Left Tackle or Simmons?

[Acgott]

OT isn’t a bad pick as we need it, it’s just not the right pick. It’s not the best use of assets.

[ny92mike]

Opinions talked up like facts...split between what the team needs with their first overall pick.  So hypothetical, let's say the team does target Simmons with the 4th overall pick.  What position do you see him playing?  I ask because if defense must be the pick from some of you, would not getting an edge linebacker not be our biggest need on defense?  From what I hear, Simmons is a slot CB, inside linebacker and a safety, none of which are game changing positions imo.   

Personally, not addressing the offensive line for another year would be a huge mistake and anything less would be the wrong move, but when has this GM made the right move?  Hoping after this year, the front office realizes the mistake they've made and finally fires him, which should of happened last year after those ridiculous trades or even before that when he thought switching to a 34 defense was a good idea.  Yet here we are, still rebuilding the roster after he so blindly hit the nuke button....idiot.

 

 

 

[Cuziam71]

What has killed the giants every single year.  Tight ends and running backs out of the backfield. Speed also kills the giants. What if we draft a player that can cover those positions. Obviously not at the Same time but Simmons handles that.  Talking about these top 4 tackles they aren't worth the 4th pick none of them are beating out Solder. We need impact starters Simmons is 1 of them. Goal in this draft would be Simmons and Ruiz.  We get those 2 that would be 1 hella draft. 2 impact starters 2 possible leaders on defense and oline for the future.  

[Tetsujin]

Simmons is the unicorn. Take him.

[minutemancl]

24 minutes ago, Tetsujin said:

Simmons is the unicorn. Take him.

Is he though?

We say that a lot, and it makes sense to an extent, but I don't think it is true. He played at a high level in just about every facet of the game, and he's obviously better than all the other LBs in this class, but he isn't as unique as some people make him out to be. Players like him are only going to be more common coming out of college in the near future; we are seeing it already in this draft. The guys aren't as good as him, but they have similar skillsets. Simmons isn't a unicorn, he's more of a prototype for modern NFL linebackers.

I've become more tentative on Simmons recently, as I realize I've been burned by guys like him before. Haason Reddick was the big one. More likely though is that Simmons is more Urlacher than Reddick.

[Tetsujin]

32 minutes ago, minutemancl said:

Is he though?

We say that a lot, and it makes sense to an extent, but I don't think it is true. He played at a high level in just about every facet of the game, and he's obviously better than all the other LBs in this class, but he isn't as unique as some people make him out to be. Players like him are only going to be more common coming out of college in the near future; we are seeing it already in this draft. The guys aren't as good as him, but they have similar skillsets. Simmons isn't a unicorn, he's more of a prototype for modern NFL linebackers.

I've become more tentative on Simmons recently, as I realize I've been burned by guys like him before. Haason Reddick was the big one. More likely though is that Simmons is more Urlacher than Reddick.

Size, speed, athletic ability. He's what you call a "trump piece". Plus there was this one defended pass he had vs GT, it seemed like he ran with whomever 30+ yards downfield and made a leaping play on the ball. That was amazing, but I'm having a hard time finding the video.

He'd be very versatile in base packages, but he could be the best nickle/dime package LB in the league, too.

[Tetsujin]

If Tua was gone, I'd pick him @ 5.

[Go_Giants]

8 hours ago, Cuziam71 said:

What has killed the giants every single year.  Tight ends and running backs out of the backfield. Speed also kills the giants. What if we draft a player that can cover those positions. Obviously not at the Same time but Simmons handles that.  Talking about these top 4 tackles they aren't worth the 4th pick none of them are beating out Solder. We need impact starters Simmons is 1 of them. Goal in this draft would be Simmons and Ruiz.  We get those 2 that would be 1 hella draft. 2 impact starters 2 possible leaders on defense and oline for the future.  

 

What has also killed the Giants every single year is lacking the ability to convert on 3rd and short, settling for field goals instead of running it in for touchdowns and not being able to execute a four minute offense to run out the clock. If we draft a starting tackling and a starting center we can do all of that.

I hope we draft Simmons, that would mean Gettleman feels he can get a starting Tackle in the 2nd round.

However Gettleman job is on the line here. Drafting a Tackle in the 1st round and getting a starting center gives us the best chance for getting more wins right now. 

 

[Acgott]

10 hours ago, ny92mike said:

Opinions talked up like facts...split between what the team needs with their first overall pick.  So hypothetical, let's say the team does target Simmons with the 4th overall pick.  What position do you see him playing?  I ask because if defense must be the pick from some of you, would not getting an edge linebacker not be our biggest need on defense?  From what I hear, Simmons is a slot CB, inside linebacker and a safety, none of which are game changing positions imo.   

