The LB/S Hybrid

[Hunter2_1]

This is a very interesting "position", IMO, and I want to know more about them. A few questions;

 

- Does your team use one? If so, who is it and how is he used?

- Will we see more and more players like Isaiah Simmons being picked high to fill this hybrid role?

- What do you think the primary drivers behind this new(ish) need for quick LBs/bigger safeties is?

 

My team (NE) have just used their first pick on what presumably will be used as a LB/S hybrid (although is still too small to be taking on OLs) - we tried using Jordan Richards there a few times, infamously against KC in the season opener. He'd fill a 3rd/4th/5th linebacker spot when Kareem Hunt was in the game, and got torrrhororched! So that was a fail. 

 

Edited May 7, 2020 by Hunter2_1

[SHONUFF]

Plenty of safeties have filled that role every day without having a LB/safety title. It's just something draft analysts throw around because they have to much time on their hands. It's more about the safeties style of play then size and shape, think Taylor mays vs Kam chancellor)

Edited May 7, 2020 by SHONUFF

[SalvadorsDeli]

Chuck Clark fits this bill. We rarely played out of our base defense last year so there were lots of situations - particularly in dime looks - where Chuck played in the box as a linebacker. We would often use 3 safety looks a lot with Chuck playing closer to the line and two deep safeties - Earl Thomas and Brandon Carr. Some of this was by necessity - our ILB core was terrible last year, and Wink's a big believer in 'positionless' football to begin with, so just from the standpoint of getting the best players on the field it made sense to have Clark play as a dime linebacker and make up for the gaps at the actual linebacker position. Clark could make it work because he's a good enough tackler for a safety and picks up TE's well in coverage. Also an effective/intelligent blitzer. Beyond that, Clark also wears the green dot for our defense, so he's often times going to line up closer to the LOS so he can make calls and help get everyone lined up. 

With Queen likely to play a pretty big role in the defense, we may not need to hide our ILB's as much as we did last year, but I'd still expect us to continue using that setup a fair amount - with Jimmy Smith sliding into that hybrid safety/corner role that Carr played last year. It gets more coverage guys on to the field, which is a foundational part of Wink's defense in terms of using a strong secondary and strong coverage schemes to free us up to more aggressively and creatively blitz (we blitzed more than any other team in the league last year and will likely be up there again next season). 

Anyways if you're interested in looking into what that kind of role looks like - this film study on Clark might be a good watch for you @Hunter2_1:

 

 

 

Edited May 7, 2020 by BaltimoreTerp

[Turnobili]

The Raiders just took the best LB/S from Clemson in the draft (Tanner Muse). We'll let you know how that works out.

[SDotNova]

Jamal Adams plays that role for the Jets. Honestly think it’s becoming a premium role. For the Jets, Jamal gets asked to cover TEs, blitz and all kinds of stuff. They matchup well with those quicker TEs. We used to get burned by TEs prior to the last two years.

I think the main driver is TEs becoming Oversized WRs and the spread offense. Slot corners can’t matchup with them. Neither can your traditional SS. Enter the small LB or big safety than can cover, set the edge, blitz etc. and here we are. 

Edited May 7, 2020 by SDotNova

[BleedTheClock]

56 minutes ago, SHONUFF said:

Plenty of safeties have filled that role every day without having a LB/safety title. It's just something draft analysts throw around because they have to much time on their hands. It's more about the safeties style of play then size and shape, think Taylor mays vs Kam chancellor)

Yup. I hate when analysts will say, “_____ is so versatile. He can play safety or linebacker.” 
 

Like Isaiah Simmons. He won’t play any safety in the NFL, unless you count your OLB as a rolled down safety.

 

”Oh he plays nickel corner too.”

....uhh no, he just lined up where the outside linebacker usually lines up on defense in spread formations.

[HoboRocket]

13 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

Yup. I hate when analysts will say, “_____ is so versatile. He can play safety or linebacker.” 
 

Like Isaiah Simmons. He won’t play any safety in the NFL, unless you count your OLB as a rolled down safety.

