NYRaider Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 3 hours ago, Humble_Beast said: 1) Jaylen Twyman DT- really like this prospect for his interior pass rush I like Twyman but he's pretty similar to Hurst as an undersized pass rushing 3T. I think we need a three down DT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimkelly02 Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 4 hours ago, NYRaider said: I like Twyman but he's pretty similar to Hurst as an undersized pass rushing 3T. I think we need a three down DT. Yeah with all the trouble vs the run we have I want zero to do with a 6’2 (prolly 6’1) 290 DT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bitty 2.0 Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 Every year there's players that rise by there play in the season. With only half of the NCAA playing this year good players are going to fall in the draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 9 hours ago, Bitty 2.0 said: Every year there's players that rise by there play in the season. With only half of the NCAA playing this year good players are going to fall in the draft. All of the major conferences are going to play this year some are just starting later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Trey Lance is this years Jordan Love @BayRaider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 1 minute ago, NYRaider said: Trey Lance is this years Jordan Love @BayRaider I'm not sure if you are insulting him or praising him, but I still think Love is gonna be a Top 10 QB in this league. Lance has even better tools than Love... better arm, much better legs, and even higher football IQ. The issue is we haven't seen him against top competition. Even Love's competition in the MWC was much better than Lance's. Definitely a concern. However, I will gladly gamble on Lance and take a chance. I love everything about him. I'd even take him over Fields straight up. He has at least showed he's a smart football player and can make the throws. 28 TD's and 0 INT's, with a tremendous deep ball, and tremendous mobility with his legs. It's not against good competition, but it's at least a very good sign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Just now, BayRaider said: I'm not sure if you are insulting him or praising him, but I still think Love is gonna be a Top 10 QB in this league. Lance has even better tools than Love... better arm, much better legs, and even higher football IQ. The issue is we haven't seen him against top competition. Even Love's competition in the MWC was much better than Lance's. Definitely a concern. However, I will gladly gamble on Lance and take a chance. I love everything about him. I'd even take him over Fields straight up. He has at least showed he's a smart football player and can make the throws. 28 TD's and 0 INT's, with a tremendous deep ball, and tremendous mobility with his legs. It's not against good competition, but it's at least a very good sign. It's not an insult or a compliment. I just think that they're similar as prospects because they're both guys with elite physical tools that need to clean up a lot before they'll be able to be good starters in the NFL. Lance certainly has better physical tools but I don't know if I would say a higher football IQ. NDSU was by far the most talented team in D1-FCS last year and they were able to scheme so many easy throws for Lance. The one concern I have about Lance is how little he has thrown the ball. Over his last 6 games dating back to last season: 69/121 (57%), 894 yards (7.3 Y/A) - 149 ypg But almost 30% of his passing production came on 6 explosive plays and if you remove those 6 plays his passing production is: 63/115 (54%), 656 yards (5.7 Y/A) - 109 ypg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 1 minute ago, NYRaider said: It's not an insult or a compliment. I just think that they're similar as prospects because they're both guys with elite physical tools that need to clean up a lot before they'll be able to be good starters in the NFL. Lance certainly has better physical tools but I don't know if I would say a higher football IQ. NDSU was by far the most talented team in D1-FCS last year and they were able to scheme so many easy throws for Lance. The one concern I have about Lance is how little he has thrown the ball. Over his last 6 games dating back to last season: 69/121 (57%), 894 yards (7.3 Y/A) - 149 ypg But almost 30% of his passing production came on 6 explosive plays and if you remove those 6 plays his passing production is: 63/115 (54%), 656 yards (5.7 Y/A) - 109 ypg I'm pretty Anti-Redshirt QB and let them play mentality but Jordan Love is a two year on the bench minimum guy which I said all draft season, and Lance is a one year on the bench minimum guy. Both need development. I think Lance could be ready year two depending on what he shows. I also thought Josh Allen should of been sat his rookie year as well, which is probably correct, considering he was absolutely horrendous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humble_Beast Posted October 7, 2020 Author Share Posted October 7, 2020 Jordan Love another valley kid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 1 hour ago, BayRaider said: I'm pretty Anti-Redshirt QB and let them play mentality but Jordan Love is a two year on the bench minimum guy which I said all draft season, and Lance is a one year on the bench minimum guy. Both need development. I think Lance could be ready year two depending on what he shows. I also thought Josh Allen should of been sat his rookie year as well, which is probably correct, considering he was absolutely horrendous. I think Lance needs more time on the bench to develop then Love tbh. Lance has 17 career starts at the D1-FCS level and will have played 1 game in 20 months leading up to the start of the 2021 NFL season. Not to mention Lance only has 2 games in his entire career that he has thrown the ball 30+ times and has only completed 20+ passes once in his career. He's super raw. But like Allen if he does have to play early even if he's not that great as a passer he'll still be able to have an impact using his legs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 3 minutes ago, Humble_Beast said: Jordan Love another valley kid. Most project QBs come out of Northern CA. Lance going against the