Personally, not addressing the offensive line for another year would be a huge mistake and anything less would be the wrong move, but when has this GM made the right move?  Hoping after this year, the front office realizes the mistake they've made and finally fires him, which should of happened last year after those ridiculous trades or even before that when he thought switching to a 34 defense was a good idea.  Yet here we are, still rebuilding the roster after he so blindly hit the nuke button....idiot.

 

 

 

If Young is available, he is the pick, as he’s BPA, and that would solve all of our fighting. Simmons is ranked higher on big boards than the OL. If there isn’t a majority consensus among them, how can we pick him at #4. Clearly there are other players that are better ranked.

Simmons will play, OLB, ILB, and S, depending on what defensive formation we are in

[GMENNATION]

18 hours ago, YogiBiz said:

As our roster is currently constructed the LT would have a bigger impact. We have spent a ton of capital in acquiring our franchise cornerstones in the backfield, it would would behoove us give as much support to them. 

We aren't competing next year. Even with Simmons, we wouldn't have an elite defense. We'd be average to borderline good at best. We are still missing too many pieces on that side.

I totally agree that we do need to protect our QB and RB, I get that. For arguments sake, putting Simmons on our current defense probably adds 6+ sacks on our defense and many coming from OTHER players. Simmons himself is probably only a 6-7 sack per season guy but he is the guy offenses have to account for. All of a sudden teams can't double Tomlinson, Williams or Lawrence. And we can disguise our defense based on the gameplan way better than we've been able to. Whether Simmons rushes or covers, if he's around the LOS he is going to be their priority. 

There are far more good OTs in the NFL than there are true game wreckers on defense. We have not had one of those since who, JPP? 

[YogiBiz]

4 minutes ago, GMENNATION said:

I totally agree that we do need to protect our QB and RB, I get that. For arguments sake, putting Simmons on our current defense probably adds 6+ sacks on our defense and many coming from OTHER players. Simmons himself is probably only a 6-7 sack per season guy but he is the guy offenses have to account for. All of a sudden teams can't double Tomlinson, Williams or Lawrence. And we can disguise our defense based on the gameplan way better than we've been able to. Whether Simmons rushes or covers, if he's around the LOS he is going to be their priority. 

There are far more good OTs in the NFL than there are true game wreckers on defense. We have not had one of those since who, JPP? 

Using Simmons as OLB in our defense is a waste of all of his other talents. Simmons is not a pass rusher. He is a good and instinctual blitzer, but expecting 6-7 sacks as a primary pass rusher. If we take Simmons he would likely end up playing in the middle. 

[Acgott]

Our primary defense will be the nickel formation. Simmons will be the primary ILB depending on the exact formation we run.If it’s a heavy run team, we can move him to S for flexibility. If we need him to cover slot TE, we can do that. If we want him to blitz, we can do that. We can have him move over the field to use in in many different ways.

 

 

[minutemancl]

1 hour ago, Acgott said:

Our primary defense will be the nickel formation. Simmons will be the primary ILB depending on the exact formation we run.If it’s a heavy run team, we can move him to S for flexibility. If we need him to cover slot TE, we can do that. If we want him to blitz, we can do that. We can have him move over the field to use in in many different ways.

 

 

I think we could do similar things with a guy like Willie Gay or Troy Dye in a later round. Hell, to be honest, I think we can do the same thing with Lorenzo Carter, and we should have done that with Lorenzo Carter if our DC had any ingenuity the past 2 years.

[Kip Smithers]

People need to stop looking at his versatility as a negative and a positive. Belichick drafts football players and sees the bigger picture. Bill takes It game by game. Point is how we use Simmons will depend on opponent. I don’t think there is a game plan that he won’t thrive and be great in.
 

The one slither of hope I have that the pick can be Simmons is that that Gettleman said, at 4 he’s gonna pick someone who we think will be a hall of famer and his point that this tackle class is very deep. Take that for what it’s worth. 

[Acgott]

44 minutes ago, minutemancl said:

I think we could do similar things with a guy like Willie Gay or Troy Dye in a later round. Hell, to be honest, I think we can do the same thing with Lorenzo Carter, and we should have done that with Lorenzo Carter if our DC had any ingenuity the past 2 years.

I don’t study tape anymore so I have no idea about any of the players including Simmons. I can only look at draft boards. The majority of them have Simmons as a top 5 player, while the OL play trading spaces 6-15. When you have a top 5 pick,  you need to look at the players in that tier. There is a different tier from 1-5 compared to 6-15.