 

”Oh he plays nickel corner too.”

....uhh no, he just lined up where the outside linebacker usually lines up on defense in spread formations.

Exactly. 

Look, there are two major contemporary examples of a true LB/S hybrid (also called the moneyback): Mark Barron and Deone Bucannon. Both are roles on a Gregg Williams, James Bettcher, or Todd Bowles defense. Those are coaches that actually use that type of role where you have a literal LB/S hybrid on the football field. In most other cases, people are imagining a role where there isn't one. Those cases are more about the player than the actual role, I.E. Kam Chancellor on the Seahawks or Troy Polamalu on the Steelers.

Isaiah Simmons isn't being used as an OLB, by the way. He's playing ILB, according to Vance Joseph. So very similar to the Haason Reddick situation, except Simmons is both more athletic and more refined than Reddick. I like Reddick as the third OLB in the rotation behind Chandler Jones and Devon Kennard.

Gregg Williams IS using Jamal Adams as a moneybacker, just as he used Jabrill Peppers in Cleveland or Mark Barron in LA/St Louis.

Edited May 7, 2020 by HoboRocket

[BleedTheClock]

1 minute ago, HoboRocket said:

Isaiah Simmons isn't being used as an OLB, by the way. He's playing ILB, according to Vance Joseph. So very similar to the Haason Reddick situation, except Simmons is both more athletic and more refined than Reddick. I like Reddick as the third OLB in the rotation behind Chandler Jones and Devon Kennard.

Yeah I know. Arizona runs a 3-4. He has no other place to play but inside. Or outside linebacker in their nickel 4-man front package. But he’s a true linebacker, not some godly hybrid

[HoboRocket]

2 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

Yeah I know. Arizona runs a 3-4. He has no other place to play but inside. Or outside linebacker in their nickel 4-man front package. But he’s a true linebacker, not some godly hybrid

Right. Otherwise I'm sure that Arizona, a team that has a history of using the moneybacker a lot, would label him a such. His size is the size of a linebacker, not a big safety. I was worried about him being a tweener, but once the Combine happened... he's just an unreal linebacker with his athleticism. Yes, he might have the athleticism to PLAY safety or nickel corner, if you're just going off of test times, but he's literally an off-ball linebacker. A faster Roquan Smith more than the second coming of Chancellor.

[vikingsrule]

The past few years Jayron Kearse has played LB, S, CB, “big nickel”, I guess you can call it whatever you want. It all seems like the same role at the end of the day. He didn’t play much but there were packages for him.

[Hunter2_1]

1 hour ago, BaltimoreTerp said:

Chuck Clark fits this bill. We rarely played out of our base defense last year so there were lots of situations - particularly in dime looks - where Chuck played in the box as a linebacker. We would often use 3 safety looks a lot with Chuck playing closer to the line and two deep safeties - Earl Thomas and Brandon Carr. Some of this was by necessity - our ILB core was terrible last year, and Wink's a big believer in 'positionless' football to begin with, so just from the standpoint of getting the best players on the field it made sense to have Clark play as a dime linebacker and make up for the gaps at the actual linebacker position. Clark could make it work because he's a good enough tackler for a safety and picks up TE's well in coverage. Also an effective/intelligent blitzer. Beyond that, Clark also wears the green dot for our defense, so he's often times going to line up closer to the LOS so he can make calls and help get everyone lined up. 

With Queen likely to play a pretty big role in the defense, we may not need to hide our ILB's as much as we did last year, but I'd still expect us to continue using that setup a fair amount - with Jimmy Smith sliding into that hybrid safety/corner role that Carr played last year. It gets more coverage guys on to the field, which is a foundational part of Wink's defense in terms of using a strong secondary and strong coverage schemes to free us up to more aggressively and creatively blitz (we blitzed more than any other team in the league last year and will likely be up there again next season). 

Anyways if you're interested in looking into what that kind of role looks like - this film study on Clark might be a good watch for you @Hunter2_1:

 

 

 

Thanks Terp, will take a look!