2021 Draft Thread

[xrade]

36 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

But most thought that Perriman, Mims, Crowder, Herndon, Bell was enough last year

And it may have been with a decent O game plan and QB. We had neither. Don’t get me wrong an upgrade at FA WR could have been done better last year. And yes, I know you were one of the few that thought Herndon was not good. But for most of us, we thought Bell would be better. I have preached we need to get a good WR either through FA or the draft but not both.

 

36 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

Blame what you want. They players starting for us don't do enough at WR, TE and RB. Period.

The blame lies all around. And again, where did I ever state we should not upgrade all three of those positions?  I am not blind. But all three of those positions have strong FA players that will be available to us. You and “others” want to get those FA’s and use high picks on them.  I get it, overstock on this year and worry about the D some other time. Same thing Mac did but in reverse. 

 

36 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

So that needs to be addressed. And not with the cheap FAs like Perriman and Gore.

And have I not said go after good WR, iOL in FA? Not see how I am ignoring those positions.

Edited February 23, 2021 by xrade

[KimuraGod]

1 hour ago, xrade said:

I wanted to keep Robby, but I also thought Perriman would be better than what he was. Much of the blame could probably be laid on gase and Sam for his poor play. I still think he could be a useful #4 but not after his comments about Sam. 

Useful #4. Robby was our #1 and had chemistry and history with Sam. All the other teams i mentioned went out and got their qb #1 receivers. Odell, Diggs and Hollywood. We let ours walk. 

As a number 2. And do you honestly believe  he would have been as good under gase and Sam?  You can’t compare apples to oranges.

Number #1 or #2 who cares. He posted 95/1100. As our primary receiver he would of eclipsed 800 yards IMO. And that’s with the deficiencies you mentioned. Even more of a reason to keep him. Another big thing...availability. The kids played 78 out of 80 games. Perrimans played in 63 out of 96 and not completed many due to injury also. 

But did you believe he would do better?  I did and I am sure JD did.

I like Chris but at the same time I knew Gase wasn’t a big fan as he never looked to get him the ball like a #1 TE would do. Was he enough to not bring in further help....not really. 

Maybe he will this year with a coach that actually uses the TE position. But getting one of the good, young FA TE’s should not cost a lot and they will probably be better then Pat as a 2nd round pick.

Again this is your opinion not a fact so please if we are having a back and forth discussion give me facts not opinion like ‘they will probably be better’. Because in my opinion getting a TE in the 2nd round under team control for 4 years on a peanuts contract to grow with our rookie qb would be more beneficial. But that’s only my opinion because like you said we could go out and get one of the young TE’s in FA but they would cost money. JD doesn’t seem that big of a spender. 

Funny I must have missed Mims when you stated the only weapons we brought in were McGovern and Becton. The point is you downplayed what JD did to help the O and are critical of that in hindsight. Could he have done more? Sure. But look at it when the decisions were made last year and not now. JD also probably knew gase would suck no matter what we did. He also probably knew the cap implications for this year and the fact that now is the time spend more.  He wanted Thuney or did you forget that?  It was not his fault the Pats tagged Thuney. So now we get him this year. 

Well unfortunately you did miss it. Because I alluded to the  o-line being only Becton and McGovern. Mims was a good pick and I really like him. Unfortunately he’s a rookie coming into a season hit by covid so understandably wasn’t going to be someone to depend on out the gate. The fact he missed the first 8 games or whatever just made it even worse but your right he was a great pick up and I loved the draft pick at the time and I think he’s got a bright future.
 

BUT HE WASNT ANYWHERE NEAR ENOUGH!!! He should of been eased in over the course of the year. That’s what Iv tried to explain to you in other threads. You’ve mentioned about #4 receivers like Waddle. You ease guys like this in and year 2 he would be a starter. You don’t pin all your hopes on them producing right out the gate and staying injury free. That’s how you end up with Hogan and Berrios as your starters. Why would you even possibly want to put a rookie qb or Sam back in that position?!  

You can call me out. I like directness. I believe there is a difference between going heavy and going smart. Fill as many holes through FA and the draft before getting future backups. We are not in position to behave like Pitt and draft a WR every year at the expense of another hole. Not yet, anyway.

That's exactly what Iv suggested. Get talent in the building through the draft. Bring in vets in certain positions like CB and LB where we have some nice youth coming through and ease these guys in. You have to understand that we’ve gone with the pissy meek approach on offense and ruined our three last qb prospects (il leave out Hackenberg!!) so no unfortunately I do disagree with you and if you feel like my particular take is overboard on offense then il debate all day because my facts are there for Stevie Wonder to see. We have massively failed Sanchez, Geno and Sam. Let’s not do it again for gods sake. 

You don’t have to agree. This site would be boring if everyone did, but I will point out when people twist the what the general feeling is here. No one said not to provide needed weapon for whoever is QB as you stated. Many of us don’t agree with getting a WR in round one if we get a good WR in FA. Some don’t agree with getting a TE in round 2 when we can get a good TE in FA. Same for RB. And thinking the D would be significantly helped with old guys for a rebuilding team is not something I see JD doing. We need younger players with upside on both sides of the ball not just the O. 
 

