2021 Draft Thread

[Bobby816]

54 minutes ago, xenajets said:

JD could be lying. He could be manipulating things to garner a bigger trade demand for Sam or the #2 pick and also at the same time leaving Houston without their preferred trade partner which could mean a lower asking price for Deshaun. 

Very well could be true. I just think he has to by March 15th have a for sure plan to pitch FAs. He cant sit WRs, OLineman, TEs, RBs down and say... well we aren't too sure yet who we will be having at QB this year and going forward. Players generally aren't going to sign without knowing this major thing.

 

So either it's a bunch of BS that he's waiting until the pro days to make a decision (which very well could be true). Or he already knows what he's going to do. He just wants to gage interest from all angles as you said.

 

I think what should also be noted is that these rookie QBs I think have to blow JD away for him to move on from Darnold. Its not as black and white as Wilson/Fields > Darnold. It involves what else can be done on the roster if we don't draft a QB as well. And my thinking to that is this. That he knows what having that 2nd pick can do to rebuild this roster for Darnold. Trade back a few spots acquire even more valuable picks and get difference makers on offense for us to work with. I'll use ATL as an example. We trade back with them to 4 and acquire 35 and 68 as well (exactly even on a trade chart). So now we'd hold these picks 4, 23, 34, 35, 66, 68, 86, 97 in the top 100. That's 8 picks in the top 100. That's incredible. And more importantly its 4 picks in the top 35. And that's where we can get real difference makers. It also gives us the ammo to move up for a guy we love that's slipping.

 

Fact is no matter how much you like or don't like Darnold... that keeping him makes the roster as a whole better. Bc of the flexibility with the 2nd pick. There's no way that if we roll with Sam we aren't getting offers for that pick. And lets be real... even of we don't get what we'd like and stay at the pick. Adding a guy like Smith as a weapon for Darnold is huge. But I do think we no doubt trade back with it if we do roll with Sam. 

[doumeyer]

Our big problem, right now is the NFL draft not starting till late April, Rodger Goodell, even said he wants the NFL to be be a 12 month event  Right now there is not a dam thing Douglas can do but wait this whole thing out. FA's have no idea what we are going to do in the draft, so all they have to go with is our 2020 roster and our record, and that could spell disaster for us in the free agent market. For us having the FAs' period before the draft is like putting the cart before the horse. If we had chance to draft TL this would be a whole different story, but we ****** that up.

Edited February 23, 2021 by doumeyer

[Jag68Sid87]

On 2/22/2021 at 9:56 AM, Bobby816 said:

Fields has 24 games of great film. Where he more or less has looked great for all of it. A career stat line of 67 TDs to 9 INTs. While also rushing for 1,100yds and 19 TDs. He's pretty much from a college career and how safe you should feel about drafting him just a tiny tier below TLaw in that regard. 

So why is he closer to Wilson, Jones and Lance than he is to Lawrence?

THAT is what scares me. 

What I do like about him is that he is not the prototype (i.e. Sam Darnold).

[Jag68Sid87]

2 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Fact is no matter how much you like or don't like Darnold... that keeping him makes the roster as a whole better. Bc of the flexibility with the 2nd pick. There's no way that if we roll with Sam we aren't getting offers for that pick. And lets be real... even of we don't get what we'd like and stay at the pick. Adding a guy like Smith as a weapon for Darnold is huge. But I do think we no doubt trade back with it if we do roll with Sam. 

How can the roster as a whole be better when the guy throwing the ball sucks? Come on, Bobby.

Out of all of our options, building around Darnold is easily the worst option. And I would like to think that our new regime is not only smarter than that, but also has more balls than that.

 

[KimuraGod]

2 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Very well could be true. I just think he has to by March 15th have a for sure plan to pitch FAs. He cant sit WRs, OLineman, TEs, RBs down and say... well we aren't too sure yet who we will be having at QB this year and going forward. Players generally aren't going to sign without knowing this major thing.

 

So either it's a bunch of BS that he's waiting until the pro days to make a decision (which very well could be true). Or he already knows what he's going to do. He just wants to gage interest from all angles as you said.

