WindyCity Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 10 hours ago, G08 said: My 'bet' comment was a blanket statement regarding how the season goes. I don't free any scenario occurring where both Pace and Nagy are fired after this season. Playoffs or not. 3-13 or 4-12 or a complete QB meltdown I think they are in trouble. Other than that I think they are okay. I do not think that the McCaskeys want to blow it up, but I think they need to see something at QB from one of the guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 10 hours ago, JustAnotherFan said: So you wanna become the Browns....got it. No, I want to find a GM that can make us the Ravens, Seahawks, Steelers etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOGRIESE Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 3 minutes ago, WindyCity said: No, I want to find a GM that can make us the Ravens, Seahawks, Steelers etc. Yeah the Steelers QB situation has been the mark of stability Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 10 hours ago, JustAnotherFan said: When will people realize that the draft is a total lottery---ESPECIALLY when it come to QB's. And just like the lottery, sometimes you hit and sometimes you miss. But that doesn't mean the GM's are idiots either. Ozzie Newsome was one of the best GM's and had one of the best eyes for talent at the time and he still had his fair share of misses at the QB position too (traded up to draft Kyle Boller). Conversely, Belichick nearly passed on Brady for Tim Ratay. Alot of players in the draft will usually fall under one or more of these 5 categories . 1) There are certain players that blow up because they happen to still be available and go to the right team with the best philosophy/teachings that better suits their strengths and help them reach their peak even sooner than expected. See Mahomes, for example, being blessed by getting drafted by a QB guru in Reid and being fortunate enough to be able to sit the bench for a year and learn behind a veteran that is playing in the very same offense that he will eventually be starting for without having to worry about having to learn an entirely new playbook,. 2) Then there are some players who become "busts" because they were simply drafted by the wrong team that play against all of those strengths for whatever reason. See the Packers drafts on defense over the years for example. A team who has struggled for years to fill a void in the secondary. They have drafted some good players like Casey heyward and Michel Hyde but they were only good AFTER they left the Packers and went on to other teams. The Rams(Fisher/Goff) is another example. Goff looked terrible in his rookie eyar under Jeff Fisher. Now what would have happened if Fisher wasn't canned after that and Goff played as bad in his second year? Goff would have more than likely been benched, replaced, and considered a bust. 3) Then there are some players who get drafted by completely inept teams that are internally broken from the ground up and are ultimately set up to fail from the jump. See Cleveland for example. Be honest, when a player goes to Cleveland, how much faith do really have in that player actually working out? Regardless of how good he may look on film and paper.....hell he could be a "sure fire pick"....but when you see THAT player go to Cleveland you just know there are doubts from the start because of how dysfunctional the organization is at the time. <<<Maybe this was Mitch as well. Because that's how I saw it at the time and one of the reasons why I wanted him to sit the bench and not take a single snap in his rookie year until there was some stability upstairs. 4) Then there are some who just don't have it in them. Either by choice or not. Some have unfortunate injuries by trying too hard to succeed or others who just don't simply don't have the passion to grow. 5) And then you have those very RARE players who do just "have it" and can blow up no matter where they go. Good luck finding these gems. So we should put names on a wheel and spin to make picks? It it is a lottery or a crap shoot then we should just pick randomly. This is a cop out. Yes, all GMs miss. But there is a reason that some teams and some GMs are consistently more successful than others, because some GMs are better at their jobs. I do agree that there are circumstances that effect a pick after it is made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 1 minute ago, GOGRIESE said: Yeah the Steelers QB situation has been the mark of stability The Steelers are a consistent contending team that drafts well. They have also had 15 years or borderline HOF QB play so I am not sure what you are talking about? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 5 minutes ago, WindyCity said: No, I want to find a GM that can make us the Ravens, Seahawks, Steelers etc. So do the Browns and a ton of other franchises...can't just keep burning through guys every couple of years or we will always be losers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOGRIESE Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 Just now, WindyCity said: The Steelers are a consistent contending team that drafts well. They have also had 15 years or borderline HOF QB play so I am not sure what you are talking about? Have you been paying attention the past few years especially when Big Ben is out? How has that looked with the QBs that they spent resources on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOGRIESE Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 Just now, Madmike90 said: So do the Browns and a ton of other franchises...can't just keep burning through guys every couple of years or we will always be losers. Exactly. I really like the group of guys that we have. I mean the way Windy talks it sounds like we're contending for a top 3 pick. This if everyone stays healthy should be right in the mix for playoffs. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 Just now, GOGRIESE said: Have you been paying attention the past few years especially when Big Ben is out? How has that looked with the QBs that they spent resources on? You mean a 3rd round pick in Mason Rudolph? If Pace wanted to draft a HOF QB who gets injured in year 15 and causes a QB problem I am okay with him staying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 2 minutes ago, Madmike90 said: So do the Browns and a ton of other franchises...can't just keep burning through guys every couple of years or we will always be losers. It has been 6 years. This is not the Browns. You know who I do not want to be? The Jaguars, who keep David Caldwell around year and year even though the results are not worthy of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOGRIESE Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, WindyCity said: You mean a 3rd round pick in Mason Rudolph? If Pace wanted to draft a HOF QB who gets injured in year 15 and causes a QB problem I am okay with him staying. Yeah I'm calling bull****. You wouldn't be satisfied. Did you forget Landry Jones and Dennis Dixon? Edited May 15, 2020 by GOGRIESE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 Just now, GOGRIESE said: Yeah I'm calling bull****. You wouldn't be satisfied. Of course I would. I am not even asking for HOF QB play. I am asking for a GM who can provide us with a long term QB. I am not satisfied because we are going back in time. We made changes to enter into the modern NFL and we continue to be a good defense, bad offense, and poor QB play. It is like ground hogs day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOGRIESE Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 Just now, WindyCity said: Of course I would. I am not even asking for HOF QB play. I am asking for a GM who can provide us with a long term QB. I am not satisfied because we are going back in time. We made changes to enter into the modern NFL and we continue to be a good defense, bad offense, and poor QB play. It is like ground hogs day. Tell it to someone who will believe it. I guarantee if we were in their position with Big Ben on the edge retirement/always hurt and there was no viable backup despite multiple attempts to develop one you'd be calling for his head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 5 minutes ago, WindyCity said: It has been 6 years. This is not the Browns. You know who I do not want to be? The Jaguars, who keep David Caldwell around year and year even though the results are not worthy of that. And again since Pace got his HC we haven't even had a losing season...you are so blinded by your hatred of the QB situation that you can't see the quality team Pace has built...even average QB play this year gets us to 10 wins if we can stay healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 Just now, Madmike90 said: And again since Pace got his HC we haven't even had a losing season...you are so blinded by your hatred of the QB situation that you can't see the quality team Pace has built...even average QB play this year gets us to 10 wins if we can stay healthy. Haven't had a losing season is nice. But also haven't done anything. In my opinion 2018 appears to be more of a fluke than a repeatable occurrence. If we can only get average QB play. The Bears fan motto for my entire life. I am not blinded. I see a GM who cannot build and offense and who cannot address the QB spot, In the modern NFL that GM has limited value for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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