Madmike90 Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 Personally I can't understand why anyone would go option one...at the end of the day Pace & Nagy were not brought here to draft & or develop just a QB...they were brought here to create a winning team which is way more than just a QB as multiple teams over the years have proven...I think at this point we just all need to get over the fact Pace has missed on Trubisky...plenty of GMs have missed big...it happens...the key is if they can miss and still create winning teams...if we were to go 11-5 with Foles at QB Nagy would be 31-17 as a HC in the regular season..you would be mad to want to get rid of Pace and Nagy if that is the record...if you are in a position where you have just had that kind of season you pull a GB and draft a QB to sit for a year behind Foles and don't pay Trubisky $25 million which destroys your ability to keep talent and add more...at that point you can give Nagy his guy which Trubisky never was which means you have given yourself long term stability and a future as well as being able to add more talent now. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugashane Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 I'd pick two. Neither Tru or Foles is a long term option, but if the rest of the team is playing well then it shows 2019 was hopefully a fluke for a lot of the young guys. Either way we need a QB of the future, and we don't have that on the team right now. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beardown3231 Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 1 hour ago, abstract_thought said: The most likely financial outcome of Trubisky playing well is that the Bears tag him for the 2021 season. That would be a financial poison pill that would kick-off a talent exodus. The Bears would have no cap space and would be left without viable starters at several positions. Which is why the odds were never great, taking 1 QB with 38 or whatever picks is unacceptable. 1 hour ago, WindyCity said: If you have a QB playing at a high level you can survive that. Foles isn’t going to be any cheaper in option 2. The Bears have enough overpaid “talent” to survive it. Besides Leno and Massie, who do you think is overpaid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topwop1 Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 7 hours ago, WindyCity said: I have no problem with the move. I like that he went and got his guy. You seem to think I have a problem with the trade or the move, I don't, I have a problem that he missed the evaluation. I can get some crayons out and draw it out for you if that would make things easier. He was wrong and as I said then, Trubisky is a franchise QB or Pace is gone and I am fine with that. It beats sitting in mediocrity for 5 more years. Either Trubisky becomes a franchise QB or Pace is fired, it doesn't really matter if he spent the 3rd overall pick or traded for the 2nd pick. I wanted the Bears to take a QB and to get there guy. He was wrong and it crippled the franchise. You cannot play that game man. You can certainly change your mind on a player, but to give kudos to a GM at the time for drafting a certain player and now bashing him for making the pick because it now looks like it was the wrong move, is just bad taste IMO. That's wussy arse crap. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topwop1 Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 7 hours ago, WindyCity said: If you do not do the full job on all of them it leads to confirmation bias. What you are describing is confirmation bias. You know the answer you want therefor you do not explore all options with the same energy or open mindedness. That is an issue. If you wanted Mitch to be the guy and because of that did not allow Watson the chance to impress you with his Camry and reservation making skills. It's only confirmation bias to you because you are assuming that the full job entails wining and dining each prospect at the very last step before making a decision on who to draft. Are you suggesting that every top-3 prospect at any position that a GM drafts should be interviewed in person, even if that player's tape was evaluated in full and it was determined that said player was not a fit for that GM's criteria? I mean I just don't know what your point here is. That an in person meeting between Pace and Watson would have changed what Pace and his cronies evaluated from his tape? Highly highly unlikely, but go ahead and continue to grasp at straws. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topwop1 Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 4 hours ago, dll2000 said: I am luke warm on Pace. I am not demanding he be fired, but I no longer feel like he is indispensable. I like his overall management style and many of his philosophies, but I strongly disagree with a number of his draft picks (in real time - hindsight is not fair). I just look around NFL and you could do a lot worse than Pace given total package. But he flubbed the MT pick with a future HOFer on the board making it 10x worse. ... so he has to live with that. I don't know that there HAS to be consequences and there are no second chances for GMs on a missed QB pick. It is fairly easy to do. Even good evaluators do it. I mean Jimmy Johnson drafted Steve Walsh with number 2 pick a year after drafting Aikman and he is one of best finders of talent ever. I can probably think of a number of other examples off top of my head ... Bill Walsh drafted a bust QB he was super high on, can't remember his name. Steelers passed on Marino, etc. I thought he should have waited until 2018 class with a new coach. That QB class was supposed to be bee's knees and deep, all any one talked about. Let Fox lose with Glennon and start anew with a new QB. Kind of like why take a WR last year in 4th when this year's class is supposed to be super deep at WR? Yet it wasn't really all that when you consider that IMO both Mayfield, Darnold are approaching Trubisky territory, Allen is just ok and that Rosen is a bust. The best QB from that year is by far Lamar Jackson and I doubt he would have been Bears selection had they waited until 2018 to take a QB since 30 other teams passed on him (including the team that selected him) before he ultimately got drafted at 32. The thing I agree with you here that I'll criticize Pace for is taking a QB with a lame duck coach in Fox. Why not just fire Fox then if you knew he wasn't going to stick around to be with the future QB? What a colossal waste of time and a year of crucial development. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 2 hours ago, topwop1 said: Yet it wasn't really all that when you consider that IMO both Mayfield, Darnold are approaching Trubisky territory, Allen is just ok and that Rosen is a bust. YOU DON'T KNOW THAT YOU LEAVE HIM ALONE! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Romen Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 3 hours ago, RunningVaccs said: YOU DON'T KNOW THAT YOU LEAVE HIM ALONE! No more white UDFA heroes, only top 10 bust hopefuls now! Can we get Manziel or Weeden next??? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAF-N72EX Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, topwop1 said: he thing I agree with you here that I'll criticize Pace for is taking a QB with a lame duck coach in Fox. Why not just fire Fox then if you knew he wasn't going to stick around to be with the future QB? What a colossal waste of time and a year of crucial development. Yep. I have no problem with ANYONE criticizing Pace for drafting Mitch when he knew damn well that Fox wasn't going to be around for more than a year and he would have to replace him. All the while putting the new HC/OC in place of position that they are forced to mold a QB who they did not choose into something that matched their vision. I still criticize Pace for allowing Fox to start Mitch and putting him in a losing situation that killed his confidence. Pce/Fox should have rode the year out with his 20 million dollar Glennon and let Mitch learn instead of throwing him into the fire with a bunch of nobodies. There is plenty to criticize Pace about, but when you are criticizing him for drafting a highly regarded player that filled a need that you agreed with at the time.....that's a cop out. Edited May 12, 2020 by JustAnotherFan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAF-N72EX Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 49 minutes ago, The_Romen said: No more white UDFA heroes, only top 10 bust hopefuls now! Can we get Manziel or Weeden next??? Manziel is still in rehab that is sanctioned, sponsored, and funded by a strip club in a small town in Arizona. Whenever he finishes his 985 day sessions he will back for sure. With a vengeance. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 5 hours ago, The_Romen said: No more white UDFA heroes, only top 10 bust hopefuls now! Can we get Manziel or Weeden next??? What about Kevin... white? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Romen Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 9 minutes ago, RunningVaccs said: What about Kevin... white? Sounds like a scrappy, gym rat... Would you say he's a "first in, last out" kinda guy? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 14 hours ago, Madmike90 said: Personally I can't understand why anyone would go option one...at the end of the day Pace & Nagy were not brought here to draft & or develop just a QB...they were brought here to create a winning team which is way more than just a QB as multiple teams over the years have proven...I think at this point we just all need to get over the fact Pace has missed on Trubisky...plenty of GMs have missed big...it happens...the key is if they can miss and still create winning teams...if we were to go 11-5 with Foles at QB Nagy would be 31-17 as a HC in the regular season..you would be mad to want to get rid of Pace and Nagy if that is the record...if you are in a position where you have just had that kind of season you pull a GB and draft a QB to sit for a year behind Foles and don't pay Trubisky $25 million which destroys your ability to keep talent and add more...at that point you can give Nagy his guy which Trubisky never was which means you have given yourself long term stability and a future as well as being able to add more talent now. If Foles goes 11-5 and win a playoff game he is going to cost you 25 million in 2021. It is a out sustained success. Trubisky being good gives you the best chance at sustained success, Foles has never sustained anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 14 hours ago, abstract_thought said: This is what Rams fans said about their quarterback last offseason. Unless you start a rookie in 2021 you are paying big money to a QB. The Rams issue is two fold 1. Goff isn't that good 2. They traded a ton of picks and gave out a ton of bad contracts Don't do #2 and #1 doesn't kill you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 (edited) 12 hours ago, topwop1 said: It's only confirmation bias to you because you are assuming that the full job entails wining and dining each prospect at the very last step before making a decision on who to draft. Are you suggesting that every top-3 prospect at any position that a GM drafts should be interviewed in person, even if that player's tape was evaluated in full and it was determined that said player was not a fit for that GM's criteria? I mean I just don't know what your point here is. That an in person meeting between Pace and Watson would have changed what Pace and his cronies evaluated from his tape? Highly highly unlikely, but go ahead and continue to grasp at straws. As Dan Weiderer and Rich Campbell reported in the tribune. They did not meet with him at the Pro Day and the only meeting they had was the car wash interview at the combine. If your picking a QB high, I think you need more than that much contact with one of the top options. Especially when Pace points to getting to know Trubisky the person as being so important to his decision. His family, his car, the dinner reservation and on and on. Edited May 12, 2020 by WindyCity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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