 

I think what should also be noted is that these rookie QBs I think have to blow JD away for him to move on from Darnold. Its not as black and white as Wilson/Fields > Darnold. It involves what else can be done on the roster if we don't draft a QB as well. And my thinking to that is this. That he knows what having that 2nd pick can do to rebuild this roster for Darnold. Trade back a few spots acquire even more valuable picks and get difference makers on offense for us to work with. I'll use ATL as an example. We trade back with them to 4 and acquire 35 and 68 as well (exactly even on a trade chart). So now we'd hold these picks 4, 23, 34, 35, 66, 68, 86, 97 in the top 100. That's 8 picks in the top 100. That's incredible. And more importantly its 4 picks in the top 35. And that's where we can get real difference makers. It also gives us the ammo to move up for a guy we love that's slipping.

 

Fact is no matter how much you like or don't like Darnold... that keeping him makes the roster as a whole better. Bc of the flexibility with the 2nd pick. There's no way that if we roll with Sam we aren't getting offers for that pick. And lets be real... even of we don't get what we'd like and stay at the pick. Adding a guy like Smith as a weapon for Darnold is huge. But I do think we no doubt trade back with it if we do roll with Sam. 

I think any report that comes out right now has to be taken with a pinch of salt. How many times have we been ‘in’ and then ‘out’ the Deshaun race. At the minute we are in the race but by next week we will no doubt be off the list. It’s just very much a guessing game at this stage. 
 

I really think it would be ridiculous to think JD hasn’t already got his strategy ready to go for the qb position. He will have contingency’s and different scenarios but I have belief he and the coaching staff will have a good reading on what they want to accomplish. The pro day stuff seems unrealistic as like you pointed out the dates don’t mesh very well with the FA’s etc. 
 

I still think the best course of action is to draft our new qb at #2 and use our resources to make his job as easy as possible. Multiple weapons added (FA & draft) and two new starters in the o-line. This should be a guarantee and not penny pinching like we’ve done in the past.
 

I’m shocked people on here still think we don’t need that much on offense and somehow think adding a rookie qb (or rolling with Sam) that we can’t allocate lots of resources in helping them out. Like how many times have we been burnt and yet people still don’t get it. 
 

We have an amazing chance to turn this ship around if we do it the right way. Recently in the general forum I showed the difference Baltimore, Cleveland and Buffalo had done compared to us in surrounding their qbs from the 2018 draft class. All three teams did things in FA, the draft and through trades to make their qbs have an excellent chance to succeed. 
 

We let our #1 reciever walk, didn’t really bring in any weapons and other than Becton and McGovern didn’t improve the o-line. 

[Jag68Sid87]

Yes, but at some point the quarterback needs to help the team reach newer heights too. After all, he is the quarterback. He is the main weapon on any football team. The main decision maker. The main leader. As he goes, the team goes 95% of the time, if not 99%.

To suggest Buffalo and Baltimore (in particular) did not make massive strides quickly because of the play of their starting quarterback is foolhardy in my opinion.

The reason why Lamar Jackson became an NFL MVP and Sam Darnold did not is because Lamar Jackson was always the better quarterback than Sam Darnold. But the stupid reputations that preceded these two individuals blinded most people from seeing the truth.

That is the sad reality.

[xrade]

4 minutes ago, xenajets said:

I’m shocked people on here still think we don’t need that much on offense and somehow think adding a rookie qb (or rolling with Sam) that we can’t allocate lots of resources in helping them out. Like how many times have we been burnt and yet people still don’t get it

Who on this site said we don’t need O this year?  I have yet to see a post that said they would want to go D heavy.

As for getting burnt, it is exactly because Mac ignored the O that I do not want JD to ignore the D like “others” seem to want.

Adding starter resources to help our QB is needed. Adding backups and future starters at the expense of starting D is bad. Period. That is all I have said. 

[xrade]

20 minutes ago, xenajets said:

We let our #1 reciever walk, didn’t really bring in any weapons and other than Becton and McGovern didn’t improve the o-line. 

JD admitted to that error. And let’s not make it out like Robby was a great receiver. He was good and he was only a number 1 on the Jets. Many of us thought Perriman could fill his role. What was your take at the time?  What about Fant. He did OK at RT. What about the fact that we lost out on Thuney at the 11th hour and had to settle for GVR because there was not much left. Did you really think Herndon was going to be a non factor again?  I thought he would be more involved. Did you count on Doctson sitting out?  You obviously forgot we drafted Mims in round 2 after drafting  Becton in round 1. I am pretty certain most of counted on Bell contributing.

