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Niners traded up for Brandon Aiyuk at 25 WR


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6 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

On the topic of Shanahan evaluating WRs, remember last year his #1 target was supposedly N'keal Harry. And it is too early to say what he will become, but he wasn't good in his rookie season. Aiyuk to me is clearly the better prospect, but I don't think we can yet say his evaluations on WR have proven to be good yet.

 

I disagree. I like Harry. Still do. I don't think Aiyuk is better at anything Harry does except maybe RAC. 

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4 hours ago, 757-NINER said:

Yea I dont see it either. He basically ran 3 routes and a bunch of WR screens.

He ran a zig like twice and a few nice double moves! Hey that, slants, screens, digs, and outs are all we do pretty much. XP

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1 minute ago, 757-NINER said:

I disagree. I like Harry. Still do. I don't think Aiyuk is better at anything Harry does except maybe RAC. 

oh, I didn't like Harry at all last year. Did not think he would have an easy time separating at the next level at all. Higher on Aiyuk, though I find him to have his own warts, obviously. 

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Just now, 757-NINER said:

I disagree. I like Harry. Still do. I don't think Aiyuk is better at anything Harry does except maybe RAC. 

I also like Harry. He definitely had a rough rookie year, but his injuries certainly didn’t do him any favors.

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1 minute ago, 757-NINER said:

I disagree. I like Harry. Still do. I don't think Aiyuk is better at anything Harry does except maybe RAC. 

Aiyuk is more athletic, explosive and flat out on another level with the ball in his hands. What does Harry do better? Make contested catches? Harry lacked separation in college and the same happened last year in the NFL. 

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3 minutes ago, JIllg said:

He ran a zig like twice and a few nice double moves! Hey that, slants, screens, digs, and outs are all we do pretty much. XP

The thing that bugs me is that I don't see the speed and explosion that everyone else sees. I don't see him being explosive out of breaks. I don't see him being a burner or particularly fast, though I think his speed is somewhat deceiving when watching (IE, I think he's faster than it appears, and I'm aware of that, but still don't think he looks fast lol). His double moves are weirdly effective despite the fact that half the time I feel like they are half hearted and the other half feeling like they are sloppy lol. But he's clearly got explosive traits and decent speed...it just doesn' tlook like it to me. So very weird. 

But I think he does a few of the basic concept routes just fine, and I think even at the next level will have success at beating off man (which is why I like him in the slot). Also, he's great with the ball in his hands, and for Shanny, I trust that he will figure out how to utilize that. 

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2 minutes ago, Forge said:

The thing that bugs me is that I don't see the speed and explosion that everyone else sees. I don't see him being explosive out of breaks. I don't see him being a burner or particularly fast, though I think his speed is somewhat deceiving when watching (IE, I think he's faster than it appears, and I'm aware of that, but still don't think he looks fast lol). His double moves are weirdly effective despite the fact that half the time I feel like they are half hearted and the other half feeling like they are sloppy lol. But he's clearly got explosive traits and decent speed...it just doesn' tlook like it to me. So very weird. 

But I think he does a few of the basic concept routes just fine, and I think even at the next level will have success at beating off man (which is why I like him in the slot). Also, he's great with the ball in his hands, and for Shanny, I trust that he will figure out how to utilize that. 

I can kind of see that take. Deebo had that thing where he was blowing away people on slants while not looking like he had top end speed, too. All I know is that both were at the very top on YPC and YPRR on slant routes. Slant routes are about half of what we do, lol.

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2 minutes ago, JIllg said:

I can kind of see that take. Deebo had that thing where he was blowing away people on slants while not looking like he had top end speed, too. All I know is that both were at the very top on YPC and YPRR on slant routes. Slant routes are about half of what we do, lol.

For sure. Someone brought it up in the draft forum that we are going to do our best hiding Jimmy behind RAC guys...which honestly is not completely wrong lol. Our offense is seriously designed for just about any quarterback to take advantage of. They just have to be somewhat accurate on the intermediate routes. thats it. Derek Carr could potentially destroy the league with our scheme lol. 

And don't get me wrong, I have absolutely no problem with Aiyuk in this spot. A couple of months ago, @J-ALL-DAY asked which wide receivers would go in the first round, and Aiyuk was one of them for me. And it was clear that Shanny was going to love him. He's going to fit into the offense well. I kind of wanted a little more versatility because I worry about him on the boundary, though Shanny can mask that some with motion, but oh yeah, he also has return experience, which is nice. 

