't come close to making the Pro Bowl. If Chase Young is just a solid starter in 4-5 years with only 1 Pro Bowl selection like Leonard Williams rather than a superstar like say Myles Garrett then he would be a bust in my eyes. That'd be Myles Garrett who had 7 sacks his rookie season? I know he missed 5 games but still, being available to play is an ability as well. I understand what you're saying and it's true that expectations are really high for him and so he has to be better than say Leonard Williams (good example) to not be considered a bust. DEs usually take a bit longer to develop and I am confident C. Young will have more than 10 sacks next year and will continue to grow into a really good player. Let's revisit this next year I guess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicMT Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 33 minutes ago, Oregon Ducks said: Can anyone tell me how Dobbs is doing? Too early to tell! If only one team would give him a chance they'll see he's a top 5 QB... But Burrow & Herbert those we've seen enough to say they're not going to improve and bust out for sure! /jk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danger Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 On 1/21/2021 at 6:07 PM, CWood21 said: Didn't Herbert have one of the best rookie QB years ever? Can you ever admit you were wrong? THE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanS Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 4 hours ago, CWood21 said: If you think Herbert is going to plateau as a rookie, I'd ask you to explain why. Same reason as Mariota. Neither is as good as those first year stats suggest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanS Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 49 minutes ago, MagicMT said: That'd be Myles Garrett who had 7 sacks his rookie season? I know he missed 5 games but still, being available to play is an ability as well. I understand what you're saying and it's true that expectations are really high for him and so he has to be better than say Leonard Williams (good example) to not be considered a bust. DEs usually take a bit longer to develop and I am confident C. Young will have more than 10 sacks next year and will continue to grow into a really good player. Let's revisit this next year I guess If Young becomes a consistent 10+ sacks a year guy then I will admit to being wrong. We'll see next year as you said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragnarok Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 28 minutes ago, VanS said: Same reason as Mariota. Neither is as good as those first year stats suggest. Mariota got ruined by an awful coaching staff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 1 hour ago, Danger said: THE It was not the best rookie year ever. Russ and RGIII were better (off the top of my head) imo. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 8 hours ago, CWood21 said: Nothing moves you. You're still going down with the Josh Dobbs boat. And Mariota's season pales in comparison to Herbert's. I'm not sure there's any statistic that Herbert doesn't blow Mariota out of the water from their rookie year. That's nothing. Mission is trying to tell me Matt Barkley is greatness personified. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ifeelasleep Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 out of vans list only herbert popped on screen for me, all the rest are up in the air, dobbins is a hit but RBs can have a couple of seasons and they crater, its still a hit but remember cadillac williams? the receivers look pretty decent, but only jefferson looks an all pro type, i agree they should only be selected in the top half of the first round if theyre complete freaks in measurements and production. the best route runners in the league are Adams, Keenan allen, Diggs and for the longest time AB, none of them even sniffed the first round. Adams went in the second but he was the 9th receiver taken, why? route running is hard to scout/project because of the opposition and because its a skill that gets polished with experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jebrick Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Dobb's future will be a OC if he wants to go that route. He is the one person Ben listens to on the bench when analyzing what is happening. His inaccuracy has been his killer. His ceiling at this point is Jacoby Brissett and he is still looking up at that. Stick Dobb's brain in Haskins's body and it would make a really good QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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