Calvert28 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Texas_OutLaw7 said: Take QB out of the equation - how do you feel about our roster? What are your initial expectations? Do your expectations change between Dalton and Dak? Expectations are playoff expectations. We are good enough to get there h/e with our lack of a legit pass rush or secondary it's all very much up in the air. Honestly no. Both Dalton and Dak have been held back because of poor coaching so we have yet to see either make that leap that would put them into great or elite range. Since neither one has shown the ability to put the team on their backs then what evidence do we have that one is that much more valuable then the other when the game is on the line? We have seen both fall short. So no it doesn't change my expectations, but what does change my outlook is 7M vs 35M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 7 minutes ago, DaBoys said: My statistical rants? lol I posted career numbers. Obviously they don’t favor your stance so you have resorted to a crazy hypothetical that includes Dalton leading the team to a conference championship game for the first time in 25 years only to fall one game shy of a SB due to his errors. I promise you if we get to the NFCC game with Dalton as QB no one will be talking about paying Dak, unless we actually lose to him in the championship game. If Dak at 30m went to the panthers and beat us in the championship then yes, the $30m would have been worth it. if Dak is holding out and we go to the championship then no. The 30m won’t be a regret because we haven’t seen Dak even get there I agree, if we get to the NFC championship game then who says we just couldn't do it by drafting a Dak like player with Sam Ehlinger next year or someone else and have them take us all the way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas_OutLaw7 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 8 minutes ago, DaBoys said: My statistical rants? lol I posted career numbers. Obviously they don’t favor your stance so you have resorted to a crazy hypothetical that includes Dalton leading the team to a conference championship game for the first time in 25 years only to fall one game shy of a SB due to his errors. I promise you if we get to the NFCC game with Dalton as QB no one will be talking about paying Dak, unless we actually lose to him in the championship game. If Dak at 30m went to the panthers and beat us in the championship then yes, the $30m would have been worth it. if Dak is holding out and we go to the championship then no. The 30m won’t be a regret because we haven’t seen Dak even get there Hypothetical is just wondering what the baseline of 30 million is worth, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WizardHawk Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 (edited) This is incredibly wild, imo. Dalton literally came to Dallas for slightly more than Cooper Rush money, barring an injury to Dak. Quote *One example: Dalton would have to play 50 percent of the snaps over the course of the entire season - regular season and playoffs - to reach his first big bonus, of $1 million. *Another level of partial play-time and playoff success would get him another bonus. *One more level of partial play-time and playoff success would get him an additional bonus. *And finally, to earn the entire $7 million? Andy Dalton would have to play an active role in a Cowboys' Super Bowl win. Edited May 4, 2020 by WizardHawk 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaBoys Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Amazing to me that Dalton could lead us to the NFCC Game and there would still be people complaining we didn’t pay Dak. Then call us delusional or haters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas_OutLaw7 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 8 minutes ago, Calvert28 said: Expectations are playoff expectations. We are good enough to get there h/e with our lack of a legit pass rush or secondary it's all very much up in the air. Agreed. Quote Honestly no. Both Dalton and Dak have been held back because of poor coaching so we have yet to see either make that leap that would put them into great or elite range. Since neither one has shown the ability to put the team on their backs then what evidence do we have that one is that much more valuable then the other when the game is on the line? We have seen both fall short. So no it doesn't change my expectations, but what does change my outlook is 7M vs 35M. If you honestly don't see a difference between Dak and Dalton, that is fine as to why you would view it that way. I don't agree at all. But I can respect you thinking they can produce the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Texas_OutLaw7 said: Agreed. If you honestly don't see a difference between Dak and Dalton, that is fine as to why you would view it that way. I don't agree at all. But I can respect you thinking they can produce the same. All I will say is that we've seen both Joe Flacco and Colin Kaepernick start in the same SB. So I have no doubt we can get there with either Dak or Andy given the right circumstances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas_OutLaw7 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 4 minutes ago, DaBoys said: Amazing to me that Dalton could lead us to the NFCC Game and there would still be people complaining we didn’t pay Dak. Then call us delusional or haters No, that wasn't the point. I am asking what is 30 million worth. You yourself have agreed that Dak is a better QB. Calvert doesn't think so - but you do. Cool. So my question is what is worth the 30 million. If we miss the playoffs, is it worth spending the 30 million to just make it to the WC? Probably not. What about winning the division? Is that worth it? Championship Game? Superbowl? Superbowl