Why can’t we bring in some vets though?! Are you telling me a Richard Sherman or Patrick Peterson would be bad players if brought in? Personally I think we have some talent at cb. Hall and Bless can be future starters IMO but they need vets who have been there and done it to learn from. Iv said this multiple times so feel like a broken record but il say it again. This exists in all sports and businesses. 
 

If you have unsuccessful teams or business whatever analogy you want to use.....the young guys become accustomed with losing and failure. They don’t know what it’s like to win. And won’t strive for the best because they don’t know what it’s like. They won’t push to get better because they don’t have the leaders around them demanding it.
 

For us Jets; we’ve become a laughing stick around the league. Same old Jets. Circus. All that crap. We need personality and character added to this team. And by character I’m not talking nice guys here. I’m taking character what can win you a game when it’s tight. Or make a play when a crucial time occurs. We don’t have those guys on the roster. If we bring back Basham and Jenkins and decide to draft a pass rusher #23 is that who he’s going to learn from. When will he hit is ceiling and think that’s enough? We need players who will say **** that. Keep working and get better. Your best is still not good enough. Unfortunately for us we’ve not had that in years. Guys like Sherman etc are guys who’ve been there and won. Made all pros/pro bowls etc. That’s what we need our youngsters aspiring to become. 

 

[Bobby816]

I think 34 is going to be a great spot for an OLineman. Too many good guys that will have to slip to this spot. The value is there. I could easily see a guy like leatherwood and guys like that still available here. 

[Rich51]

34 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

I think 34 is going to be a great spot for an OLineman. Too many good guys that will have to slip to this spot. The value is there. I could easily see a guy like leatherwood and guys like that still available here. 

This is one of the positions I loved watching at the combine. Right now (if we keep 2) I’m leaning towards Darriaaw or Vera-Tucker at 23 and Javonte Williams at 34 but I wouldn’t be upset with getting Bateman or an edge rusher at 23 and a Davis, Leatherwood, Jenkins or Humphrey at 34. 

[Jag68Sid87]

22 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

I explained that.

We use the 2nd pick on Wilson lets say. Could that 2nd pick not been used to help the roster besides QB more? Could that pick not be traded back (very likely lets keep in mind). And acquire still a top 5 or so pick and an additional 2nd and 3rd to help this roster? Its a 100% fact that what can be built as the roster as a whole is better with sticking with Darnold. For those exact reasons I mentioned.

You want to debate Wilson > Darnold. But its not that simple. Its what can be done if we stick with Darnold for the 52 other spots that plays into it as well. 

Is it 100% fact, though? I mean, wouldn't we have more money to spend if we restarted the clock on the quarterback position? It sounds to me like we would be in great shape with Darnold for only one year, and then we would have to start paying him or let him walk (likely the latter). So then, we either have to start all over again finding a new QB or paying out more than we want at the QB position. Heck, you could probably be able to spend less money on a veteran free agent than a long-term deal with Darnold. 

I just don't see any upside in keeping Darnold. To me, if we are keeping Darnold, it is because we are confident we can trade him for a Watson, a Wilson or a Prescott, OR, we are tanking for yet another season. And the latter makes absolutely no sense, and the former seems like a long shot at this point.

 

18 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

But most thought that Perriman, Mims, Crowder, Herndon, Bell was enough last year.

I got beat up by most this board for saying that wasn't enough.

And what happened. We were incredibly weak at skill positions.

Blame what you want. They players starting for us don't do enough at WR, TE and RB. Period.

So that needs to be addressed. And not with the cheap FAs like Perriman and Gore.

If we had a good quarterback and a good offensive coordinator, that lineup would have at least been able to compete. Since Darnold and Gase both suck balls, we were a laughingstock on offense.

[xrade]

3 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

I think 34 is going to be a great spot for an OLineman. Too many good guys that will have to slip to this spot. The value is there. I could easily see a guy like leatherwood and guys like that still available here. 

There will be quite a few especially along the interior. Leatherwood had a horrible Senior Bowl. He could drop to round 3. 

[xrade]

So I just saw what I thought was the best an most realistic (almost) mock draft.

#2 - Wilson QB. Wilson / Fields, Fields / Wilson I don’t care. Give me a future starting QB. I do lean towards Wilson.

#23 - Rousseau EDGE. I am not the biggest fan of his but if he were there at 23, go for it. I doubt he will be there.

#34 -  Marshall WR. I like him at 34. Big and can catch the damn ball. Not the greatest route runner yet. If we sign a starter for the Z, he would be a great #4.

#66 - Gainwell RB. If Williams is gone which is likely, he is my #4 RB and should fit this O nicely.

#87 - Cox LB. He will eventually be a starter. He will have some growing pains but he is a decent OLB that can drop into coverage.