grain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Just now, NYRaider said: I think Lance needs more time on the bench to develop then Love tbh. Lance has 17 career starts at the D1-FCS level and will have played 1 game in 20 months leading up to the start of the 2021 NFL season. Not to mention Lance only has 2 games in his entire career that he has thrown the ball 30+ times and has only completed 20+ passes once in his career. He's super raw. But like Allen if he does have to play early even if he's not that great as a passer he'll still be able to have an impact using his legs. I respect that opinion but my personal thoughts watching both play is Love needs two and Lance needs one. Level of competition isn't the only factor. Lance looks a bit more polished than Love on tape to me with an easier transition to the NFL with his overall skillset. Plus Lance's legs can bail him out of a rookie mistakes on a consistent basis. Love's not a dual-threat like Lance, Jackson, Mahomes, Wilson, Murray, etc. He's mobile and good at escaping, but he's not a dual weapon that you will have to gameplan around. His mobility is like a better version of Aaron Rodgers and Derek Carr and worse version of Russell Wilson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 1 minute ago, BayRaider said: I respect that opinion but my personal thoughts watching both play is Love needs two and Lance needs one. Level of competition isn't the only factor. Lance looks a bit more polished than Love on tape to me with an easier transition to the NFL with his overall skillset. Plus Lance's legs can bail him out of a rookie mistakes on a consistent basis. Love's not a dual-threat like Lance, Jackson, Mahomes, Wilson, Murray, etc. He's mobile and good at escaping, but he's not a dual weapon that you will have to gameplan around. His mobility is like a better version of Aaron Rodgers and Derek Carr and worse version of Russell Wilson. I wouldn't say Lance looks more polished then Love coming out of college. I just watched his last three games, the two post season games last year and his game against Central Arkansas last week. And like 80% of his passes were check downs, screens, or to wide open receivers. NDSU did an excellent job of scheming guys open and their system was built for him to make one read/throw or take off scrambling. I didn't see him make any throws where he goes progressions like he'll need too in the NFL. His ball placement and accuracy were all over the place in all three games as well and he missed quite a few easy throws. And over the course of those 3 games I only saw 2 throws that made me go "wow" that's a dime, high level NFL throw. Vs Montana State The throw at 1:04 is nice but he stares down his first option and never goes through any of his reads. The throw at 3:00 is why people are so excited about him as he extends the play and is able to throw a 35 yard dime on the move. But his WR was also wide open. In this game he completed 15 passes for 223 yards but if you take away the 75 & 73 yarders, he completed 13 passes for 75 yards the rest of the game. vs James Madison The throw at 3:20 he has a guy wide open in the end zone but has bad placement on the throw and he has to fall to adjust and catch it. That's an easy throw he has to make. The throw at 4:15 he has a guy open but again has bad placement on the throw and it gets there at his feet. The throw at 5:25 was a terrible decision and should've been picked. Overall in this game he doesn't make any throws that make you go "wow" and almost all of his production came on wide open throws or screens. vs Central Arkansas At the 0:12 mark he has a receiver wide open for a TD but over throws him. The throw at 0:30 is an NFL throw and dime by Lance. Bad placement on an easy screen pass at 0:40. Bad placement on an easy comeback route at 1:16. Bad placement on an easy throw to the flat at 1:35. Throws his first TD at 1:44 but there isn't a defender within 5 yards of his target. At 2:10 he has a wide open receiver with a chance to score and over throws him. At 2:40 he throws a bomb into double coverage that should've been picked. At 3:04 he has a completable pass but throws it behind his WR allowing the DB to make a play on the ball. At 4:09 he makes a bad read and throws it into tight coverage resulting in an INT. At 6:30 he throws his second TD but there's not a defender within 5 yards of his target. On this throw he could've easily led his receiver into the end zone but the throw is a little behind him so he has to slow down and adjust to the ball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 In Lances last 3 games if you take away his only two explosive plays his passing numbers are: 34/59 (57%), 296 yards (5.0 Y/A), 296 yards (99 ypg) And that's against non D1 competition... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 (edited) Just watched his tape against Western Illinois which statistically was his best game and the only game in his collegiate career that he threw for 300+ yards. He was 17/22 for 313 yards and 2 TD but the numbers don't paint an accurate picture. Chart for his completions in the game • Throw to the flat: 10 • Screens: 2 • Comebacks: 2 • Throws to wide open WR: 2 • High level bomb down the sideline: 1 For the game his average depth of target was 7.8 yards down field and if you remove the one 40 yard pass it falls to 5.8. In addition to the 40 yard pass he only had 3 other passes 10+ yards down the field: a 10 yard comeback, a 17 yard throw over the middle of the field to a wide open receiver after he sat in the pocket for 8 seconds, and a 20 yard pass over the middle of the field to a wide open receiver that then got 66 yards after the catch to score. His numbers were inflated because on his two TD's his receivers picked up a ton of YAC. And on the day 13/17 of his completions were 5 yards or less down the field. And he really only made one throw the entire game that was an NFL throw into a tight window. Other than that literally all of his other completions were check downs or to wide open players. For someone that hates on Carr for how much he utilizes the short passing game, I don't really see how you can love Lance based on what I've seen from him. Edited October 7, 2020 by NYRaider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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