Chiefs CB Bashaud Breeland Arrested in South Carolina

[Dome]

31 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said:

The officer gave him plenty of chances to comply, and (in my opinion) could have used varying levels of force much earlier, to include taser or OC spray. He clearly didn't want to.

Could have? I’d say should have. Which is why I said he needs more training. He needs to get control of the situation, don’t sit there trying to hold Breelands hand for 2 minutes before whipping out a gun. Make him listen. There’s a use of force ladder and IMO the officer skipped rungs unnecessarily (to catch up after letting the situation get out of his control) after failing to get on the first rung fast enough.

soon as the gun comes out the situation became 100x more dangerous to anyone in the immediate vicinity, never should’ve come to that IMO

 

(ftr I wanted to be a cop for a while and took weapons, h2h combat and de-escalation classes with the local sheriffs office, so I’m not just talking out my arse) this cop would’ve needed a lot of work before they moved him on to the next class, he carried himself like a mall cop 

Edited May 2, 2020 by Dome
Edit... probably shouldn’t even be talking about this in the NFL news forum. I don’t care enough to derail the thread, so I’ll bow out now before anyone gets their feathers ruffled

[GSUeagles14]

5 minutes ago, Dome said:

Could have? I’d say should have. Which is why I said he needs more training. He needs to get control of the situation, don’t sit there trying to hold Breelands hand for 2 minutes before whipping out a gun. Make him listen. There’s a use of force ladder and IMO the officer skipped rungs unnecessarily (to catch up after letting the situation get out of his control) after failing to get on the first rung fast enough.

soon as the gun comes out the situation became 100x more dangerous to anyone in the immediate vicinity, never should’ve come to that IMO

 

(ftr I wanted to be a cop for a while and took weapons, h2h combat and de-escalation classes with the local sheriffs office, so I’m not just talking out my arse) this cop would’ve needed a lot of work before they moved him on to the next class, he carried himself like a mall cop 

I agree with most of this, on top of it once he had his weapon drawn he had a serious distance issue. Breelands already a moron during this, if hes an even bigger one he could easily grab that weapon and then your tussling over that with a NFL player who assumedly is very strong compared to the average person.

 

On topic though, breelands a moron, i hope he gets suspended for this, although i dont think he will.

[TL-TwoWinsAway]

13 minutes ago, Dome said:

Could have? I’d say should have. Which is why I said he needs more training. He needs to get control of the situation, don’t sit there trying to hold Breelands hand for 2 minutes before whipping out a gun. Make him listen. There’s a use of force ladder and IMO the officer skipped rungs unnecessarily (to catch up after letting the situation get out of his control) after failing to get on the first rung fast enough.

soon as the gun comes out the situation became 100x more dangerous to anyone in the area, never should’ve come to that 

 

(ftr I wanted to be a cop for a while and took weapons, h2h combat and de-escalation classes with the local sheriffs office) this cop would’ve needed a lot of work before them moved him on to the next class, he carried himself like a mall cop 

This is a good example why many departments, including my own, moved away from a use of force "ladder" and to a use of force "continuum". It isn't about having to "skip rungs" as it is "apply the correct use of force". The best thing that the officer did was draw his pistol when the individual entered his vehicle, irregardless of his lack of force prior to that escalation. (The officer can't hesitate to pull his service pistol. If he feels that an individual is potentially posing a threat to his life, or the life of someone else, he needs to respond appropriately. Breeland entered his vehicle, so it absolutely should have come to that.)

He absolutely failed to control the situation, and also appeared timid. He should have activated his taser (his selected use of force) earlier, and while the individual attempted to enter his vehicle. At the same time, the situation was resolved without injuries, which is always a positive.

Edited May 2, 2020 by TL-TwoWinsAway

[TL-TwoWinsAway]

There are also times (and we can't see earlier in this video) where the officer has developed a rapport with the individual, knows the individual, or believes the individual to be mentally challenged. In those situations, the officer may be reluctant to apply force unless and until his life is threatened. I don't know what was going through the officer's head, but he seemed to be trying to 'talk' the individual into compliance. It's not the preferred strategy when the individual isn't complying with verbal commands, but, again, other factors can be in play.

[Dome]

2 hours ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said:

At the same time, the situation was resolved without injuries, which is always a positive.

Totally agree. I don’t want to clog up the thread much more.

I’m gonna shoot you a PM, you seem knowledgeable about the topic.

[Soko]

4 hours ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said:

This is a good example why many departments, including my own, moved away from a use of force "ladder" and to a use of force "continuum". It isn't about having to "skip rungs" as it is "apply the correct use of force".

We call it a “wheel” here - I think the brass thinks “continuum” is too complicated for the lot of us. Same concept though, too many guys got fixated on hitting each step in situations that required a more immediate response.

 

[TL-TwoWinsAway]

9 hours ago, Yin-Yang said:

We call it a “wheel” here - I think the brass thinks “continuum” is too complicated for the lot of us. Same concept though, too many guys got fixated on hitting each step in situations that required a more immediate response.

 

(Ha.) Yep, exactly. It's a much more appropriate visual, and is much more accurate to the way real situations need to be handled.

[nagahide13]

For what it's worth, in the video I linked the officer isn't holding a gun until about halfway when Breeland enters his vehicle. He could have anything in there. He had no reason to get into his car unless it was to evade the officer or to grab something. All of a sudden everyone, especially the officer, was at serious risk of harm.

I'm pretty surprised that Breeland didn't get tased earlier. He definitely didn't NEED to be tased since he wasn't violent and ended up being put under control without injuring anybody, but the justification was definitely there. He got warned a BUNCH of times, and all of the civilians around are shouting at him to comply.

It's just kind of scary. Some people almost go into shock and it seems like they're almost not in control of their actions. Jules Winnfield (Pulp Fiction) "Say 'what' again!" type of stuff.

Make "dealing with law enforcement" a part of the rookie symposium for ALL rookies.

Edited May 4, 2020 by nagahide13

[Ty21]

It’s a mixture of NFL offseason and quarantine stir craziness. These dudes don’t stand a chance.