Who's the MJ of Football?

[DannyB]

1 hour ago, thebestever6 said:

I think Peyton is easily on Jordans level.

Off the field he's probably the only 21st century NFL player that comes even remotely close.

On the field? Not even the same solar system. Peyton Manning was dangerously close to being one of the game's all-time losers.

[DannyB]

38 minutes ago, Plat2 said:

Hell no, Brady over Manning easily and Brady isn't even on Jordan's level.

I'll say this: As a competitor, and as a winner, I'll put Brady RIGHT with Jordan. I'm talking even, not almost close. It is WAY harder to consistently win in football as a quarterback. I don't care who your coach and surrounding talent are. In basketball, one single player has WAY more control over the outcome of a game, even with QBs being the single most important player on the field.

Brady has won 6, more than any other quarterback, with COMPLETELY different surrounding casts on the field. He has also been to three more Super Bowls, which contrary to popular opinion, is a GOOD THING. In fact, losing a Super Bowl is the second best accomplishment, besides winning it, and will never be worse than losing in the playoffs or losing so much you don't even make the playoffs.

Brady's drive to consistently reinvent himself and stay on top of the game is nothing short of awe-inspiring. Tom Brady has such an amazing career, that it could be split up into two careers that would be first ballot Hall of Fame locks, independently. You could make the argument that Tom Brady is more of a winner than Michael Jordan.

[AngusMcFife]

13 minutes ago, DannyB said:

I'll say this: As a competitor, and as a winner, I'll put Brady RIGHT with Jordan. I'm talking even, not almost close. It is WAY harder to consistently win in football as a quarterback. I don't care who your coach and surrounding talent are. In basketball, one single player has WAY more control over the outcome of a game, even with QBs being the single most important player on the field.

Brady has won 6, more than any other quarterback, with COMPLETELY different surrounding casts on the field. He has also been to three more Super Bowls, which contrary to popular opinion, is a GOOD THING. In fact, losing a Super Bowl is the second best accomplishment, besides winning it, and will never be worse than losing in the playoffs or losing so much you don't even make the playoffs.

Brady's drive to consistently reinvent himself and stay on top of the game is nothing short of awe-inspiring. Tom Brady has such an amazing career, that it could be split up into two careers that would be first ballot Hall of Fame locks, independently. You could make the argument that Tom Brady is more of a winner than Michael Jordan.

Brady was carried to his first 3 championships by Belichick's defense, whereas Jordan carried the team for every championship. Big difference. Brady also did nothing but got a W against the Rams.  

Brady's only Jordanesque post-season performances were the Falcons and Seahawks Super Bowls. 

[DannyB]

32 minutes ago, AngusMcFife said:

Brady was carried to his first 3 championships by Belichick's defense, whereas Jordan carried the team for every championship. Big difference. Brady also did nothing but got a W against the Rams.  

Brady's only Jordanesque post-season performances were the Falcons and Seahawks Super Bowls. 

Brady was carried against the Panthers when he put up 350 yards of passing and 3 TDs in a game they won by 3? Hokey dokey.

Look, the sports are entirely different. There is no way to really do an apples to apples comparison. But as far as that killer mentality, that will to win, the constant drive to prove you're the best, in my mind that's as much Brady as it is Jordan. And I LOVED Jordan, I'm right in that sweet spot where he WAS my childhood, with all the nostalgia-infused perception that comes with it.

[AngusMcFife]

1 hour ago, DannyB said:

Brady was carried against the Panthers when he put up 350 yards of passing and 3 TDs in a game they won by 3? Hokey dokey.

Look, the sports are entirely different. There is no way to really do an apples to apples comparison. But as far as that killer mentality, that will to win, the constant drive to prove you're the best, in my mind that's as much Brady as it is Jordan. And I LOVED Jordan, I'm right in that sweet spot where he WAS my childhood, with all the nostalgia-infused perception that comes with it.