Also, if we thought the presnap motion was insane before, it really should be even crazier now because Aiyuk should probably get just as many runs as Deebo lol. We should be having a field day just moving everyone around before the snap so that we can seriously just hand the ball off to anyone at any time going in any direction

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4 hours ago, 757-NINER said:

He's been hurt...there's a difference. Injuries will stifle a rookie more than anything. Look at Kittle's rookie year. Then jump to his second year after he had a whole off-season to absorb the playbook, while working on his body so he could make through a greuling NFL season. I think that's all Harry really needs.

And that McDainels offense is a sight-adjustment offense. It takes some WRs time to get acclimated to adjusting routes on the fly....especially a rookie. I think if Harry ended up here and didn't get hurt, he would have been a very productive rookie.

We'll see. Apparently a big issue for him was not getting separation. 

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23 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Aiyuk is more athletic, explosive and flat out on another level with the ball in his hands. What does Harry do better? Make contested catches? Harry lacked separation in college and the same happened last year in the NFL. 

Im going to re-post myself here....

Harry's was hurt his rookie year and missed some time. Injuries will stifle a rookie more than anything. Look at Kittle's rookie year. Then jump to his second year after he had a whole off-season to absorb the playbook, while working on his body so he could make through a greuling NFL season. I think that's all Harry really needs.

And that McDainels offense is a sight-adjustment offense. It takes some WRs time to get acclimated to adjusting routes on the fly....especially a rookie. I think if Harry ended up here and didn't get hurt, he would have been a very productive rookie.

How is Aiyuk more explosive?? Looking at their raw athletic numbers, they're pretty similar, with Harry being over 20 pounds heavier...

Aiyuk

40 = 4.5

vert = 40

broad = 128 in

Harry

40 = 4.53

vert = 38.5

broad = 122 in

Harry is a better route runner and is better against press man. He's better high-pointing the ball and has better body control. For as long as Aiyuk's arms are, he should be much better at contested catch situations. He's a RAC machine and that's it. Nothing else about his game stands out to me. He looks he'll only thrive in the slot at the next level. I understand alot of ppl like him and that's fine. I don't. I don't see all these explosive traits ppl are clamoring about. I see a guy who takes advantage of his RAC opportunities but I don't see anything that jumps out at me that screams he's going to be a beast at the next level. 

Let me ask you this...as a prospect, who was better?? Aiyuk or Samuels?

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, 757-NINER said:

Im going to re-post myself here....

Harry's was hurt his rookie year and missed some time. Injuries will stifle a rookie more than anything. Look at Kittle's rookie year. Then jump to his second year after he had a whole off-season to absorb the playbook, while working on his body so he could make through a greuling NFL season. I think that's all Harry really needs.

And that McDainels offense is a sight-adjustment offense. It takes some WRs time to get acclimated to adjusting routes on the fly....especially a rookie. I think if Harry ended up here and didn't get hurt, he would have been a very productive rookie.

How is Aiyuk more explosive?? Looking at their raw athletic numbers, they're pretty similar, with Harry being over 20 pounds heavier...

Aiyuk

40 = 4.5

vert = 40

broad = 128 in

Harry

40 = 4.53

vert = 38.5

broad = 122 in

Harry is a better route runner and is better against press man. He's better high-pointing the ball and has better body control. For as long as Aiyuk's arms are, he should be much better at contested catch situations. He's a RAC machine and that's it. Nothing else about his game stands out to me. He looks he'll only thrive in the slot at the next level. I understand alot of ppl like him and that's fine. I don't. I don't see all these explosive traits ppl are clamoring about. I see a guy who takes advantage of his RAC opportunities but I don't see anything that jumps out at me that screams he's going to be a beast at the next level. 

Let me ask you this...as a prospect, who was better?? Aiyuk or Samuels?

Deebo was more refined as a route runner, but they are similar prospects. Deebo>Aiyuk for me though.

Okay, so as far as Harry being better at high pointing? He also HAD to high point a bunch of balls as he lacked separation. You could post their numbers, but Aiyuk is clearly the more explosive athlete. And being a RAC monster is what our offense is all about so that counts a lot. 

