2021 Draft Talk

[byuvike88]

1 minute ago, SemperFeist said:

And neither of them were really franchise QB prospects, either. Yes, Mahomes has developed into one, but a lot had to go right for him to do that. Plus, Mahomes has a physical skill set that really no one else has, and allows him to do things that you can’t expect others to do. And while Watson is a lot of fun to watch, he’s also a QB who doesn’t necessarily play quick enough. That allows us to see his ability to play off schedule, but it also leads to a lot of plays left on the field, and stalled drives. 

 

That $35M salary for 2022 is fully guaranteed on the 3rd day of the 2021 league year. Not many teams are going to be interested in taking on that type of cap hit, and Cousins isn’t going to have much incentive to restructure that amount. 

Smith’s contract didn’t have much guaranteed money left on it, which made it easy for KC to move him, and made it easy for Washington to restructure/extend his contract. 

You can't say he makes Mahomes type throws while criticizing his inability to go through his reads and then say he Mahomes has a skill set no one has. Wilson has made some very Mahomes type throws this year. 

NFL teams who feel they are close to competing for an NFL championship will always be willing to roll the dice on a veteran QB who they feel can take them to the next level. It was a little bit of speculation but Doogie was already talking about the 49ers as a possible destination for him this year. There is a lot of bad QB play in the league right now and that's not too long after it was felt that most teams had their answer at QB.

 

 

[SemperFeist]

20 minutes ago, byuvike88 said:

You can't say he makes Mahomes type throws while criticizing his inability to go through his reads and then say he Mahomes has a skill set no one has. Wilson has made some very Mahomes type throws this year. 

None of those things have to do with one another.

Throwing off platform, throwing off schedule doesn’t have anything to do with going through progressions, or playing quickly. And while Wilson has made some plays that look like something you’d see Mahomes make, Wilson doesn’t have anywhere near the arm talent that Mahomes has. That’s not even a question. 

[SteelKing728]

I'm not a fan of Kyle Trask. Good college QB but I've never been that impressed with him.

I like his playmakers though.

Edited November 8, 2020 by SteelKing728

[vikesfan89]

Is Trevor Lawrence still out with covid? I thought I saw him on the sidelines

[byuvike88]

3 hours ago, SemperFeist said:

None of those things have to do with one another.

Throwing off platform, throwing off schedule doesn’t have anything to do with going through progressions, or playing quickly. And while Wilson has made some plays that look like something you’d see Mahomes make, Wilson doesn’t have anywhere near the arm talent that Mahomes has. That’s not even a question. 

You were criticizing his off platform throws because you said he was slow with his reads. 

You don't have to have Mahomes arm to be a franchise quarterback. Wilson's arm talent is elite. 

Edited November 8, 2020 by byuvike88

[byuvike88]

2 hours ago, vikesfan89 said:

Is Trevor Lawrence still out with covid? I thought I saw him on the sidelines

College rules are a bit different I think. If this was the NFL he would be playing, but I believe he has to pass conditioning tests or something after so many days and he wasn't going to ahve enough time. 

So I believe that he can no longer spread it but isn't cleared to play 

[vikesfan89]

23 minutes ago, byuvike88 said:

College rules are a bit different I think. If this was the NFL he would be playing, but I believe he has to pass conditioning tests or something after so many days and he wasn't going to ahve enough time. 

So I believe that he can no longer spread it but isn't cleared to play 

So he's out of isolation but isn't cleared to play yet?  I figured it was something like that

[Heimdallr]

This backup for Clemson has an ARM

[vikesfan89]

8 hours ago, Heimdallr said:

This backup for Clemson has an ARM

When is going to be eligible for the draft? 

[rf54]

Trask has clearly taken a step forward this year.  I watched the first half of Georgia game and he was dead on!  OVER 300 yards, 4 TD in the first half!  His stock is rising.  He will certainly will be first round, the only question will be does he go 3, 4, or 5?  will he go top 10?  Does he pass Wilson and Lance due to competition and more film?

[JDBrocks]

14 hours ago, SemperFeist said:

And neither of them were really franchise QB prospects, either.

This seems like arguing just to argue. You can be a franchise QB prospect while having flaws. Both of them were definitely franchise QB prospects, especially Watson. So was Lamar Jackson for that matter.

I guess to me a “franchise” QB prospect is a guy that has the potential to elevate the play of your offense for multiple contracts. Is this a guy that can make my offense competitive for the better part of a decade? Can he make other players around him better? Can we win big/high stakes games with him?

it might just be that you also include a very high floor for prospects, which is fine, I just don’t see it that way. 

[rf54]

1 hour ago, vikesfan89 said:

When is going to be eligible for the draft? 

2023

[SemperFeist]

1 hour ago, JDBrocks said:

This seems like arguing just to argue. You can be a franchise QB prospect while having flaws. Both of them were definitely franchise QB prospects, especially Watson. So was Lamar Jackson for that matter.

I guess to me a “franchise” QB prospect is a guy that has the potential to elevate the play of your offense for multiple contracts. Is this a guy that can make my offense competitive for the better part of a decade? Can he make other players around him better? Can we win big/high stakes games with him?

it might just be that you also include a very high floor for prospects, which is fine, I just don’t see it that way. 

Suck for Luck. Lose for Lawrence. Bomb for Burrow. Fail for Fields. These are examples of franchise level QB prospects. Prospects that you’d actually entertain the idea of losing to obtain. Guys who show the potential to develop into special quarterbacks in the NFL, not just good starters. For me a franchise QB is synonymous with an elite quarterback. And unlike so many today, elite is not an adjective that I use to describe the word great, it’s beyond great. Therefore, a franchise QB prospect is an elite prospect. One of the best you’ve ever seen. That’s not Wilson. That’s not Lance. That’s not Trask. They’re good. They’re talented. I’d be thrilled to draft either of the first two. But they don’t stand out as special prospects. 

Edited November 8, 2020 by SemperFeist

[SemperFeist]

2 hours ago, rf54 said:

Trask has clearly taken a step forward this year.  I watched the first half of Georgia game and he was dead on!  OVER 300 yards, 4 TD in the first half!  His stock is rising.  He will certainly will be first round, the only question will be does he go 3, 4, or 5?  will he go top 10?  Does he pass Wilson and Lance due to competition and more film?

Trask is still firmly behind Wilson and Lance, in my opinion. Maybe even behind others. While his production is outstanding, you can still see aspects in his game that don’t bode well for a move to the NFL. Questionable footwork and heavy feet are never a good combination in the NFL. Trask has both, and he doesn’t have the pure arm strength to really make up for it. From the games that I’ve seen this year, while his ball placement has been very good, there are so many passes where you’re sort of just waiting for the ball to get there. He doesn’t have the quickest release, and the ball doesn’t really fly out of his hand. But, Trask has that classic big bodied, tall pocket passer build that get a lot of QBs over drafted, and I think he’ll be another one. 

Watching Trask, to me, is like watching Case Keenum. I see far more “wow” moments from his receivers, than I do from the QB. 

Edited November 8, 2020 by SemperFeist

[JDBrocks]

If you didn’t see the “potential to develop into special quarterbacks” in Watson or Mahomes, then I’m not sure what you were watching. I see a lot of that same “it” factor in Wilson. There’s a ton of bust potential too, for reasons that you pointed out. I just don’t think that means he’s out of the “franchise” QB prospect conversation.

I also think that we have different definitions. I don’t think a franchise QB prospect is an elite or can’t miss player. Guys like Matt Ryan and Matt Stafford are franchise QBs, but certainly aren’t elite players to me, if that helps to clarify my position at all.