So no, the O was not ignored last year. Becton and McGovern were not the only “weapons” JD brought in. 

[Bobby816]

51 minutes ago, Jag68Sid87 said:

So why is he closer to Wilson, Jones and Lance than he is to Lawrence?

THAT is what scares me. 

What I do like about him is that he is not the prototype (i.e. Sam Darnold).

It's about being proven and succeeding wherever you play, I'm talking about. Fields has looked good at a top school, playing top competition and playing his best sometimes against very good competition. This goes for TLaw as well.

This can not be said for Wilson and Lance.

[Bobby816]

50 minutes ago, Jag68Sid87 said:

How can the roster as a whole be better when the guy throwing the ball sucks? Come on, Bobby.

Out of all of our options, building around Darnold is easily the worst option. And I would like to think that our new regime is not only smarter than that, but also has more balls than that.

 

I explained that.

We use the 2nd pick on Wilson lets say. Could that 2nd pick not been used to help the roster besides QB more? Could that pick not be traded back (very likely lets keep in mind). And acquire still a top 5 or so pick and an additional 2nd and 3rd to help this roster? Its a 100% fact that what can be built as the roster as a whole is better with sticking with Darnold. For those exact reasons I mentioned.

You want to debate Wilson > Darnold. But its not that simple. Its what can be done if we stick with Darnold for the 52 other spots that plays into it as well. 

[KimuraGod]

38 minutes ago, xrade said:

Who on this site said we don’t need O this year?  I have yet to see a post that said they would want to go D heavy.

As for getting burnt, it is exactly because Mac ignored the O that I do not want JD to ignore the D like “others” seem to want.

Adding starter resources to help our QB is needed. Adding backups and future starters at the expense of starting D is bad. Period. That is all I have said. 

Well I wouldn’t call people out by name but to be fair you’ve said numerous times how you’d not go heavy on offense. I get that approach I just don’t agree with it.
 

Why would JD ignore the D? We can bring in at least a starting outside cb, two starting pass rushers and a linebacker in free agency and the draft. We can STILL add many improvements to the o-line and weapons. It’s not like we have no cap room and no draft picks. We’ve literally got ******* loads of both. Zero excuse not to go all in on whoever is the qb next year.  

[KimuraGod]

28 minutes ago, xrade said:

JD admitted to that error. And let’s not make it out like Robby was a great receiver. He was good and he was only a number 1 on the Jets. Many of us thought Perriman could fill his role. What was your take at the time?  What about Fant. He did OK at RT. What about the fact that we lost out on Thuney at the 11th hour and had to settle for GVR because there was not much left. Did you really think Herndon was going to be a non factor again?  I thought he would be more involved. Did you count on Doctson sitting out?  You obviously forgot we drafted Mims in round 2 after drafting  Becton in round 1. I am pretty certain most of counted on Bell contributing.

So no, the O was not ignored last year. Becton and McGovern were not the only “weapons” JD brought in. 

Well he posted 95/1100 last year with a Teddy Bridgwater at qb who’s not known for his deep ball. 
 

You can go back and check but I was one of the louder voices on here who said that decision was appalling. Adding in the fact we had so much cap and had a covid hit offseason it was a dreadful decision and JD has admitted as much. We let our #1 receiver go and replaced him with an often injured draft bust. What was your take?! 
 

We again penny pinched no matter what you said and ended up with GVR, Fant and McGovern who were all ‘okay’ signings. Only McGovern is a lock to return due to his contract but there’s a chance Fant and GVR don’t return although I hope we keep Fant. 
 

Does it matter what I think about Herndon. Clearly our HC didn’t think much of him. I like him and hope he bounces back this year but he was dropping balls last year that my 4 year old would catch. 
 

What weapons did we bring in then part from Mims who we view as long term?! 
 

 

[doumeyer]

I have seen all 56 Jets drafts and by far this has become the most complicated draft we ever had. especially since we hold the # 2 pick in the draft. After reading all the posts made by many people on this board, I can't argue with any of them, they all had strong points. I just feel that every day that goes by that # 2 pick gets more valuable, before we make any decisions what to do with the pick, we should really find what the real value of that pick is. I could be wrong but I think that is what Douglas is doing. 

[xrade]

2 hours ago, xenajets said:

What was your take?! 

I wanted to keep Robby, but I also thought Perriman would be better than what he was. Much of the blame could probably be laid on gase and Sam for his poor play. I still think he could be a useful #4 but not after his comments about Sam. 