Yes Brady was good vs Carolina, but to get there:

17-14 win vs TEN, 21/41 for 201 yards, 1TD
24-14 win vs IND, 22/37 for 237 yards, 1TD/1INT

What distinguishes Jordan is his insane playoff performances, he average 35pp in the playoffs for 8 straight years. Tom Brady had a good playoff game every now and again, but overall his numbers in the postseason just aren't that good. His coach basically gifted him 4 super bowls, he earned the other two. Overall his playoff performances are meh. Flacco has much better career numbers, for example. 

Jordan was the driving force and earned all 6 of his titles. He dominated game after game in the playoffs, always the best player on the floor.  

 

[thebestever6]

I was a kid back then but if we're talking about playoffs Steve McNair gave me the same type of feeling's Jordan did. I know he didn't dominate like Jordan but there was something magical about him on offense I remember a no blood no guts no glory sign his wife was holding up. Him running over linebackers on the postseason or the Rams game where Vermeil was having a heart attack that last drive. 

When you get ultimate competitors like that in big games it just makes them shine.

[thebestever6]

This is a serious question can there be a Jordan of college football or not enough longevity???

Tim Tebow? What was he won the hesiman as a sophomore had 30 passing TDS and 20rushing tds had a lomnnnnnnnnggggg wikepedia page for doing nothing as a pro yet lol. He seemed dominant in college transcends the game I mean espn had a two hr documentary on his throwing motion lol.

Then he shows flashes as a pro but honestly seemed too big for the game for a team to truly develop in my opinion. I know I'm going to get quoted saying he can't throw lol whatever.

Also what was Vince Young? For a short time he truly seemed invincible lol. NFL rookie of the year. Was electric against a Matt Leinert Reggie Bush led powerhouse Trogan team that was my favorite college football game ever lol.

[seminoles1]

3 hours ago, AngusMcFife said:

Brady was carried to his first 3 championships by Belichick's defense, whereas Jordan carried the team for every championship. Big difference. Brady also did nothing but got a W against the Rams.  

Brady's only Jordanesque post-season performances were the Falcons and Seahawks Super Bowls. 

"Jordan carried the team for every championship". Okay then.

[Plat2]

4 hours ago, DannyB said:

In basketball, one single player has WAY more control over the outcome of a game, even with QBs being the single most important player on the field.

Isn't this a plus for MJ though? I agree that Brady as a winner and as a competitor is right there with Jordan, theres no denying that but in terms of direct influence on a game its not even a question. Jordan played both sides of the ball and was elite at both. Perfect example was before "the shot" over Bryon Russell to seal his last championship, he stole the ball from Malone down by one with like 20 seconds left.

You could have a QB that regularly throws for 5,000 yards, 50 TDs and 5 INTs a year but he still plays on one side of the ball, he still has less control on the outcome of a game than an elite basketball player does, it's just the nature of the two sports. 

[DannyB]

5 hours ago, AngusMcFife said:

Yes Brady was good vs Carolina, but to get there:

17-14 win vs TEN, 21/41 for 201 yards, 1TD
24-14 win vs IND, 22/37 for 237 yards, 1TD/1INT

What distinguishes Jordan is his insane playoff performances, he average 35pp in the playoffs for 8 straight years. Tom Brady had a good playoff game every now and again, but overall his numbers in the postseason just aren't that good. His coach basically gifted him 4 super bowls, he earned the other two. Overall his playoff performances are meh. Flacco has much better career numbers, for example. 

Jordan was the driving force and earned all 6 of his titles. He dominated game after game in the playoffs, always the best player on the floor.  

 

But again, the games are just WAY too different to compare like that. Of course Jordan did that. He's the greatest basketball player ever, and was insanely driven. I'm certainly not taking anything away from him. But it's basketball, and the best player can dictate the game to a a MUCH greater degree than a football player.

[DannyB]

3 hours ago, Plat2 said:

Isn't this a plus for MJ though? I agree that Brady as a winner and as a competitor is right there with Jordan, theres no denying that but in terms of direct influence on a game its not even a question. Jordan played both sides of the ball and was elite at both. Perfect example was before "the shot" over Bryon Russell to seal his last championship, he stole the ball from Malone down by one with like 20 seconds left.