We shall see what Harry becomes. But he will need a QB that will trust him on a bunch of 50/50 balls. 

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20 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

On the topic of Shanahan evaluating WRs, remember last year his #1 target was supposedly N'keal Harry. And it is too early to say what he will become, but he wasn't good in his rookie season. Aiyuk to me is clearly the better prospect, but I don't think we can yet say his evaluations on WR have proven to be good yet.

 

Well remember last yr Shanny was looking for big physical wr(Deebo/Hurd). Now this time we were looking for speed guy.

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6 minutes ago, Forge said:

For sure. Someone brought it up in the draft forum that we are going to do our best hiding Jimmy behind RAC guys...which honestly is not completely wrong lol. Our offense is seriously designed for just about any quarterback to take advantage of. They just have to be somewhat accurate on the intermediate routes. thats it. Derek Carr could potentially destroy the league with our scheme lol. 

And don't get me wrong, I have absolutely no problem with Aiyuk in this spot. A couple of months ago, @J-ALL-DAY asked which wide receivers would go in the first round, and Aiyuk was one of them for me. And it was clear that Shanny was going to love him. He's going to fit into the offense well. I kind of wanted a little more versatility because I worry about him on the boundary, though Shanny can mask that some with motion, but oh yeah, he also has return experience, which is nice. 

Also, if we thought the presnap motion was insane before, it really should be even crazier now because Aiyuk should probably get just as many runs as Deebo lol. We should be having a field day just moving everyone around before the snap so that we can seriously just hand the ball off to anyone at any time going in any direction

It's strange to me that you don't see Aiyuk's speed on film; I certainly do. In fact, I just presumed he was one of the fastest dudes in the draft after seeing him on film, and was shocked to find he had run a 4.5, whereas I was nonplussed to hear the same about CeeDee Lamb. Are you seriously saying that Aiyuk looks the same speed as Lamb to you on tape? To me, he looks considerably faster.

Also, look how open Aiyuk is on basically all of his downfield catches. The QB play was not good, but the separation Aiyuk created over the top was real.

And yes, Aiyuk opposite Deebo allows Shanny to play "ambidextrous" with respect to RAC plays to the wideouts. In some beautiful future world, the same may be true of Hurd opposite Kittle...a boy can dream.

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Just now, Ronnie's Pinky said:

It's strange to me that you don't see Aiyuk's speed on film; I certainly do. In fact, I just presumed he was one of the fastest dudes in the draft after seeing him on film, and was shocked to find he had run a 4.5, whereas I was nonplussed to hear the same about CeeDee Lamb. Are you seriously saying that Aiyuk looks the same speed as Lamb to you on tape? To me, he looks considerably faster.

Also, look how open Aiyuk is on basically all of his downfield catches. The QB play was not good, but the separation Aiyuk created over the top was real.

And yes, Aiyuk opposite Deebo allows Shanny to play "ambidextrous" with respect to RAC plays to the wideouts. In some beautiful future world, the same may be true of Hurd opposite Kittle...a boy can dream.

Its a sneaky speed, I will give him that. I think it's like that of Mostert. Like, Mostert's a freaking track guy, but nobody ever views him that way (that's why you always get defenders who look like they take the worst angle ever). It's probably one of the reasons that he rips through and shreds off coverage.

He doesn't look that fast to me, but admittedly, he is able to keep his space from defenders once he gets behind them. I like him just fine as a prospect though. I don't think he is a burner in the traditional sense, but I think he is certainly fast enough. 

My only real problem with this was the trade up. I wouldn't have made that move. But had we stayed at 31 and taken Aiyuk, I wouldn't have had a single problem with the selection outside of a nominal issue with fit in regards to where he plays. I will let Shanny work through that though. If we had another coach, I'd probably be more concerned about it. 

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13 minutes ago, Forge said:

Its a sneaky speed, I will give him that. I think it's like that of Mostert. Like, Mostert's a freaking track guy, but nobody ever views him that way (that's why you always get defenders who look like they take the worst angle ever). It's probably one of the reasons that he rips through and shreds off coverage.

An excellent comparison, considering Aiyuk is a former running back. Yes, Aiyuk looks a lot like Mostert with the ball in his hands, and there's no denying the separation over the top is there on film. Also, nobody catches him from behind. Conclusion: the dude is probably really fast, whatever his official timed speed.

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