win? I think this one is easy for everyone. If you knew better QB play would cement you a victory, Dak could ask for 50 and no one would care. My question is a bright line test. What is 30 million worth to you. This isn't hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas_OutLaw7 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Just now, Calvert28 said: All I will say is that we've seen both Joe Flacco and Colin Kaepernick start in the same SB. So I have no doubt we can get there with either Dak or Andy given the right circumstances. I think Flacco is not fair, he played inspired that year in the playoffs. But yes, we have seen inferior QBs win - like Brad Johnson. I don't think our team is Ravens or Bucs level to carry with an inferior QB, but it is possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Just now, Texas_OutLaw7 said: I think Flacco is not fair, he played inspired that year in the playoffs. But yes, we have seen inferior QBs win - like Brad Johnson. I don't think our team is Ravens or Bucs level to carry with an inferior QB, but it is possible. Had we kept both Quinn and Jones on top of everything else we've done it would have been a strong probability IMO? I would say we could have made the playoffs with Rush if we had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WizardHawk Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Calvert28 said: Had we kept both Quinn and Jones on top of everything else we've done it would have been a strong probability IMO? I would say we could have made the playoffs with Rush if we had. LOL.....come on now. GTFOH with this. LMFAO. I'll show myself out of this thread. Thanks anyway. LOLOLOLOL!!! Edited May 4, 2020 by WizardHawk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas_OutLaw7 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, Calvert28 said: Had we kept both Quinn and Jones on top of everything else we've done it would have been a strong probability IMO? I would say we could have made the playoffs with Rush if we had. If we had kept Jones and Traded for Adams - would have been very nice. Team is very talented. It is one of the reasons I am so excited for the potential. Also one of the reasons I am more inclined to essentially give Dak whatever he wants. I am all in this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAPJ Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 8 minutes ago, Texas_OutLaw7 said: No, that wasn't the point. I am asking what is 30 million worth. You yourself have agreed that Dak is a better QB. Calvert doesn't think so - but you do. Cool. So my question is what is worth the 30 million. If we miss the playoffs, is it worth spending the 30 million to just make it to the WC? Probably not. What about winning the division? Is that worth it? Championship Game? Superbowl? Superbowl win? I think this one is easy for everyone. If you knew better QB play would cement you a victory, Dak could ask for 50 and no one would care. My question is a bright line test. What is 30 million worth to you. This isn't hard. To me it is harder to justify rolling with Dalton now over Dak. If this was at the beginning of the offseason and the outcome could be: Dak Or Dalton, Quinn, Byron Not sure I wouldnt still choose Dak, but the debate would be much, much closer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas_OutLaw7 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Right - but we could have kept Quinn and Byron and signed Dak. That was never the question. They Choose not to keep Jones and Quinn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Just now, WizardHawk said: LOL.....come on now. GTFOH with this. LMFAO. I'm just saying our talent level would be off the ****ing charts. It would warrant an insane amount of hype. Now take a look at that Depth Chart with a do over and tell me that doesn't give you a chubby and wet dreams? Pos No. Player 1 No Player 2 No Player 3 No Player 4 No Player 5 OFFENSE LWR 13 Gallup, Michael 18/3 15 Smith, Devin SF19 85 Brown, Noah 17/7 81 Johnson, Jon'Vea CF19 RWR 19 Cooper, Amari T/Oak 83 Bryant, Ventell CF19 SWR 88 Lamb, CeeDee 20/1 11 Wilson, Cedrick 18/6 14 Jones, Tevin SF19 LT 77 Smith, Tyron 11/1 LG 52 Williams, Connor 18/2 66 McGovern, Connor 19/3 C 73 Looney, Joe U/Ten 63 Biadasz, Tyler 20/4 61 Redmond, Adam W/Buf 62 Henry, Marcus SF19 RG 70 Martin, Zack 14/1 67 Miller, Wyatt P/Cin 78 Wichmann, Cody SF18 RT 71 Collins, La'el CF15 69 Knight, Brandon CF19 65 Hyatt, Mitch CF19 TE 89 Jarwin, Blake CF17 86 Sean McKeon UDFA 80 Schultz, Dalton 18/4 87 Bell, Blake U/KC Hikutini, Cole SF19 QB 4 Prescott, Dak FP 7 Dalton, Andy FA20 5 Thorson, Clayton SF19 1 DiNucci, Ben 20/7 RB 21 Elliott, Ezekiel 16/1 20 Pollard, Tony 19/4 46 Chunn, Jordan CF18 Sewo Olonilua UDFA FB 49 OLAWALE, JAMIZE T/Oak Sewo Olonilua UDFA DEFENSE LDE 90 Lawrence, Demarcus 14/2 56 Jackson, Joe 19/5 51 Anae, Bradlee 20/5 00 SMITH, ALDON SUS LDT 93 MCCOY, GERALD U/Car 79 Gallimore, Neville 20/3 Hill, Trysten 19/2 Garrett Marino UDFA NT 95 Poe, Dontari U/Car 75 Woods, Antwaun SF18 99 Woods, Antwaun SF18 RDE 98 Quinn, Robert 12/3 92 CRAWFORD, TYRONE 12/3 74 Armstrong, Dorance 18/4 94 Gregory, Randy SUS/IND Ron’Dell Carter UDFA SLB 55 Vander Esch, Leighton 18/1 48 Thomas, Joe U/GB Azur Kamara UDFA MLB 54 Smith, Jaylon 16/2 57 Gifford, Luke CF19 WLB 50 LEE, SEAN 10/2 53 March, Justin SF17 LCB 30 Diggs, Trevon 20/2 31 Brown, Anthony 16/6 00 Worley, Daryl U/LV 33 Burton, Deante P/Ind 00 S 25 Awuzie, Chidobe 17/2 Woods, Xavier 17/5 S 27 Clinton-Dix, Ha Ha U/Chi 23 Thompson, Darian P/Arz 37 Wilson, Donovan 19/6 RCB 24 Jones, Byron 17/2 28 Canady, Maurice U/NYJ 41 Robinson II, Reggie 20/4 39 Westry, Chris CF19 29 GOODWIN, CJ P/Dal NB 27 Lewis, Jourdan 17/3 Brown, Anthony 16/6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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