You could have a QB that regularly throws for 5,000 yards, 50 TDs and 5 INTs a year but he still plays on one side of the ball, he still has less control on the outcome of a game than an elite basketball player does, it's just the nature of the two sports. 

Yes, but my point is that players with equal "drive", "determination", "will to win", "compete level", or whatever nebulous term you want to use to describe what separates the true Greatest of the Greats from bevy of other elite-level apex athletes and competitors that they play against...can still only affect the game to a limited degree based on their sport. I'm not going to give extra credit, OR penalize, either Jordan or Brady due to the nature of their sport.

I'm saying I think they're equal, and when you get the GOAT in basketball, you see a guy who, once he matured into his game and had a decent enough team around him, was able to seemingly will his team to win after win, championship after championship, while performing at an elite level. And in football, you get a guy who, despite it being a team sport, and having a fully rotating cast of teammates around him, won at an unprecedented level, from the beginning of his career, to the end, all while working his *** off to adapt and get better as the game changed around him. And was able to stay great pretty much every year from beginning to end. And in the end he won as many championships as Jordan, in a sport that, quite frankly, is harder for a singular great player to win.

In my mind they occupy the same platform as the greatest winners in American team sports.

[Plat2]

21 minutes ago, DannyB said:

Yes, but my point is that players with equal "drive", "determination", "will to win", "compete level", or whatever nebulous term you want to use to describe what separates the true Greatest of the Greats from bevy of other elite-level apex athletes and competitors that they play against...can still only affect the game to a limited degree based on their sport. I'm not going to give extra credit, OR penalize, either Jordan or Brady due to the nature of their sport.

I'm saying I think they're equal, and when you get the GOAT in basketball, you see a guy who, once he matured into his game and had a decent enough team around him, was able to seemingly will his team to win after win, championship after championship, while performing at an elite level. And in football, you get a guy who, despite it being a team sport, and having a fully rotating cast of teammates around him, won at an unprecedented level, from the beginning of his career, to the end, all while working his *** off to adapt and get better as the game changed around him. And was able to stay great pretty much every year from beginning to end. And in the end he won as many championships as Jordan, in a sport that, quite frankly, is harder for a singular great player to win.

In my mind they occupy the same platform as the greatest winners in American team sports.

They are definitely on the same tier when it comes to winning and they have same maniacal competitive drive but I'd argue that MJ had more of an imprint on his 6 championships than Brady has on his 6. Its harder to win in football but a player will have less of an impact compared to basketball, football is alot more team oriented than basketball is.

Edited May 24, 2020 by Plat2

[DannyB]

12 minutes ago, Plat2 said:

They are definitely on the same tier when it comes to winning and they have same maniacal competitive drive but I'd argue that MJ had more of an imprint on his 6 championships than Brady has on his 6. Its harder to win in football but a player will have less of an impact compared to basketball, football is alot more team oriented than basketball is.

Yeah I would agree Jordan had a bigger imprint, but that's just the nature of the game, like you're saying. So I'm not going to take imaginary points away from Brady for that. A tennis player has even more part in whether they win a grand slam event or not, since...it's just them. Doesn't mean I would classify Federer or Djokovic has better winners or better competitors or whatever, than Jordan.

I'm not really even sure what's being debated here, it seems like you're in agreement with me. I think what Brady has accomplished is just as impressive as Jordan.

My whole point, relating it back to what the thread was asking, is that I think Brady is the comp to MJ when it comes to on-field domination and accomplishment. It's the off-field worldwide cultural impact that Brady can't touch Jordan on.

[Chiefer]

On 5/22/2020 at 11:17 AM, DannyB said:

I heard that they were planning on moving forward with a Muppets Meet Football crossover with Mahomes in the Jordan role, but test audiences couldn't tell the difference Patrick and some of the other voices so they axed it.

He’s already got the cartoon voice, see it’s perfect.

[DannyB]

5 minutes ago, Chiefer said:

He’s already got the cartoon voice, see it’s perfect.

Yeah but see, these things usually work best when children can easily tell which characters are the humans, and which are the fun little animated monster-people.