 

2 hours ago, xenajets said:

Well he posted 95/1100 last year with a Teddy Bridgwater at qb who’s not known for his deep ball.

As a number 2. And do you honestly believe  he would have been as good under gase and Sam?  You can’t compare apples to oranges.

 

2 hours ago, xenajets said:

Does it matter what I think about Herndon. Clearly our HC didn’t think much of him. I like him and hope he bounces back this year but he was dropping balls last year that my 4 year old would catch. 

But did you believe he would do better?  I did and I am sure JD did.

Maybe he will this year with a coach that actually uses the TE position. But getting one of the good, young FA TE’s should not cost a lot and they will probably be better then Pat as a 2nd round pick.

2 hours ago, xenajets said:

What weapons did we bring in then part from Mims who we view as long term?! 

Funny I must have missed Mims when you stated the only weapons we brought in were McGovern and Becton. The point is you downplayed what JD did to help the O and are critical of that in hindsight. Could he have done more? Sure. But look at it when the decisions were made last year and not now. JD also probably knew gase would suck no matter what we did. He also probably knew the cap implications for this year and the fact that now is the time spend more.  He wanted Thuney or did you forget that?  It was not his fault the Pats tagged Thuney. So now we get him this year. 

 

2 hours ago, xenajets said:

Well I wouldn’t call people out by name but to be fair you’ve said numerous times how you’d not go heavy on offense. I get that approach I just don’t agree with it.

You can call me out. I like directness. I believe there is a difference between going heavy and going smart. Fill as many holes through FA and the draft before getting future backups. We are not in position to behave like Pitt and draft a WR every year at the expense of another hole. Not yet, anyway.

You don’t have to agree. This site would be boring if everyone did, but I will point out when people twist the what the general feeling is here. No one said not to provide needed weapon for whoever is QB as you stated. Many of us don’t agree with getting a WR in round one if we get a good WR in FA. Some don’t agree with getting a TE in round 2 when we can get a good TE in FA. Same for RB. And thinking the D would be significantly helped with old guys for a rebuilding team is not something I see JD doing. We need younger players with upside on both sides of the ball not just the O. 

Edited February 23, 2021 by xrade

[Bobby816]

1 hour ago, xrade said:

I wanted to keep Robby, but I also thought Perriman would be better than what he was. Much of the blame could probably be laid on gase and Sam for his poor play. I still think he could be a useful #4 but not after his comments about Sam. 

 

As a number 2. And do you honestly believe  he would have been as good under gase and Sam?  You can’t compare apples to oranges.

 

But did you believe he would do better?  I did and I am sure JD did.

Maybe he will this year with a coach that actually uses the TE position. But getting one of the good, young FA TE’s should not cost a lot and they will probably be better then Pat as a 2nd round pick.

Funny I must have missed Mims when you stated the only weapons we brought in were McGovern and Becton. The point is you downplayed what JD did to help the O and are critical of that in hindsight. Could he have done more? Sure. But look at it when the decisions were made last year and not now. JD also probably knew gase would suck no matter what we did. He also probably knew the cap implications for this year and the fact that now is the time spend more.  He wanted Thuney or did you forget that?  It was not his fault the Pats tagged Thuney. So now we get him this year. 

 

You can call me out. I like directness. I believe there is a difference between going heavy and going smart. Fill as many holes through FA and the draft before getting future backups. We are not in position to behave like Pitt and draft a WR every year at the expense of another hole. Not yet, anyway.

You don’t have to agree. This site would be boring if everyone did, but I will point out when people twist the what the general feeling is here. No one said not to provide needed weapon for whoever is QB as you stated. Many of us don’t agree with getting a WR in round one if we get a good WR in FA. Some don’t agree with getting a TE in round 2 when we can get a good TE in FA. Same for RB. And thinking the D would be significantly helped with old guys for a rebuilding team is not something I see JD doing. We need younger players with upside on both sides of the ball not just the O. 

But most thought that Perriman, Mims, Crowder, Herndon, Bell was enough last year.

I got beat up by most this board for saying that wasn't enough.

And what happened. We were incredibly weak at skill positions.

Blame what you want. They players starting for us don't do enough at WR, TE and RB. Period.

So that needs to be addressed. And not with the cheap FAs like Perriman and Gore.