I wish CB would be addressed in the draft but I think we will not get one of the top 3 and the rest have some warts. I guess a GA CB will have to do for now.  Can’t fix everything in one year. 

[Dr.O]

54 minutes ago, xrade said:

So I just saw what I thought was the best an most realistic (almost) mock draft.

#2 - Wilson QB. Wilson / Fields, Fields / Wilson I don’t care. Give me a future starting QB. I do lean towards Wilson.

#23 - Rousseau EDGE. I am not the biggest fan of his but if he were there at 23, go for it. I doubt he will be there.

#34 -  Marshall WR. I like him at 34. Big and can catch the damn ball. Not the greatest route runner yet. If we sign a starter for the Z, he would be a great #4.

#66 - Gainwell RB. If Williams is gone which is likely, he is my #4 RB and should fit this O nicely.

#87 - Cox LB. He will eventually be a starter. He will have some growing pains but he is a decent OLB that can drop into coverage.

I wish CB would be addressed in the draft but I think we will not get one of the top 3 and the rest have some warts. I guess a GA CB will have to do for now.  Can’t fix everything in one year. 

Would love this, although I’d like to switch Marshall out for a guy with speed and YAC ability like Rondale Moore or Amon-Ra St.Brown

[xrade]

3 hours ago, Dr.O said:

Would love this, although I’d like to switch Marshall out for a guy with speed and YAC ability like Rondale Moore or Amon-Ra St.Brown

I have seen Marshall play and he is good. I can’t comment on Moore or St.Brown because I have not seen them play. I liken Marshall to a Alan Robinson type. He does not yet have Robinsons route running skills but he will catch what gets thrown in his area regardless of the QB. You could probably equate him to Micheal Thomas as well. Maybe he will never be more than a number 2 but he will be a good productive starter. But whether it is Marshall, Toney or whomever, getting them at 34 would be nice. 

[ekill08x]

11 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

I think 34 is going to be a great spot for an OLineman. Too many good guys that will have to slip to this spot. The value is there. I could easily see a guy like leatherwood and guys like that still available here. 

That's exactly where I want the OL I agree with this, maybe not leatherwood exactly but someone on the interior that could really tighten it up completely (assuming we sign a FA OG on the left)

[jetjuice]

13 hours ago, xrade said:

I have seen Marshall play and he is good. I can’t comment on Moore or St.Brown because I have not seen them play. I liken Marshall to a Alan Robinson type. He does not yet have Robinsons route running skills but he will catch what gets thrown in his area regardless of the QB. You could probably equate him to Micheal Thomas as well. Maybe he will never be more than a number 2 but he will be a good productive starter. But whether it is Marshall, Toney or whomever, getting them at 34 would be nice. 

There will be plenty of options at 34.

We should be double dipping at WR this year. Saw we brought in Demetric Felton for a workout, that excites me. He's one of my favorite weapons in this draft. Getting him along with a Marshall or Toney and a FA signing like Godwin or Fuller would leave me comfortable at the position.

[Rockice_8]

Here is my list of targets in no order.  Assuming we resign Maye and Poole who I think we will.

2 WRs, 2 IOL, RB, CB, QB, SS, WILL, 43 DE, and TE.  Whether we sign or draft them I think this is my top priority list.  If we can address these positions we'd be in good shape.  It's too early to do a mock offseason because so much talent is yet to hit the market.

Edited February 25, 2021 by Rockice_8

[xrade]

7 minutes ago, Rockice_8 said:

Here is my list of targets in no order.  Assuming we resign Maye and Poole who I think we will.

2 WRs, 2 IOL, RB, CB, QB, SS, WILL, 43 DE, and TE.  Whether we sign or draft them I think this is my top priority list.  If we can address these positions we'd be in good shape.  It's too early to do a mock offseason because so much talent is yet to hit the market.

Why SS this year? I am open to an upgrade at every position but S and iDL seem pretty solid if we resign Maye. I could live with Maye and Davis for 2021. 

[xrade]

16 hours ago, ekill08x said:

That's exactly where I want the OL I agree with this, maybe not leatherwood exactly but someone on the interior that could really tighten it up completely (assuming we sign a FA OG on the left)

Yea. iOL at 34 would be good as well. An iOL of Thuney/Linsley, Elflein and McGovern would be OK for this year, but an iOL of the same plus an iOL pick at 34 would be a lot more comforting and set us up for the long term. 

[SDotNova]

One thing we should remember in all this noise is how JD was setup to handle OT in the 1st.

During the draft coverage, they had the cameras on the Jax GM or Ari GM. Can’t remember exactly who. But JD called him. After the phone call, the GM told his staff “it was the Jets. They’re staying put”. JD had pre draft agreement to trade up for OT. But decided not to trade up after seeing the draft unfold.

The point being is that we have evidence that he’ll go up and get his guy. We also evidence that he’s willing to trade back if he doesn’t see good value at a giving spot.