Turnobili Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Yin-Yang said: Cap hits are $5.3M, $9.3M, and $9.3M. Not that big a contract. jags ate a lot of it but he's still getting considerably more than the free agents who were available and there are virtually no outs, unless they want to eat over 6 mil in dead money after the 2021 season. and 4th round pick carry value big is relative, and i'm comparing it to the options they had. he didnt exactly have value either, there's a reason the jags decided to dump him after a year and eat all that dead money just to get him off their books. not a ringing endorsement for a guy who had 1 good complete season 7 years ago followed by a really nice postseason run one time several years later Edited May 1, 2020 by Turnobili Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 1 minute ago, Turnobili said: big is relative, and i'm comparing it to the options they had Such as? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turnobili Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Heinz D. said: Such as? Cameron Newton, Jameis Winston, Marcus Mariota, Case Keenum, Joe Flacco were all free agents at the time. I'm not convinced that Foles is significantly better than any of them, or that any of them would require 21 mil guaranteed to get over, or cost them a mid round pick. Or could have just waited out the inevitable Dalton release. The only reason Foles was avaialable is because the team that acquired him just a year ago already had buyers remorse after he was outplayed by a UDFA, given the job back, and then lost it again. Edited May 1, 2020 by Turnobili Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 3 minutes ago, Turnobili said: Cameron Newton, Jameis Winston, Marcus Mariota, Case Keenum, Joe Flacco were all free agents at the time. I'm not convinced that Foles is significantly better than any of them, or that any of them would require 21 mil guaranteed to get over, or cost them a mid round pick. I AM convinced that Foles is significantly better than all of them. And I don't feel like breaking down why. Nor should I have to. 3 minutes ago, Turnobili said: Or could have just waited out the inevitable Dalton release. How did the Bears know it was inevitable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turnobili Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Heinz D. said: I AM convinced that Foles is significantly better than all of them. And I don't feel like breaking down why. Nor should I have to. How did the Bears know it was inevitable? You don't have to. Nobody said you did. It's not like I posted a detailed breakdown of why I thought some of those guys would be better. If you're convinced that he is significantly better than each of those guys, and therefore justifying costing a lot more than them, then that makes one of us. Nothing wrong with disagreeing. I just find it to be a difficult position to defend given the range of options. Now if we knew that behind closed doors, some or many of these guys informed the Bears they weren't interested, that changes the calculus. I was laying out potential options. Dalton was the last one I mentioned for that reason. The inevitability was based on the state of the Bengals, their draft position, and Dalton's salary (weighing the potential of him agreeing to negotiate a paycut while backing up a #1 overall pick, with no starting opportunity in sight). Edited May 1, 2020 by Turnobili Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 16 minutes ago, Turnobili said: jags ate a lot of it but he's still getting considerably more than the free agents who were available and there are virtually no outs, unless they want to eat over 6 mil in dead money after the 2021 season. and 4th round pick carry value big is relative, and i'm comparing it to the options they had. he didnt exactly have value either, there's a reason the jags decided to dump him after a year and eat all that dead money just to get him off their books. not a ringing endorsement for a guy who had 1 good complete season 7 years ago followed by a really nice postseason run one time several years later I mean, it’s 26th in the league. No outs for what, two seasons? As opposed to all the QB contracts that have outs after the first year? It’s not a significant contract at all. The Jaguars committed to their re-build and got rid of a bad contract. You can’t say he had no value because the Jags didn’t want him, and then say guys like Cam/Jameis do have value despite their market being virtually zero. Which is besides the point, even as a high end backup, Foles’ current deal for the Bears isn’t a big one at all. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 52 minutes ago, Turnobili said: I was laying out potential options. Dalton was the last one I mentioned for that reason. The inevitability was based on the state of the Bengals, their draft position, and Dalton's salary (weighing the potential of him agreeing to negotiate a paycut while backing up a #1 overall pick, with no starting opportunity in sight). We're pretty sure the Bears did look into Dalton, along with a lot of other teams. But for whatever reason, or reasons, (a big one probably being Dalton didn't want to renegotiate his deal), the Bears, and everybody else, got cold feet. I think Foles is probably a better option, either way. As a side note, I'd like to point out that there is so little interesting to say about the Ginn signing (outside of it's kind of befuddling, and unclear what it means to the Bears' depth chart), that we've migrated to discussing Foles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turnobili Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Heinz D. said: We're pretty sure the Bears did look into Dalton, along with a lot of other teams. But for whatever reason, or reasons, (a big one probably being Dalton didn't want to renegotiate his deal), the Bears, and everybody else, got cold feet. I think Foles is probably a better option, either way. As a side note, I'd like to point out that there is so little interesting to say about the Ginn signing (outside of it's kind of befuddling, and unclear what it means to the Bears' depth chart), that we've migrated to discussing Foles. that my bad for diverting the thread, honestly. i think Ginn makes sense as a complement to Robinson and Miller. he's a better deep receiver than Taylor Gabriel (who is a better gadget player), and Foles likes going deep. Edited May 1, 2020 by Turnobili 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zopound Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 5 hours ago, Heinz D. said: I think he's probably still a good player. But the signing confuses me... It’s absolutely no different than signing Buster Skrine to help mold Duke Shelley who they took in the 6th last year... Anyone expecting 5th round Mooney from Tulane to play any meaningful snaps was wishful thinking. This is the perfect veteran and mentor for a season or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilenFroggen Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 5 hours ago, rrgm said: Decent pickup for Foles and Friends. Feels he has been around forever. He has. Drafted the same year as Jon Beason, Greg Olsen, and Darrelle Revis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWATcha Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) Still has great speed. Pans for hands though. Best of luck to him. Won't miss seeing him drop balls in NOLA. Edited May 1, 2020 by SWATcha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 6 hours ago, rrgm said: Feels he has been around forever. I came here to say the same thing. Never really lived up to the 9th overall pick, but he had a very long career. Never went over 60 receptions or 800 yards in a single year, once had a season with 10 TDs, was a very good return guy for Miami and SF, but never really did much outside of those two teams on ST... Guys like him usually putter out of the league, but here he is... going strong at 35. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 7 hours ago, DoleINGout said: I remember when he was drafted by the Dolphins in 2007. Happy to see him still in the NFL all these years later. That was the first draft I really started to read scout magazines and pay attention to that whole process. Ahhh yes. And then everyone at the Dolphins draft party booed Cam Cameron on stage following the selection. Yare Yare... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelonebillsfan Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 1 hour ago, ET80 said: I came here to say the same thing. Never really lived up to the 9th overall pick, but he had a very long career. Never went over 60 receptions or 800 yards in a single year, once had a season with 10 TDs, was a very good return guy for Miami and SF, but never really did much outside of those two teams on ST... Guys like him usually putter out of the league, but here he is... going strong at 35. Kinda reminds me of a worse version of Reggie, never had that one real "Wow" year (though Reggie had a couple really good ones with the Dolphins) but stuck around forever and contributed forever. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apparition Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) Looking back at that first round in 2007 and you see names like Calvin Johnson, Joe Thomas, Adrian Peterson, Patrick Willis, Lynch, Revis, Timmons, Beason, Staley... and yet only two are left standing: Greg Olsen, and Ginn - the guy everyone thought was a massive reach at the time and the guy who was traded after 3 seasons for a 5th rounder. The NFL is weird. Edited May 1, 2020 by Starless 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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